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Thread: Night vision vs PEQ?

  1. #11
    Expert

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    I was in the Marines for 16 years, 14 as forward combat Marine, I now 17 miles from the nearest town and don't have commercial grid electricity. I use a lot of night vision to keep the place secure.

    1. Multi role function.
    In the Marines we had 3 different NV roles,
    Hand held for watch/area coverage,
    Helmet or headgear mounted for movement/navigation,
    Weapons mount for night combat operations contact.

    Open view, or reticule for weapons mount was the big difference, along with size and mount type.
    I suggest a common mount, like picatinny rail mount, and a unit that will work with a other optic that has your aim point/reticule.
    That way it can be hand held, head mounted or weapons mounted.
    No sense in buying 2 or 3 different types now that intensifiers can be mounted behind a 'Red Dot' (sight/reticule) AND used hand held or headgear mounted.

    2. Common batteries!
    It's a HUGE pain in the butt to carry 2 or 3 types of batteries.
    My 'Red Dot', NVD use AA size batteries, which allows me to use rechargeables.
    A small solar charger on top of my pack or roof of vehicle keeps me in charged batteries, or I can use common disposable commercial batteries.
    Those 'Button Cells' are expensive, and in my experience they just don't live as long.

    3. Common 'O' ring seals, silicone grease.
    Greasing the battery compartment 'O' ring keeps it from getting scratched/gouged, and the grease helps keep a seal when the ring has small damage.
    I would get some extra 'O' rings and use food grade silicone grease (cheap), it's easy to clean, dielectric so it doesn't short out electronics, and the 'O' rings last a LOT longer when they aren't allowed to get scratched/dried out.
    A lip balm container will last years...

    Flip up caps or rubber eye boots on the rear so you don't have 'Green Face' when you are using the optic.
    A small hole in the cap to look around when NOT engaged, or a boot that seals up around your eye.
    Anyone else with NV looking and you stand out like an airport beacon with 'Green Face', and should you need full field of vision a cap is simple to flip up.

    Anytime you are looking with NV, you MUST assume someone else is looking back at you,
    Green Face can be seen easily with the naked eye with well adjusted natural night vision...
    And if the other guy has an intensifier, you look like a airplane landing light!

    4. Hard Case.
    Tube, can, box, doesn't matter, but get a soft lined hard case.
    NV spends most of its life NOT being used, and they aren't exactly 'Field Frendly', so protect them.
    Most of our fails were being beat in an ammo pouch, attached to a rifle when not being used (the reason for quick mounts, protect it when not being used) or just plain forget it's in a pack or whatever and getting pounded.

    5. Start out about 35,000◊ (times) light amplification, and go up to what you can afford that fits in the above specifications.
    A well adjusted night vision in the human eye will increase night vision about 20,000◊,
    BUT, that goes out the window at the first flash of artificial light (head lights, night lights, flash lights, muzzle flash, etc).
    NVD keeps you seeing AFTER your natural night vision goes.

    Anything under about 35,000◊ amplifier tube, and it will not do you a whole lot of good...
    Flash kill technology built in (not the filter flash kill used on day optics) is a HUGE advantage, some NVDs don't have flash kill.

    DO NOT use common sighting lasers/lights with NVDs, it will damage the screens in the intensifier tubes.
    Infrared filters on common lights, specific made lasers that won't damage night vision are fine.

    6. There is a way to GREATLY extend the range of an NVD that's cheap & easy with common parts, provided you are using it in a common area that you normally control.
    It's simply common batteries and dirt cheap infrared (IR) LEDs.
    Set stakes or hang on what's available, they will throw IR light well beyond the normal range of NVD and light things up so you can see them.
    I can crank these out for less than $2 each, and if you start with the 'solar yard lights' ($5 from China) they have rechargable batteries, switch themselves off in daylight, recharge, and switch themselves automatically at night.
    Really handy for area observation, and in particular, hog hunting!
    With a switch to IR LEDs the hogs/humans can't see the light, but it shows them up like it's daytime (for cheap).

    Experience, take it for what it's worth.
    Last edited by JeepHammer; 09-04-2020 at 09:57.

  2. #12
    Sharpshooter sheepdog697's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by rooster View Post
    Kinda of a thread jack but Iím looking hard at the sionyx aurora system if i can find someone who has a helmet mount. Itís not perfect but for under 1k to have pretty legit night vision.

    anyone ever use one?
    https://www.sionyx.com/?gclid=CjwKCA...RoCbd0QAvD_BwE
    theres about a 50 page thread on ar15.com answering this exact question.

  3. #13
    Sharpshooter sheepdog697's Avatar

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    Heres a copy of a post I put in another one of these threads a few months ago.

    Strictly hunting I would suggest thermal. But youíre going to pay to play with these . My buddy has a trijicon snipe IR which is very nice. The Halo nvision thermals seem to be top of the line, although Iíve never seen them in person. Iíve heard good things about the hogster too. Whatís ur budget? Do you want dedicated thermal?(optic is a thermal only with internal reticle) or would you like a clip on which goes in front of a day optic? Clip ons are nice because you can scan without flagging everything with your rifle, then clip it onto your optic when you have found a target. The trijicon sniper IR does both actually. We almost always use it in clip on mode and it works great. Picture is high quality and you can even record your hunts.

