School me on 6.8 SPC

[Ruffnek]

Hearing the recent rumblings about the military possibly looking into replacing the 5.56 round with 6.8 SPC has me interested. I'm thinking about putting together another AR and am curious if this might be a good time to look into a new cartridge.

Questions:

1. Would 6.8 be a good "life and liberty" or defensive caliber for the average person?

2. How does it compare to 5.56 from a short barrel (8-12 inch)? Longer barrel (18-20 inch)? Is there an optimum barrel length or is it a round that has different attributes depending on the length of the barrel?

3. How much more expensive than 5.56 is 6.8? Is it feasible for someone who doesn't have tons of cash laying around?

Before anyone says it, I'm already using my Google-fu, I was just hoping for concise information, maybe even experience from users of 6.8 who could compare it to 5.56.

 

[Rookie]

There's a lot of people on lonestarboars.com that use the 6.8 on hogs. You might get more information there.

6.8SPC | Lone Star Boars

 

[Ruffnek]

There's a lot of people on lonestarboars.com that use the 6.8 on hogs. You might get more information there.

6.8SPC | Lone Star Boars

Cool, thank you.

 

[Rookie]

Also, as far as cost, it isn't a lot more than a decent hunting round. A quick look showed Hornady pretty close to the same price as 556 hunting rounds.

https://www.sgammo.com/product/horn...-spc-hornady-black-110-grain-v-max-ammo-83464

 

[teddy12b]

1.) The 6.8 spc has been used to stop a lot of heartbeats for both 4 legged and 2 legged beings. Like any caliber it has to work within it's limitations. You're probably not going to want to use this to drop a bull elk at 1,200 yards, but any kind of deer or smaller sized critter within a few hundred yards would be in bad shape if you know how to place a bullet where it's supposed to go. So life and liberty? It's ended lives and protected liberty before so why not.

2.) Trying to compare it based on barrel lengths without consideration to what ammo is being used doesn't mean a lot. It's a wider & heavier bullet in roughly the same sized case so it's going to be slower, but will have more momentum downrange due to heavier weight.

3.) It's more expensive than a standard or surplus 5.56 and certainly more expensive than steel cased 223, but the price has come down quite a bit. Probably never going to be as cheap as 223/5.56.

I had a 6.8mm spc upper when it was a new thing back in the day. It's a fine caliber, but if all you're doing is hitting steel or paper then there's really not much reason to pay extra. There's no match ammo available for it that I'm aware of so it's not getting dialed in for a long range setup. As far as a 200 or 300 yards deer gun or life and liberty there's plenty of great options out there for that do it as good or better than a 6.8. At the end of the day, the only really compelling reason to get into whatever caliber the military uses is because at some point surplus ammo will become available.

 

[Sling10mm]

I have been shooting 6.8mm SPC for a few years; just used it for deer hunting last year, and got two in one morning, albeit at pretty short range. Did it's job though, with no tracking.

I liken the 6.8 to a 7.62x39, and wouldn't use it much past 300 yards for deer, but it could be stretched out further for zombies, barbarians, or other 2-legged nasties. Saying that, it isn't a cheap round, even if you reload, so I wouldn't choose it to be my only rifle. Also read an article one time (may have even been posted on INGO) that did a detailed analysis of the 6.8mm compared to 5.56mm, and basically concluded that the 5.56 using 75-77 gr projectiles is still better than the 6.8 once past 300 yards from a trajectory/retained energy standpoint. I'm talking from memory recalled from an old brain, so take this with a grain of salt, but that was my take-away.

Having said all of this, I don't plan on getting rid of my two rifles, and wouldn't hesitate to use them in a self-defense situation that called for a rifle..... but I have a fair amount of ammo stocked up for them as well.

Another option you might look at is the 6.5 Grendel. Firearm-wise it probably wouldn't be any less expensive, but Wolf does have steel-cased ammo in their line-up, so feeding it might be cheaper ($.30/rd).

 

[natdscott]

It's best when reformed into 6mm HAGAR.

 

[Ruffnek]

I have been shooting 6.8mm SPC for a few years; just used it for deer hunting last year, and got two in one morning, albeit at pretty short range. Did it's job though, with no tracking.

I liken the 6.8 to a 7.62x39, and wouldn't use it much past 300 yards for deer, but it could be stretched out further for zombies, barbarians, or other 2-legged nasties. Saying that, it isn't a cheap round, even if you reload, so I wouldn't choose it to be my only rifle. Also read an article one time (may have even been posted on INGO) that did a detailed analysis of the 6.8mm compared to 5.56mm, and basically concluded that the 5.56 using 75-77 gr projectiles is still better than the 6.8 once past 300 yards from a trajectory/retained energy standpoint. I'm talking from memory recalled from an old brain, so take this with a grain of salt, but that was my take-away.

Having said all of this, I don't plan on getting rid of my two rifles, and wouldn't hesitate to use them in a self-defense situation that called for a rifle..... but I have a fair amount of ammo stocked up for them as well.

Another option you might look at is the 6.5 Grendel. Firearm-wise it probably wouldn't be any less expensive, but Wolf does have steel-cased ammo in their line-up, so feeding it might be cheaper ($.30/rd).

