Poor Man's Giraud Trimmer

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  • Doublehelix

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    Jun 20, 2015
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    I posted a few months ago some images of a trimmer that I was making to house a Giraud Tri-Way Trimmer head to make what I was calling a "Poor Man's Giraud Trimmer". That thread is here:

    https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/ammunition-reloading/425601-case-trimmers.html

    Well, I finally got around to finishing the project with the help of a good buddy. He was able to get a stainless steel frame built for me to hold the motor, and it allows me to orient the trimmer in either a horizontal or vertical orientation. Pretty cool!

    Just to refresh your memories, or if you don't want to read the other thread, I bought a buffer from Harbor Freight (like a grinder, only with buffer wheels), cut off the left shaft completely, and the cut of the threads of the right shaft with my angle grinder (cut like butter, and took about 60 seconds on each shaft). Giraud says you need to have the motor spinning counter-clockwise when looking at the end of the trimmer.

    The buffer motor spins at 3,450 RPM, and the Giraud motor spins at 3,000 RPM, so this is a pretty good fit speed-wise.

    Then I bought a coupler off of Amazon to adapt the 1/2" shaft on the buffer to the 3/8" shaft on the trimmer. This idea should work fine with other trimmers (WFT or Trim-it II) depending on their shaft diameters. I sent an email to Giraud, and they replied within a day with the 3/8" diameter. Here is the coupler:



    https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1


    The unit was now fully functional in the horizontal orientation, but I wanted to be able to switch back-and-forth, and as it turns out, Giraud recommends a vertical orientation anyway to keep brass chips from affecting the next case. This is where my buddy comes in to make the stainless steel frame. We put rubber feet on both surfaces to stabilize the unit, and I added a rubber pad on the blunt end to minimize vibrations.

    Here are some images of my completed $165 Poor Man's Giraud Trimmer:

    HORIZONTAL:




    VERTICAL:







    BACK SIDE: (Here you can see the slots that were cut into the frame to allow adjustment of the height of the buffer)




    It works great, and I couldn't be happier!!!
     

    Doublehelix

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    Excellent idea. I've been discussing how to do something similar with a friend. I may soon be copying your idea!
    --Rick

    It was so unbelievably easy, even I could do it! It was nice to have a friend who could help with the frame, but I am sure there are other ways to skin that cat. Maybe a local machine shop or something, or even something out of wood would work fine.
     

    boostjunki

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    Jul 7, 2015
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    Elkhart County
    I actually did something very similar a couple years ago with my Little Crow Gunworks trimmers. It cut my rifle brass trim time to a fraction of what it was. Yours is a little more refined with the two position mount. Nice job. I may have to upgrade to the Giraud Tri-Way.
     

    BigAlT

    Plinker
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    Apr 24, 2017
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    I just finishd my take on the Poor Man's Giraud Power Trimmer:

    For those of you interested in using your Tri Way Trimmer with an external 110v motor, I built mine with a standard Beckett 21805R or 21805U Oil Burner Motor I bought on the Bay for $35 including shipping. It's 110v 3450RPM 1/7hp with a 1/2" shaft. Just install a 2 prong AC plug on the power cord and it's good to go. I'm also using a delrin coupler from DumpsterCNC.com ( about $18 plus shipping ) in Size C ( Side 1 1/2" Side 2 3/8" ). I mounted the motor to a 1/4" thick 7" square piece of aluminum plate with two 3/8-16 x 6 Tap bolts and installed rubber feet on each corner.
    Because the whole Tri Way Trimmer spins when powered on and isn't contained in a housing like the Giraud Power Trimmer I was somewhat concerned with accidentally touching the trimmer during operation. To prevent this I mounted a 2" PVC threaded floor flange to a 7" diameter 1/8" thick aluminum round plate with a 9/16" hole drilled in the center. This is mounted above the motor using two 1/2" thick spacers to allow cooling for the motor and allow space for the heads of the four 5/8-11x1.5" cap screws that secure the floor flange to the aluminum round plate. I then screwed a threaded 2"x4" PVC nipple into the floor flange and screwed on a threaded 2" PVC cap that has a 1-1/2" hole I cut in the top. The hole is big enough that I can easily insert a rifle case into the trimmer and hold it during trimming but prevents any touching of the spinning trimmer during operation. Unscrewing the PVC nipple with cap attached from the floor flange allows easy removal of the cover of the Tri Way trimmer for cleaning and adjustment and access to the delrin coupler for changing trimmers. The cost of the whole unit with the trimmer, motor and other parts was less than $200. This setup also orients the trimmer vertically pointed up as Giraud recommends.
    Here are some Pix of the completed Trimmer. I had to enlarge the hole in the PVC Cap to almost the full diameter of the cap ( after I took the photos ) so I could hold the cases with three fingers when inserting them into the trimmer.

