Reloading the 9 mm in 115 and 147 grain FMJ + Reloading Data acquisition

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  • gregkl

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    I did a Google Advanced search and flipped through 5-6 pages in this sub-forum but couldn't find a thread that answered my questions or had a title that I thought would garner input.

    So here goes:

    1. I'm looking for good load data (either online or a book) that covers 115gr and 147 gr FMJ RN projectiles. I have a bunch and want to use them up before I move on to other weights/types. I'm working with Titegroup(TG) and 231. I tried Hodgdon and they returned just a couple results and neither were my projectiles. I checked my Hornady book and it has data for 115gr with 231, but no TG. 147 gr, neither. My Lyman book has load data but I notice that the specs are very much different than the Hornady book. What's up with that?

    2. I have the most loadings of a round for my 1911 in 9 mm and a couple years of basically test loads for the various pistols I have been trying (ala Doddg). I got all sideways loading for my CZ and their infamous short chambers and a bout with some coated bullets that were too inconsistent.

    I have always had good luck with FMJ RN so I'm sticking with them at least for now.

    These rounds will be used in a M&P 2.0 Compact for training classes, range time, and if I ever start gaming, that too. I'm not worried about PF since USPSA is not on my radar.

    Lastly, besides looking for input on where to find reliable data, I'd be interested in what you have found that you like.

    I'd also like some .38 Special data for my revolvers.:)
     

    t-squared

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    I've found these to be an AWESOME resource for easily finding and comparing load data.....https://www.cabelas.com/product/Loa...EwRc0yGWxHwYQI8SAWxoC06YQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

    From my 9mm book:

    Hornady data for their 115gr FMJ-RN:
    Win 231 powder
    1.100" oal
    4.1gr/1000fps
    4.7gr/1050fps
    4.7gr/1100fps

    Sierra data for their 115gr JHP and FMJ
    JHP=1.050"oal
    FMJ=1.100" oal

    Titegroup data:
    3.7gr/1000fps
    4.0gr/1050fps
    4.2gr/1100fps
    4.5gr/1150fps

    Win 231 data:
    3.8gr/1000fps
    4.3gr/1050fps
    4.8gr/1100fps
    5.3gr/1150fps

    Speer data for their 115gr TMJ RN
    1.135" oal
    Titegroup data:
    start charge-4.1gr/1061fps
    max charge-4.5gr/1121fps

    WIN 231 data:
    start charge-4.4gr/1026fps
    max charge-4.9gr/1133fps

    Hodgdon's data for the 115gr Speer GDHP and the Hornady 147gr XTP oughta get you in the ballpark with your FMJ RN bullets with Titegroup and 231.... just do the usual start low and work up thing. Also, keep in mind that XTP oal lengths are usually pretty short so maybe lengthen your loads out a bit during development if your gun/mags will allow it.
     

    VERT

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    Winchester 231 - I only load coated lead anymore.
    115 grain - ? never loaded them but 4.3 gr is a starting load for LRN
    124 grain - 4.1 gr
    135 grain - 3.7 gr
    147 grain - 3.4 gr

    Again these are for lead. FMJ would take a bit more powder but since power factor is not your concern. those amounts I listed should also match closely if you are using a Lee auto disc.
     

    gregkl

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    Awesome first couple posts! Exactly what I'm looking for. I have the 9th Edition Hornady manual. Which edition manual do you have T? Mine does not have TG load data. I'm not averse to buying a new one.

    Looking at the Hornady data after your comments about OAL, I see they show the 147 gr FMJ RN at 1.165" and the XTP at 1.100". But no 231 or TG loads.

    Vert, I'll move to 135's most likely once I've used what I have up, and I loaded some coated 135's in the past and still have about 200 rounds left. They wouldn't work in my CZ but they do fine in my 1911 and M&P. I'll have to check what my loading was but I think it was around 3.7-3.9. I'll keep this data for when the time comes.

    I load on a Rock Chucker.
     

    t-squared

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    The Hornady data is from a 9mm Loadbook like I linked above.
    Concerning 147gr loads, yea, they only show loads with slower burn rate powders for that weight. That's why I mentioned Hodgdon has loads in that weight but they use the XTP instead of a RN.
    It's the typical reloader's issue where your components, in this case your bullets, don't perfectly match the load data. You just have to use caution while working up the loads and that's why I mentioned paying attention to the short oal of the Hodgdon data.