You may be onto something. I'd like to put together a gun that does well up close and further out. Ideally I'd have two uppers, one pistol/SBR length for general use, and then a longer one with some good glass on top for extended range. The likelihood of ever needing this for a SHTF scenario is low, but it's better to have and not want.

 

[teddy12b]

Another option you might look at is the 6.5 Grendel. Firearm-wise it probably wouldn't be any less expensive, but Wolf does have steel-cased ammo in their line-up, so feeding it might be cheaper ($.30/rd).

If I were to get into a different caliber for an AR-15 this is EXACTLY the caliber I'd go after. The 6.5 grendel turns an AR-15 into a 1,000 yard gun and will do anything a 5.56mm or 6.8spc will do even better.

 

[natdscott]

If I were to get into a different caliber for an AR-15 this is EXACTLY the caliber I'd go after. The 6.5 grendel turns an AR-15 into a 1,000 yard gun and will do anything a 5.56mm or 6.8spc will do even better.

Clarification needed:

1) The AR-15 is already a 1,000 yard gun when chambered in 5.56 NATO. At least, sorta.

2) The 6.5 Grendel is not much of a 1,000 yard cartridge, even in a 24"+ bolt gun.

3) Only at the level of 6.5x55 Swede, 6.5 Creedmoor, .260/6.5-08 and AI's, and the 6.5x47 Lapua do you BEGIN to get into good 1,000 yard numbers, and there's a STRONG argument to be made that it takes the -284 casing to be a true "1,000 yard gun" in 6.5mm.

None of those end up in an AR-15.


Don't get carried away...the AR-15 was not intended to be a good 1,000 yard rifle, is not, and will never be. It is just too small in too many dimensions to make it safe to chamber in large enough casings for that next quarter mile.

-Nate

 

[teddy12b]

1.) I've been a member at a 1,000 yard range and have only hit steel at 1,000 yards on one occasion with an AR-15. It was completely academic as it barely scratched paint, but yes if you're going to use the logic of every bullet goes miles, then yes even a 22lr is a 1,000 yard gun.

2.) Of the calibers he's asking about, it's not much of one, but of those mentioned it's hands down the best option.

Nobody is trying to pass an AR-15 as a 1,000 yard gun regardless of what caliber it's in. People play around with different calibers for different reasons. He's concerned about "Life & Liberty" and ammo prices for caliber other than a 5.56. Of the options available especially with the availability of wolf ammo prices, 6.5 grendel would be the best fit for what he's looking at.

 

[natdscott]

1.) I've been a member at a 1,000 yard range and have only hit steel at 1,000 yards on one occasion with an AR-15. It was completely academic as it barely scratched paint, but yes if you're going to use the logic of every bullet goes miles, then yes even a 22lr is a 1,000 yard gun.

2.) Of the calibers he's asking about, it's not much of one, but of those mentioned it's hands down the best option.

Nobody is trying to pass an AR-15 as a 1,000 yard gun regardless of what caliber it's in. People play around with different calibers for different reasons. He's concerned about "Life & Liberty" and ammo prices for caliber other than a 5.56. Of the options available especially with the availability of wolf ammo prices, 6.5 grendel would be the best fit for what he's looking at.

I actively shoot an AR-15 Service Rifle chambered in .223 in 1,000 yard prone matches up -to-and-including National competition. It is not wonderful, but I assure you, it's still punching holes in things point-first. It's a pretty long way from a .22LR, and I assure you, it is more accurate than "academic".

My 90's are crossing the finish line probably right at, or maybe 25-50 fps faster than a typical 123 grain Grendel load, and that 123 will have only maybe 100 ft lbs more energy. The energy left in that Grendel might be enough for a coyote, where I should stick with a groundhog.


BOTH rounds are extremely tenuous. You made a statement about the Grendel @ 1k with such zeal in your previous post that I felt compelled to temper your statement for our readers.

The only "1K" Ar-15 rounds are something like maybe the 6mmAR (6.5 Grendel necked to 6mm), or something based on the 6.8 SPC, but NOT 6.8mm



....like 6mm HAGAR.

-Nate

 

[teddy12b]

I have no zeal for the grendel other than admiring it from afar. I really have no desire for anything other than a regular old 5.56 upper. I thought I was getting fancy (for me) when I got a 223 wylde from WOA. My hopes were only to keep the op from making the same mistake I made, because back when bushmaster brought out the 6.8spc and it was going to be the new greatest thing I bought an M4 upper back when I was young(er) and dumber(er). It didn't do anything that I couldn't have done with a 5.56. It certainly didn't get me any better accuracy and all I ended up doing was emptying a lot of expensive brass.

I hadn't thought about single fed (i'm assuming they still are) 90gr rounds out of an AR since I'm not aware of them getting used much outside of competitions like you're mentioning. You're right though, the 90gr pills turn the gun into something else and brings a lot to the table.

 

[ScouT6a]

Zero experience with the 6.8 SPC, here.

Having shot 5.56 for 22-1/2 years in the Army (on paper and pop-up ranges and also on the two way rifle ranges, I quickly found an affection for the 6.5 Grendel. To me, in an AR15 platform, it is a sweetheart of a rifle/round combo.
Better at handling wind, more downrange energy, great accuracy, low recoiling and inexpensive to target grade ammo readily available at affordable prices, if you don't reload.

 

[Ruffnek]

Well, you guys infected me with the bug. Ordered this last night and now I'm all giddy.