The lowly 380 and why I don't care for larger caliber compacts.

[bigretic]

When does a .380 beat a 9mm? - Personal Defense Network

Got this via email from NRA last night and thought was well put together. Tested an xds 45 last week and hated it, so this article was particularly well timed for things I was thinking about recently. This is the reason I moved from an M&Pc .40 to an M&P Shield 9mm for EDC.

 

[hps]

Good read. I dont have a 380 and prolly never will, but I do carry a 32acp as my mouse gun. Sure its not the best choice but it works.

 

[Iroquois]

Many 9mm reloaders hate .380s...they're hard to tell apart , may jam a progressive press , and if they manage to slip through the inspection process, they will definetly jam up a 9mm . That said , you should shoot a gun you can hit with...even if it's only a .22. It's better that fingernails , or a gun you only miss with....

 

[metaldog]

Good article. I used to tease my dad for carrying a .380, but as the article suggests... My dad was alarmingly accurate & consistent with it. Especially under rapid fire.

 

[VERT]

Glock 42, Ruger LC380, Walther PK380. All guns the market needs.

I still hate the micro 380s but I do like the compacts.

 

[SpaldingPM]

very informative. thanks for sharing!

 

[TBone3006]

Great article, love the quote, "facts, are stubborn little things"

 

[M67]

you should shoot a gun you can hit with...even if it's only a .22. It's better that fingernails , or a gun you only miss with....

Nuu uhhh!!! 380s and 22s are worthless to carry. They don't do ANY damage. I read so on INGO.

 

[VERT]

Guys and Gals I would like to point out that the OPs article talked about controlable, comfortable, easy to shoot guns. This goes beyond the 380. How many that yell "look 380 is OK! " are carrying that cartridge in a 10 oz mini gun? The example given by the author illustrated a larger gun. I do believe 380 is acceptable in a sub compact sized gun. I define compact differently that differently the a mini pocket gun. If you want to carry 9mm then get something bigger, 40 & 45 we start talking duty sized guns.

 

[lovemachine]

Dupe.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/handguns/329650-personal-defense-when-does-380-beat-9mm.html

 

[SpaldingPM]

Guys and Gals I would like to point out that the OPs article talked about controlable, comfortable, easy to shoot guns. This goes beyond the 380. How many that yell "look 380 is OK! " are carrying that cartridge in a 10 oz mini gun? The example given by the author illustrated a larger gun. I do believe 380 is acceptable in a sub compact sized gun. I define compact differently that differently the a mini pocket gun. If you want to carry 9mm then get something bigger, 40 & 45 we start talking duty sized guns.

I have one of the smallest (if not the smallest) .380 semi on the market. The cw380. Its very easy to control. Rapid fire is a breeze and up to 7yrds, I never miss, even if I'm pulling as fast as i possibly can.

and why does "duty" always have to start with a .4? I just dont get this anymore. A 9mm, .357 sig, 38 super, and yes... the .380. Anything that starts with a .3 will shoot someone dead. Don't believe me, well IMPD has had a few fallen due to the .380, I've had a friend die from a .380, I know a boat load of cops that carry .380's to backup their .40, or to carry to dinner with them. Caliber in terms of defining "duty" is obsolete anymore with the advancement in terminal ballistics. .380-.500sw will get the "duty" done.

 

[VERT]

You misinterpreted my post Spalding, what I wanted to convey is that a 40 or 45 cartridge is best suited to a larger platform. Not that a duty gun needed to start with a 4. For example I am not a fan of the 40S&W in subcompact guns. I am a big fan of the cartridge in larger guns. My Glock 23 is about as small as I care to go with that cartridge. I am also not a fan of the little Keltecs or LCPs. I do like my wife's PK380. I hate the little PM9s and LC9s (Kahr did good with the PM9) but the Glock 26 or 9mm Shield is good in my book.

Basically we keep trying to shrink the guns and I feel we are sacraficing too much for the sake of size.

Edit: truthfully given the current offerings in duty ammo and no magazine capacity limits, I am finding it hard to justify the existance of the 40s&w and 357 sig. The 9mm and 45acp are enjoying a resurrgence.

 

[Gluemanz28]

I have the Shield in .40 and I love it. I carry it everyday.
I can score 160 or better with 36 shots.
12 at 10'
12 at 20'
12 at 30'
With a magazine change at each location using a torso paper target.
Start at five points in the center and drop 1 point as you move out.
Each station has 20 seconds allotted time.

 

[Csquared]

A couple of my friends harped me when I bought my first handgun about choosing a 9mm. They thought it was silly to use a 9mm for SD when you can use a .45... I'm a small guy and I knew what I wanted, and from the few target practices I've had, it's working very well!

 

[SpaldingPM]

You misinterpreted my post Spalding, what I wanted to convey is that a 40 or 45 cartridge is best suited to a larger platform. Not that a duty gun needed to start with a 4. For example I am not a fan of the 40S&W in subcompact guns. I am a big fan of the cartridge in larger guns. My Glock 23 is about as small as I care to go with that cartridge. I am also not a fan of the little Keltecs or LCPs. I do like my wife's PK380. I hate the little PM9s and LC9s (Kahr did good with the PM9) but the Glock 26 or 9mm Shield is good in my book.