    IMG_1239.JPG IMG_1240.JPG IMG_1241.JPG IMG_1242.JPG IMG_1244.JPG
     

    natdscott

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    I really like my Giraud. It's everything it was billed to be.

    But hey man, that's really slick.

    -Nate
     

    mrproc1

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    Oct 25, 2012
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    Very nice!!

    Do you see a difference in running it vertically as to horizontally? Do the brass chips stay pretty much contained in cutter housing when used vertically?
     

    Doublehelix

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    Very nice!!

    Do you see a difference in running it vertically as to horizontally? Do the brass chips stay pretty much contained in cutter housing when used vertically?


    Vertical operation is much easier to manipulate for sure. I have installed a footswitch, and you can really get rolling with it. It certainly helps to contain the mess a bit better as well, but the design is supposed to contain the shavings in either orientation.

    I wanted the option to operate it in either orientation when I designed the support stand, but other than for testing, I have always operated it vertically. Much better for every reason.
     

    Clay Pigeon

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    Nice Job OP, I have a Giraud that one of my brothers and I flip back and forth. I have been looking at one or two of these for short runs of brass.
    It looks super quick to change calibers and to adjust length.

    [video=youtube_share;dkv_x-aQ8UI]https://youtu.be/dkv_x-aQ8UI[/video]
     

    JeepHammer

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    Aug 2, 2018
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    SW Indiana
    I have the Trim-It II version of offset (fly) cutter and I'm pretty happy with it.

    There are a couple of things you MUST do correctly & consistantly with a fly cutter that indexes off the shoulder,

    1. You MUST get the Datum length (headstamp to shoulder length) beat back consistantly.
    Without the shoulder being in the same place on every case, your overall case length won't be consistent.

    2. You must make a consistent neck size diameter.
    Since the cutting bit is an inverted 'V', and it orbits the mouth edge, smaller or larger case necks will have more taper or champfer on one side or the other.

    This isn't hatefully difficult with a reasonable set if dies, but the common, inexpensive 'All In One' (decapping, case body, shoulder, neck sizing dies) can create some issue.
    One tip is to LUBE the crap out of the case (with something that doesn't cause dents).
    The less friction, the better the case resized.
    Annealing necks/shoulders also helps, and between annealing, good lube, and a consistent press it's not too difficult to make pretty darn good brass!

    For guys that use a lot of square tail bullets, move the cutter tool *Slightly* outward, larger orbit around the case mouth.
    This gives a LONGER taper inside, while shortening the champfer outside, makes those square edge bullets slide right in the case without issues.

    If you want just a deburring inside & outside, but a flat top on the mouth, simply raise the cutter up off the case a little, it will leave a flat on top the case mouth. Some guys like the inverted 'V', some guys want 3 angles instead of just the inverted 'V'.
    When I'm processing something like .300 BO out of 5.56, I trim to length (square edge/end mill) in the progressive press, then just deburr with the fly cutter, leaves a really good looking flat top with champfered/tapered edges on the mouth.

    The other thing about these cutters, the tool bit is triangular, there is 3 'V's cut into the tool bit, so flipping it around to a sharp edge when it dulls is stupid simple (you do have to check set up & adjust when changing the tool bit), but you aren't left waiting on a new tool bit when it dulls.






     

    Clay Pigeon

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    Aug 3, 2016
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    I have the Trim-It II version of offset (fly) cutter and I'm pretty happy with it.

    There are a couple of things you MUST do correctly & consistantly with a fly cutter that indexes off the shoulder,

    1. You MUST get the Datum length (headstamp to shoulder length) beat back consistantly.
    Without the shoulder being in the same place on every case, your overall case length won't be consistent.