    If you want to be able to anything with movement or navigation in the dark, youíre going to want head mounted night vision, preferably analog instead of digital. As others have stated gen 3, however some gen 2+ night vision is very serviceable. For a monocular the pvs14 is basically the entry level ďglockĒ of the night vision world. Just about everybody builds them and a decent one can be had for about 1800-2500 all the way up to $4k+ with high end tubes(L3 unfilmed). You can also go the dual night vision route with something like an anvis9, rnvg, dtnvg, pvs15/31, etc etc. These units range from $4k -$10k plus again depending on the types of tubes you have installed. Dual is better if you want to do dynamic movements, and I prefer two eyes under night vision than one in almost every aspect. Youíll need either a scull cap or a helmet with a good mount. You could get it done for about $300 for an air soft bump helmet and a rhino mount, and counterweight setup. With a head mounted unit you can go passive and look through a NV capable optic like an eotech(which is much cleaner than you would think). You can also use a weapon mounted IR laser which is the preferable method in most cases. Serviceable IR lasers that can be mounted start at about $200 all they way up to $3k+. If you only have a weapon mounted night vision unit, everything you look at is essentially flagged with your rifle. Clip on night vision devices like a pvs 27 or pvs 30 have great capabilities out to distance at night if you want to just do long range night shooting. These clip in front of your day scope.

    If you can give a little more information on what you would like to do with it and what your budget is, Iím sure some of us in here can give you good information.

    ALSO, google TNVC and give them a call. They are probably the number 1 commercial night vision supplier. Their customer service is top notch and they could square you away with anything you want to know much better than most people can. Check out some of their YouTube videos as well. They can give you an idea about the difference styles of night vision.


    buy once cry once is very true with night vision. You will definitely get what you pay for. Be careful who you buy from there are a bunch of companies that sprung up overnight that are building units and cutting corners.

    I sold off quite a few guns and optics to get a good setup. It was definitely worth it from my experience.

  4. #14
    Sharpshooter sheepdog697's Avatar

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    Couple other things I’d add to some of the other posts. Passive shooting is an extremely viable option. A nice NV compatible red dot on a handgun or a NV compatible optic on a riser(for long gun) work great. I will say it is much easier with duals than with a single mono. Enough training and it’s just fine with a mono...

    Most IR illuminators on civilian legal lasers are pretty useless after 100yds. Some exceptions would be the dbal D2( led based illuminator vs laser) or the mawl C1+. When it comes to Ir illuminators you need to think about their potential to pass through photonic barriers. (Street lights, house lights, etc). They are also needed for positive identification, not just identification of a potential target. Most of the aiming lasers on the civilian stuff is fine. They will be around .7mW and will get you out farther than you will be able to positively identify what you are shooting at. If you don’t mind size, the Dbal D2 is really a good option. People will talk about the IR signatures from the D2 since it’s a LED based illuminator. There was a great test done by jwramp( a professional photographer). He took pictures of just about every available LAM on the market to show what their visible signature was (even in IR the lasers and LEDs can put it a faint red glow visible to the naked eye). At the end of the day the D2 wasn’t much worse than some of the IR laser illuminators even the mawl.

    Here’s a good test to see if night vision is for you....

    Step 1:
    Take put a fresh $100 bill and hold it in your hand.

    Step 2:
    Take out a lighter.

    Step 3:
    Light said $100 bill on fire.

    Did that bother you? If not,...night vision could be for you!

  5. #15
    Plinker

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    Well said 👏

  6. #16
    Sharpshooter Lee11b's Avatar

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    Always enjoy your info, JeepHammer!!!! 11b, men's dept. of the Army, here. Like your comment about the silicone grease and the Infared filters to be used with lasers. Also setting the solar yard lights out at known distances. Keep up the posts!!!

  7. #17
    Sharpshooter Lee11b's Avatar

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    sheepdog697, also enjoy your info. Got to play with PVS-14s in combat for a year. and your right about the $100 dollar bill theory.... Webster's is changing the spelling of BOAT to BOATT.....

    Bust Out Another TEN THOUSAND!!!!!....lol I've got a single friend, who bought a lower priced ATN thermal.....your right on getting what you paid for!!!!

  8. #18
    Marksman Karl-just-Karl's Avatar

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    I'll second the call to TNVC. They were happy to help me spend lots of money! I mean, guide me through the purchasing process.

    Their customer service was great too when I had some issues with an illuminator.

  9. #19
    Expert hANNAbONE's Avatar

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    I wouldn't go with NV...only Thermal.

    ID much much easier
    hANNAbONE -- Uncle Gary, Deacon

  10. #20
    Sharpshooter sheepdog697's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by hANNAbONE View Post
    I wouldn't go with NV...only Thermal.

    ID much much easier

    If your main purpose is hunting from a static position,...maybe.

    I have access to dual thermals that are head mounted. While they are cool, and detection is much better, a fusion setup (one eye under nods and one under thermal) is better. Its not as easy to move with the thermal as it is the night vision. Even a handheld thermal with night vision for movement and shooting would be superior to strictly thermal.

    If you want to hunt humans at some point,you will want analog. Look at the best "human" hunters our military produces. They run dual analog night vision for the majority of their work in the dark. Anything with dynamic movements and you will see them utilizing nods over thermal.

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