223 Small Base Dies Necessary?

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • indygunguy

    Expert
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    110   0   0
    Dec 12, 2010
    1,338
    48
    NE Side of Indy
    I'm an experienced handgun reloader but am just getting into 223 for the first time. I have a set of Lee 223 dies; its the 3 die set that includes the factory crimp die, and thought I was all set. Then I see that RCBS makes small base dies, AR dies, etc... all for the 223.

    So my question is... Are my Lee dies going to work for loading 223 in my AR or do I actually need a set of RCBS' specialty stuff? Some stuff I read says the small base dies are only for match grade chambers, and other stuff says ALL ARs need small base dies... which is it?


    Thanks for the help!

    :popcorn:
     

    nova512

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Jan 5, 2009
    776
    28
    west side of indy
    if your shooting semi auto small base dies are the way just found that out with my ar ,bolt you dont need to,, also had a problem with my m1a. full length rifle dies just wasnt doing it purchased the short base dies every single round cycles correcly now. short base dies resize the whole casing down to the groove ,full length dies do not.
     

    BE Mike

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    18   0   0
    Jul 23, 2008
    7,536
    113
    New Albany
    If you aren't shooting your brass out of different guns and don't have a gun with a match chamber, there is a good chance that your Lee dies will work. You'll just have to try them and see. As someone who did as you (going from handgun reloading to rifle) I recommend that you do all of your brass prep, including trimming, for your rifle reloads.
     

    Leo

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    30   0   0
    Mar 3, 2011
    9,733
    113
    Lafayette, IN
    I have had six or 7 AR rifles and probably a total of 15 different barrels, most of them custom ordered match chambers. The Lee Full length sizer die did fine. Redding makes a custom shell holder set that lets you pick how far back you set the shoulder with standard dies. Each one gets .002" thinner so the die can slide down a little further. I only needed that on one chamber that was custom made to my specs, (and I had to custom order a chamber and a finish reamer to get that barrel made). Follow the instructions and do not assume you have a problem. You will probably never see any issue. Good Luck
     

    bigedp51

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Apr 30, 2011
    149
    18
    I have been reloading for over 40 years and never used a small base die, used incorrectly a small base die will increase chances of case head separations from over resizing the base of the case.

    As a rule of thumb the majority of Full Length dies will over resize your cases and push the shoulder back too far. Use standard dies unless you have positive proof the base web area of your cases are too large. (American made cases are nortorious for being undersized at the base)

    7-17-201054345PM.jpg


    7-17-201054719PM.jpg


    The .223 cases below have never seen a small base die. ;)

    IMGP6526.jpg
     

    45fan

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Apr 20, 2011
    2,388
    48
    East central IN
    I have been loading with the lee 3 die set for my AR, and have yet to have an issue with feeding. I have had issues with my CETME though, and have found the small base dies to be beneficial.

    If you want to use the small base die, go for it, it cant hurt, but the ones you already have should do you just fine.
     

    jsn_mooney

    Marksman
    Rating - 100%
    47   0   0
    Nov 3, 2008
    284
    34
    South Of Richmond
    I think it depends on what the brass was fired in before you re-size it. I now use them initially on all once-fired military brass I buy. I have had some issues in the past with cases sticking that dissapeared once I started using my SB dies for the first re-size.
    The only thing I can figure is maybe I got some ran through a SAW or something that fires from an open bolt and that swelled the bases a little, sloppy chamber??? Maybe somebody who knows more about this can explain it to both of us.
    Once I've ran them through one of my guns I just re-size them with my regular dies.
     

    red_zr24x4

    UA#190
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Mar 14, 2009
    28,792
    113
    Walkerton
    Never used small base dies for my AR, Garand or M1a. Just make sure you adjust the dies to bump the shoulder back and your good to go.
     

    AllenM

    Diamond Collision Inc. Avon.
    Industry Partner
    Rating - 100%
    132   0   0
    Apr 20, 2008
    10,387
    113
    Avon
    I have loaded a lot of 223 for my AR's with standard RCBS dies. never had an issue
     

    Spike_351

    Expert
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 19, 2012
    1,112
    38
    Scott County
    I believe the firearm it's fired through plays a big part as well. I have an issue where my cheapo ATI 223. Upper will not feed my loads correctly and will not let my bolt close completely, however my friends S&W-15 fires them with no issues and fairly good results....I've come to conclusion my upper is junk.
     

    Sniper 79

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Oct 7, 2012
    2,939
    48
    I've had two AR rifles and only used the Lee standard dies along with a touch on factory crimp. No problems and it was great shooting ammo.

    I sold the Lee's equipment and am upgrading to Dillon. I did have a lot of stuck cases in the Lee sizing die. I see Dillon uses a carbide expander ball. I'm in!
     

    indygunguy

    Expert
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    110   0   0
    Dec 12, 2010
    1,338
    48
    NE Side of Indy
    Wow, we've revived a 7.5 year old post, and I was the OP.

    Just to follow up, in the last 7.5 years, I've loaded and shot THOUSANDS of 223's through AR's with standard Lee dies and never had an issue whatsoever. In my experience, small base dies are not necessary.
     
    Last edited:

    2in1evtime

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 98.4%
    61   1   0
    Oct 30, 2011
    3,444
    113
    retired-midwest
    I haven't had any issues with .223 and lee dies, but i use a small base in 308 with military brass on first reload, this is usually lc brass and from military once fired. have had a few stuck cases in chamber until i went to small base die.
     
    Top Bottom