Bad Sizing Die?

[dross]

I have a single shot rifle - Handi rifle - rechambered from 357 Max, to 358 Winchester. I shot it for the first time yesterday. I shot 5 times no problems, then I couldn't get a round to completely chamber. Inspecting the chamber showed no visible problems.

Upon further experimentation, I discovered that if I rotate the round, every round will fully chamber and every round will refuse to chamber, depending on how it is rotated.

I don't have any factory ammo to check it with, I loaded all rounds myself with a set of dies I've never used before.

Has anyone heard of this? Right now it could be the chamber or it could be the sizing die. I think my next move is to buy a box of rare and expensive 358 ammo and see if I have the same problem. Any other thoughts? In the meantime would I be hurting anything if I marked the rounds at the rotation spot they will chamber and continue to shoot the rifle?

 

[fireball168]

Assuming your formed your brass from 308 or the like, take one of your loaded cartridges and roll it across a flat surface to see how banana shaped the case & neck are. This doesn't necessarily condemn your die.

Do the same with one of your fired pieces of brass, note the difference.

Rechambering a 357 to 358 Winchester is a poor choice, the .346/.357" bore/groove diameters aren't well liked by heavier constructed 358 projectiles, watch yourself.

 

[UncleNorby]

Did you start with 358 Win brass, or did you form from another case?

Was the handle of the press "camming over" when you sized the cases? I recently had an issue with my 358 Hoosier cases formed from 358 Win brass. Could not get the new shoulder set back far enough. Was able to cure by switching shell holders from a Lyman to a RCBS #3. The point is, make sure you are getting the case far enough into the die. The problem is more likely to be something else, but it's worth checking.

I'm wondering why rotating the cartridge makes a difference in closing the action. I could understand this if the cartridge AND the chamber were out of whack, but if the chamber is concentric, wouldn't the problem be there no matter how the cartridge is rotated?

Good advice in the post above regarding bore size. I'm not an expert, but if you do see signs of excessive pressure, perhaps there is a 357 bullet that you could use?

 

[dross]

Update:

I ordered some factory ammo and it came in today. The factory ammo inserts no problem, regardless of how it's rotated. So, again, it points to the die, but I do understand what UncleNorby said above about the chamber and die having to match for the rotation to matter.

BTW, I rolled the ammo and it does seem to be a little off center.

As to the diameter issue with reboring, I had heard that it had been done quite a bit successfully, so I'm surprised to hear there might be pressure issues, I didn't run into any info on that when I was researching it. The guy who rechamberd it said that he'd done a bunch, and including some for the 35 Whelen, which is higher presssures still. The barrel is custom originally chambered in 357 Max, and I know they were using 358 bullets, but of course at lower pressures. What exactly should I watch for other than blown primers?

 

[Broom_jm]

Plenty of H&R 357 Mag barrels have been rechambered to more powerful 35 caliber rounds. (The 358 Win and 35 Whelen run at the same basic pressure.)

My concern with these conversions is that you start with a barrel that has a 1:14 or maybe even 1:16 twist. This is fairly slow and can present issues with accuracy when using heavier 35-caliber bullets. I had a 357 Mag barrel rechambered to 358GNR and it won't stabilize the 200gr FTX bullets. Maybe a faster velocity would, but the most important factor in bullet stabilization is the combination of bullet length and the barrel's rate-of-twist.

The original sizing issue is likely a case of not having the die down far enough.

 

[dross]

Plenty of H&R 357 Mag barrels have been rechambered to more powerful 35 caliber rounds. (The 358 Win and 35 Whelen run at the same basic pressure.)

My concern with these conversions is that you start with a barrel that has a 1:14 or maybe even 1:16 twist. This is fairly slow and can present issues with accuracy when using heavier 35-caliber bullets. I had a 357 Mag barrel rechambered to 358GNR and it won't stabilize the 200gr FTX bullets. Maybe a faster velocity would, but the most important factor in bullet stabilization is the combination of bullet length and the barrel's rate-of-twist.

The original sizing issue is likely a case of not having the die down far enough.

This barrel is a 1/14 twist, which is one of the traditional twist rates for the 358 win. It's supposed to stabilize up to 225 grain bullets and may in some rifles stabilize the 250s, I'm told. Although it's possible that we're talking about round nosed bullets, as the 358 has traditionally been a lever gun cartridge, and a round nose bullet would be shorter for a given weight, so maybe the slower twist rates won't work as well with the spitzers. I'll let you know. Now the plan is to see what happens with this commercial ammo. I assume that if I fire it and the brass will still insert in any direction, it's not an issue with my chamber. I think you might be right, I may not have set up my sizing die correctly. Operator error is usually the case, and I'm very far from being an experienced handloader.

 

[Broom_jm]

Something you'll want to try is chambering resized brass before seating a new bullet. If the action won't close on a case you just resized, you need to adjust your process or look for other problems.

Now, if you find that just resized cases chamber fine, but they don't chamber right after seating the bullet, odds are very high you are bulging the shoulder area with a too-aggressive crimping operation.

 

[x10]

I had a very similar problem with 35 rem contender, My reloads were not sized all the way down at the base of the case and the last 1/32 of inch case causing the problems and eventually it bent my extractor

tighten the sizing die down to the shell holder and also take your shell holder to your knife sharpening stone and take the top of you shell holder down and get your sizing die down a little lower on the case.

Of course can't say for sure but sure sounds like my problem from years back