Basically we keep trying to shrink the guns and I feel we are sacraficing too much for the sake of size.

Edit: truthfully given the current offerings in duty ammo and no magazine capacity limits, I am finding it hard to justify the existance of the 40s&w and 357 sig. The 9mm and 45acp are enjoying a resurrgence.

Ohh ok haha!
Yes I do agree with you. I definitely wouldn't want to be shooting anything bigger than a .380 out of my cw380. It weighs in at about 10oz I believe, and that little guy does have some POP with a little 9x17.
I shot a friends XDs .45 the other day, and I must say... I didn't like it. it was accurate, but goodness it started hurting after one mag and I'm a powerlifter thats very accustomed to uncomfortable hand situations haha!

My little 2.9x something inch barrel cw380 is actually very accurate 3-7yrds and doubletaps and mag dumps rarely miss target, but that .45 XDs is not easy to rapid fire. Bullets start flying everywhere!

 

[maxmayhem]

Dupolice!...who cares if its a dupe? didnt see the other post , saw this one....this thread is better anyway...have to put up with this type of crap at work..not going to here...

Dupe.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/handguns/329650-personal-defense-when-does-380-beat-9mm.html

 

[VERT]

Ohh ok haha!
Yes I do agree with you. I definitely wouldn't want to be shooting anything bigger than a .380 out of my cw380. It weighs in at about 10oz I believe, and that little guy does have some POP with a little 9x17.
I shot a friends XDs .45 the other day, and I must say... I didn't like it. it was accurate, but goodness it started hurting after one mag and I'm a powerlifter thats very accustomed to uncomfortable hand situations haha!

My little 2.9x something inch barrel cw380 is actually very accurate 3-7yrds and doubletaps and mag dumps rarely miss target, but that .45 XDs is not easy to rapid fire. Bullets start flying everywhere!

I have no experience with the CW380 or PM380. I do like the PM9, while the PM/CM40 is a handful. I have shot or have experience with many 380s including the TCP, P3AT, LCP, PK380, LC380, Bersa Thunder, PPK/s,......... I like those models that are a little larger. Usable sights also help.

The Glock 42 has got my attention. Not in any hurry to buy one.

XDs in 45 does not excite me. 9mm version I would like to try.

 

[gregkl]

Well, I will first say some of you guys are good shooters! I only hope that with practice I can approach some level of your abilities. "Rapid fire is a breeze and up to 7yrds, I never miss, even if I'm pulling as fast as i possibly can"

Hopefully this will come with practice.

So if you are looking at say a Walther PPK/S or the similar Sig version in .380 and a Shield in 9mm, would the .380 exhibit a noticeably lower felt recoil?

I shot my brother's Sig and frankly I was surprised at the amount of recoil it had. He said it was because it is a blowback style pistol so they tend to hit a little harder. At least I think that was what he indicated.

I shot a Glock 42 and it felt okay. It is smaller and lighter than the Shield. Would the extra size and weight serve to equalize the felt recoil between these two?

When I shoot my snub nose .38 it feels fine in the recoil department. Even with +P's, I would have no problems spending some range time shooting it.

I guess this is my biggest concern with a carry gun choice for me. I want to carry something that I will practice with regularly. If it hurts my hand to shoot or I can't learn to shoot it worth a darn, then it's no good to me.

 

[VERT]

Ah the Sig 230, 232 and unrelated 238. Yep I have shot them all. The 230/232 is a blowback action. Actually quite a bit of felt recoil. The larger grip and heavier gun help. I owned a Walther PPK/s that would actually bruise my hand until I put on a set of pachmyer grips. The newer PK380 and I believe the LC380 and G42 operate from a locked breach.

38spl + P can be different depending on the weight of the gun. The all steel guns which weigh more have less recoil. The polymer guns like the LCR have less felt recoil IMO.

The Shield in 9mm is not to bad. I believe a dual recoil spring and enough grip size to get a good hold on tne gun.

 

[SpaldingPM]

Well, I will first say some of you guys are good shooters! I only hope that with practice I can approach some level of your abilities. "Rapid fire is a breeze and up to 7yrds, I never miss, even if I'm pulling as fast as i possibly can"

Hopefully this will come with practice.

So if you are looking at say a Walther PPK/S or the similar Sig version in .380 and a Shield in 9mm, would the .380 exhibit a noticeably lower felt recoil?

I shot my brother's Sig and frankly I was surprised at the amount of recoil it had. He said it was because it is a blowback style pistol so they tend to hit a little harder. At least I think that was what he indicated.

I shot a Glock 42 and it felt okay. It is smaller and lighter than the Shield. Would the extra size and weight serve to equalize the felt recoil between these two?

When I shoot my snub nose .38 it feels fine in the recoil department. Even with +P's, I would have no problems spending some range time shooting it.

I guess this is my biggest concern with a carry gun choice for me. I want to carry something that I will practice with regularly. If it hurts my hand to shoot or I can't learn to shoot it worth a darn, then it's no good to me.

I'm not sure if thats sarcasm lol? I have had extensive handgun practice however. I shoot 2-3 times a week, have been since I was 10 years old or so. Practice makes perfect!

I've been interested in trying out a g42. Hopefully I can get my hands on one soon.