    Here's the 9mm 147gr data I'm able to find from Hodgdon:

    Set your sights on pistol reloading data | Hodgdon Reloading
     

    schmart

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    I've used Titegroup successfully with both bullet weights, regardless if the bullets were plated plated, coated or FMJ. However, my attempt using 231 (aka HP-38) produced loads that wouldn't cycle the slides on any of my firearms. I finally got them to work by putting in a reduced power spring on my 1911, but have essentially moved back to Titegroup for all my 147 bullets.

    Sorry, I'm away from my load diary so don't have powder charges in front of me, and I never did chronograph any of them so couldn't comment on actual velocities either.

    --Rick
     

    VERT

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    Awesome first couple posts! Exactly what I'm looking for. I have the 9th Edition Hornady manual. Which edition manual do you have T? Mine does not have TG load data. I'm not averse to buying a new one.

    Looking at the Hornady data after your comments about OAL, I see they show the 147 gr FMJ RN at 1.165" and the XTP at 1.100". But no 231 or TG loads.

    Vert, I'll move to 135's most likely once I've used what I have up, and I loaded some coated 135's in the past and still have about 200 rounds left. They wouldn't work in my CZ but they do fine in my 1911 and M&P. I'll have to check what my loading was but I think it was around 3.7-3.9. I'll keep this data for when the time comes.

    I load on a Rock Chucker.

    CZ and Walther both like to be loaded on the short side. 9mm 1911 needs to be loaded longer to get it to feed. See the problem? I have been able to find a 124 grain LRN and a 135 grain RN that will run in all of my guns.

    I have about 4000 124 grain truncated cone bullets at my friends house that I bet would shoot awesome in a CZ. They are accurate in a Walther PPQ, and Glocks. Like really accurate. But I can’t get them to work in the 1911. So now I am stuck with the decision to load them or sell them.
     

    DadSmith

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    I have three different 9mm pistols all three take a different oal so I just use the shorter of the three for my oal for whatever bullet I'm using.
     

    Xterminator

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    I've used titegroup @ 4.2g with 115g copper rn..OAL 1.158 and it's a good shooter. When went to 147g , I used titegroup at 3.2g because I was going on power factor for competition.,,at 1.156 at OAL ..
     

    gregkl

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    I've used titegroup @ 4.2g with 115g copper rn..OAL 1.158 and it's a good shooter. When went to 147g , I used titegroup at 3.2g because I was going on power factor for competition.,,at 1.156 at OAL ..

    Interesting. My brother just suggested I try 3.2 TG for my 147's. Sounds like confirmation. I will check col for my barrels. Thanks.
     

    gregkl

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    CZ and Walther both like to be loaded on the short side. 9mm 1911 needs to be loaded longer to get it to feed. See the problem? I have been able to find a 124 grain LRN and a 135 grain RN that will run in all of my guns.

    I have about 4000 124 grain truncated cone bullets at my friends house that I bet would shoot awesome in a CZ. They are accurate in a Walther PPQ, and Glocks. Like really accurate. But I can’t get them to work in the 1911. So now I am stuck with the decision to load them or sell them.

    That was part of the reason I sold my CZ. I don't have time for loading for one gun only. I want whatever I load to work in my Shield and compact
     

    VERT

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    That was part of the reason I sold my CZ. I don't have time for loading for one gun only. I want whatever I load to work in my Shield and compact

    You won’t have a problem with your M&P. In private I have made INGO inappropriate comparisons between Smith & Wesson chambers and other loose things. I have a barrel out of a 9mm SW1911 that I used as a case gauge. Big mistake! I keep an M&P9 in my range bag that I use to dispose of out of spec ammo. That gun has had its barrel replaced with the newer dot barrel. I am not digging on S&W, we own several and like the guns. Glock and M&P seem generous with what they will eat.

    Order some 124 grain lead round nose from bayou Bullet. Other companies have basically the same bullet. I want to check out Hoosier Bullets but haven’t yet. Load 4.0-4.2 grains of HP-38/Win232 at a COAL of 1.125” or leave just a smidge of shoulder. That will feed in everything, is acceptably accurate, softer then factory.

    I have a 135 grain load worked up that I like quite a bit and is what I currently use. But if I wanted bulk ammo the 124 grain small ball is more forgiving.
     

    DadSmith

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    VERT

    I usually take the barrel out and seat my bullet long then drop it in the barrel and adjust the seating die until I find the best oal for that barrel. Write down what each barrel likes for each bullet type you use. Then adjust your seating die accordingly. Mark your containers as to which rounds go to what pistol.
     

    VERT

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    VERT

    I usually take the barrel out and seat my bullet long then drop it in the barrel and adjust the seating die until I find the best oal for that barrel. Write down what each barrel likes for each bullet type you use. Then adjust your seating die accordingly. Mark your containers as to which rounds go to what pistol.

