Recycling Powder?

[DoggyDaddy]

Hey guys, I got a bunch of surplus Turk Mauser ammo recently. Some of it was in pretty bad shape and was not salvageable, some was okay and I was actually able to shoot it with no issues whatsoever. The rest (and the majority) I saved to pull the bullets for reloading. A few spot checks revealed that these are 154 grain cupro-nickel fmj bullets (153.8 to 154.5 grains from what I've seen) with about 49.3 grains of powder (48.8 - 49.4 or so - quite a variance really, but most were around the 49.3 weight). Looking at Hodgdon's website for reloading data for 8mm Mauser, it looks like this is close to the data for Varget.

Here is their data for a 150 grain bullet:
Hodgdon Varget
.323"
2.950"

45.5 <== Min. Charge

2,561
37,500 CUP

52.4C <== Max Charge

2,896
49,000 CUP

Here is their data for a 160 grain bullet:
Hodgdon Varget
.323"
3.010"

45.0 <== Min. charge

2,503
36,100 CUP

49.0C <== Max charge

43,600 CUP


Now, knowing that Turk ammo is typically considered "hot" as far as Mauser ammo goes, does it seem like the Varget data would be reasonable (and safe) to use for this powder? I think I would want to keep it to the lower end of the ranges they give. It is a flake powder and it just looks too good to throw away, at least until I've tested it. I'm going to end up with about 2 quarts of powder it looks like - probably between 3 and 4 lbs..

 

[AmmoManAaron]

Just to clarify, are you planning on reloading boxer 8mm Mauser brass using the Turk pulled bullets and Turk powder?

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Just to clarify, are you planning on reloading boxer 8mm Mauser brass using the Turk pulled bullets and Turk powder?

Yes, either 8mm Mauser, or possibly 8mm Lebel (loads are similar). I probably want to load them "down" from the original Turk loading so that they are a little more semi-auto friendly (if 8mm Mauser). If the powder is good though, then I may want to use it to load other calibers, like maybe 30-06, 308, 7.5x54 French or 8x56R.

 

[oldpink]

I have to say that I wouldn't go recycling powder without knowing with certainty exactly what it is, especially if contemplating using it in a different caliber.
However, even using it in the same caliber could cause problems, even dangerous situations.
For example, .30-06 loaded with the likes of IMR4350, IMR4831, or RL-22 can cause the action rod to bend if fired in an M1 Garand, even though the exact same ammo is perfectly safe to shoot in bolt, lever, single shot.
You have no ability to know that, relying only on assumptions.
Were it me, I would just use a known canister powder and make a nice pile of the powder from the pulled cartridges in a safe place away from other combustibles and toss a burning piece of paper onto it.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I have to say that I wouldn't go recycling powder without knowing with certainty exactly what it is, especially if contemplating using it in a different caliber.
However, even using it in the same caliber could cause problems, even dangerous situations.
For example, .30-06 loaded with the likes of IMR4350, IMR4831, or RL-22 can cause the action rod to bend if fired in an M1 Garand, even though the exact same ammo is perfectly safe to shoot in bolt, lever, single shot.
You have no ability to know that, relying only on assumptions.
Were it me, I would just use a known canister powder and make a nice pile of the powder from the pulled cartridges in a safe place away from other combustibles and toss a burning piece of paper onto it.

Good points. It's just gonna drive me nuts to potentially be throwing away almost $100 worth of powder if it's useable for something. And truly, I could limit it for use in bolt actions. That wouldn't be a problem, and then I'd not be risking screwing up one of my semi-autos.

 

[mkgr22]

Good points. It's just gonna drive me nuts to potentially be throwing away almost $100 worth of powder if it's useable for something. And truly, I could limit it for use in bolt actions. That wouldn't be a problem, and then I'd not be risking screwing up one of my semi-autos.

It is common practice to pull bullets on Turk 8mm rounds, reduce the powder charge by ten percent, then re-seat the bullet. There is no reason why you can't use a charge of 44 grains of that salvaged powder in an 8mm boxer primed case with one of your pulled bullets.

But as you said, I would only use them in a bolt gun.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

It is common practice to pull bullets on Turk 8mm rounds, reduce the powder charge by ten percent, then re-seat the bullet. There is no reason why you can't use a charge of 44 grains of that salvaged powder in an 8mm boxer primed case with one of your pulled bullets.

But as you said, I would only use them in a bolt gun.

Thanks Mike! Of course I don't want to be unsafe, but the cheapskate in me doesn't want to throw all that powder out if I can help it. Ironhead hooked me up! I was able to pull 491 bullets and wound up with 2 full quart jars of powder (I figure close to 4 lbs.).