    2. You must make a consistent neck size diameter.
    Since the cutting bit is an inverted 'V', and it orbits the mouth edge, smaller or larger case necks will have more taper or champfer on one side or the other.

    This isn't hatefully difficult with a reasonable set if dies, but the common, inexpensive 'All In One' (decapping, case body, shoulder, neck sizing dies) can create some issue.
    One tip is to LUBE the crap out of the case (with something that doesn't cause dents).
    The less friction, the better the case resized.
    Annealing necks/shoulders also helps, and between annealing, good lube, and a consistent press it's not too difficult to make pretty darn good brass!

    For guys that use a lot of square tail bullets, move the cutter tool *Slightly* outward, larger orbit around the case mouth.
    This gives a LONGER taper inside, while shortening the champfer outside, makes those square edge bullets slide right in the case without issues.

    If you want just a deburring inside & outside, but a flat top on the mouth, simply raise the cutter up off the case a little, it will leave a flat on top the case mouth. Some guys like the inverted 'V', some guys want 3 angles instead of just the inverted 'V'.
    When I'm processing something like .300 BO out of 5.56, I trim to length (square edge/end mill) in the progressive press, then just deburr with the fly cutter, leaves a really good looking flat top with champfered/tapered edges on the mouth.

    The other thing about these cutters, the tool bit is triangular, there is 3 'V's cut into the tool bit, so flipping it around to a sharp edge when it dulls is stupid simple (you do have to check set up & adjust when changing the tool bit), but you aren't left waiting on a new tool bit when it dulls.







    The question is, Have you used other trimmers and are you happy with how it sets up and the speed that you can trim brass?
     

    JeepHammer

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    It's pencil sharpener quick, trim, champfer & deburr all in one action, what's not to like?! :)

    The OP shows how he drives the trimmer, I simply use a drill motor at about 300 RPM and it's still a 1/2 second operation,
    The cheap drills with the round collar for a side handle make for quick mounting so it's a one handed operation.
    If he wants a stand/drive that will last 100 years, that's OK with me too!

    I simply used an L shaped wood brace, drilled a hole for the drill motor handle/collar attachment point and ran the trimmer.
    Not as slick as his, but functional one handed, and the drill/mount comes off the bench top when I'm done (I like clean workstations, not big table/bench tops). Entirely personal preference...

    It was the 'One Caliber' thing that tipped me away from Giraud and towards Trim-It.
    Functionally the same unit, but with an adjustment of the fly head and a change of case insert I can do about any caliber since I do my own cutting set up.
    Giraud comes set up, ready to run, which is a plus if you don't want to change the setup for something different.

    I wasn't knocking what the OP did in any way, in fact I think his function of design is good.
    I was trying to think if there was an old grinder motor with good bearings laying around here somewhere... ;)

    Those little fly cutter heads are pretty common/cheap, it's the depth adjustment housing/swarf catcher that makes them REALLY handy, and it sure beats an end mill (flat face) then champfering & deburring by hand!
    At between $100-$150 they are QUITE the deal if you do many brass at all, saving a BUNCH of time and effort.
    I can lose $150 in change in the couch cushions in a month, so I got a couple, including Giraud & Trim-It.

    It's those crappy flat face trimmers I don't like, 'World's Cheapest Trimmer' or whatever, end mill flat cuts, HSS end mill that dulls out immediately, everything needs hand deburred... Not a big fan...
    I've trimmed WAY too many cases on the hand crank gadgets, and again, easily dulled cutters you can't get sharpened, a crap load of shell holders & pilots to keep track of, then again, you have to deburr/champfer by hand when they come out.

    If I'm going to crank on something by hand I want it to produce good food or loaded cartridges! I want a 'Happy Ending'! ;)

     
    Last edited:

    red_zr24x4

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    Bringing back a old thread
    Ordered a tri-way trimmer in 223 today. Going to make one of these.
    I'll be ordering one in 308 and 30-06
     

    red_zr24x4

    UA#190
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    Well, might have jumped the gun on this.
    Mama called to order it today and their phone wasnt ringing, just quiet like they answered but didn't say anything. She's gonna try again tomorrow
     

    Doublehelix

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