Here's what I started with... the coffee can (bigger than normal - Sam's Club size) is full of the "shooter" ammo. The center box is what I set aside to salvage, and the bigger box is the stuff that was just too far gone.

 

[AmmoManAaron]

Dropping the charge a bit and reusing in 8mm Mauser shouldn't be a problem; I've done it with duds in several surplus calibers, but I have always reserved that ammo for bolt guns after doing so. FYI - there has been some talk of using salvaged Turk powder in other similar calibers over on Castboolits, but several of those guys are real experts when it comes to using pulldown powders. The Turk powder is a nitrocellulose flake powder and is pretty well behaved.

FWIW, I've got a beater Turk Mauser that I've shot a lot of ugly ammo in, stuff like the middle box in your picture. The brass cased ugly ammo does much better than steel cased ugly ammo in my experience...the one stuck bullet I've had was a rusty Nazi-era 8mm round. I would NOT shoot anything like that in a nice surplus rifle, but I had accumulated so much nasty 8mm ammo that I felt justified buying a beater rifle just for plinking with the stuff.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Dropping the charge a bit and reusing in 8mm Mauser shouldn't be a problem; I've done it with duds in several surplus calibers, but I have always reserved that ammo for bolt guns after doing so. FYI - there has been some talk of using salvaged Turk powder in other similar calibers over on Castboolits, but several of those guys are real experts when it comes to using pulldown powders. The Turk powder is a nitrocellulose flake powder and is pretty well behaved.

FWIW, I've got a beater Turk Mauser that I've shot a lot of ugly ammo in, stuff like the middle box in your picture. The brass cased ugly ammo does much better than steel cased ugly ammo in my experience...the one stuck bullet I've had was a rusty Nazi-era 8mm round. I would NOT shoot anything like that in a nice surplus rifle, but I had accumulated so much nasty 8mm ammo that I felt justified buying a beater rifle just for plinking with the stuff.

I was probably overly conservative with what I put in the "pull" box. I'm sure a lot of it would have been just fine. It was amazing that so much of it was actually good. Sometimes in the same bandolier I would find what looked like perfectly fine ammo in the same pouch as ammo that was totally green with hard crusty deposits on both the brass and the bullet.

 

[SSGSAD]

My ONLY question, is ..... How do you know, all that powder is the SAME ?????

I don't want to rain on your parade, but MIXING powder, is a NO-NO .....

 

[DoggyDaddy]

My ONLY question, is ..... How do you know, all that powder is the SAME ?????

I don't want to rain on your parade, but MIXING powder, is a NO-NO .....

Well, I suppose there could be some variation, but the rounds were all the same headstamp, all Turk, and all the charges I measured were the same, so I'm not overly concerned. Good point though!

 

[SSGSAD]

Well, I suppose there could be some variation, but the rounds were all the same headstamp, all Turk, and all the charges I measured were the same, so I'm not overly concerned. Good point though!

Just don't want to see you, or anybody get hurt.....

I agree, with the post about reducing 10%.....

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Just don't want to see you, or anybody get hurt.....

I agree, with the post about reducing 10%.....

Yep, understood. I'm not too keen on blowing myself (or my guns) up either! I'm definitely going to be cautious. I'll probably just load up 10 or 20 rounds to test and go from there. One of these days I really need to learn how to use my chronograph.

 

[jstory]

Personally, I would do what oldpink suggested. When you look at the price of powder versus a gun or even Dr bills...why risk it to save a few dollars?

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Personally, I would do what oldpink suggested. When you look at the price of powder versus a gun or even Dr bills...why risk it to save a few dollars?

I get that too, but I grew up in a house where my mom washed and saved baggies. And I'm talking the old cheap thin baggies, not nice ziplocs! I guess some of that frugality rubbed off on me.

 

[jstory]

I get that too, but I grew up in a house where my mom washed and saved baggies. And I'm talking the old cheap thin baggies, not nice ziplocs! I guess some of that frugality rubbed off on me.

Your call...hope it all works out well for you. Good luck.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Your call...hope it all works out well for you. Good luck.

Thanks! I'll take good luck.

Gotta admit, the bullets themselves did clean up nicely in the tumbler.

 

[jstory]

Thanks! I'll take good luck.

Gotta admit, the bullets themselves did clean up nicely in the tumbler.

Those I would reuse...looks good.

 

[Mgderf]

Sorry, and I very well could be wrong, but it seems to me that you're whistlin' past the graveyard here...

 

[Chaplain45]

What did you use to pull those?