    That is the best way to do it! If I were shooting bullseye that would be my practice as well. But there are many people who load ammo for economy. Competition guys want a cartridge that will work in all or most guns, has less recoil and is more accurate then factory ammo. Loading specifically for every handgun is simply not practical. What I do is load for those guns that I shoot in high volume which are usually the finicky guns anyway. That ammo will work in any of the other guns.
     

    gregkl

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    You won’t have a problem with your M&P. In private I have made INGO inappropriate comparisons between Smith & Wesson chambers and other loose things. I have a barrel out of a 9mm SW1911 that I used as a case gauge. Big mistake! I keep an M&P9 in my range bag that I use to dispose of out of spec ammo. That gun has had its barrel replaced with the newer dot barrel. I am not digging on S&W, we own several and like the guns. Glock and M&P seem generous with what they will eat.

    Order some 124 grain lead round nose from bayou Bullet. Other companies have basically the same bullet. I want to check out Hoosier Bullets but haven’t yet. Load 4.0-4.2 grains of HP-38/Win232 at a COAL of 1.125” or leave just a smidge of shoulder. That will feed in everything, is acceptably accurate, softer then factory.

    I have a 135 grain load worked up that I like quite a bit and is what I currently use. But if I wanted bulk ammo the 124 grain small ball is more forgiving.

    I will check Bayou out. I might order a small amount to see how they load up. Hoosier's website and description didn't give me that warm and fuzzy feeling. I tried Falcon brand bullets and I didn't work well with them. It was probably just me, but I had a hard time getting them to pass the drop chamber test from round to round. I think possibly the coating was creating inconsistencies. Hence the move back to FMJ.

    My brother is going to bring me some Blue Bullets to check out. That's what he uses (he's a competitive IDPA shooter).
     

    VERT

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    1C1BDB23-0739-4662-B8DD-A9AFE6225F1C.jpg

    Here is 5 rounds from a Walther PPQ at 15 paces. Nothing special, not shooting from a bench. I just wanted to check the sights and function. I am sure my 1911 would be a little tighter. My over 40 bifocal wearing eyes and arthritis in my hands are more of a limitation then ammo.

    135 grain LRN Bayou Bullet
    3.7 grains HP-38
    Winchester or CCI Primer, these may have been Federal?
    COAL 1.125”-1.130”. Maybe a smidge longe if you can get away with it. My 1911 like 1.135” but then it won’t feed in the PPQ. Like mentioned above you can use your barrel to check the cartridge. Just take the barrel out of the gun, drop in the cartridge and turn it to make sure nothing is hitting the rifling.
     

    DadSmith

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    That is the best way to do it! If I were shooting bullseye that would be my practice as well. But there are many people who load ammo for economy. Competition guys want a cartridge that will work in all or most guns, has less recoil and is more accurate then factory ammo. Loading specifically for every handgun is simply not practical. What I do is load for those guns that I shoot in high volume which are usually the finicky guns anyway. That ammo will work in any of the other guns.

    That's what I do now. I have 3 9mm pistols and the Ruger PC carbine. I found the shortest oal barrel I have and load them all accordingly. It's still a little longer than the oal the book calls for but it cycles in all my 9mm firearms.
     

    gregkl

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    Reviving an older thread since I have made some progress.

    I tested several loads in my M&P: FMJ 115 at various loadings, 147 gr Blue Bullets, 147 gr RNFP "black bullets" from Ackerman down in Evansville.

    The Blue Bullets and the Ackerman bullets shot the best. I thought I would get away from coated bullets, but they seemed to work fine for me.

    i could use either one and be happy though I think I'm going to load 124's.
     

    indyjohn

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    Interesting timing on the thread reboot. I'm currently building 115gr plated over 5.6gr Unique with Magtech No. 1-1/2, COAL just over 1.100".

    I have a number of M&P pistols that will consume them, I'm not expecting any surprises - or disappointments.
     

    Hohn

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    I did a Google Advanced search and flipped through 5-6 pages in this sub-forum but couldn't find a thread that answered my questions or had a title that I thought would garner input.

    So here goes:

    1. I'm looking for good load data (either online or a book) that covers 115gr and 147 gr FMJ RN projectiles. I have a bunch and want to use them up before I move on to other weights/types. I'm working with Titegroup(TG) and 231. I tried Hodgdon and they returned just a couple results and neither were my projectiles. I checked my Hornady book and it has data for 115gr with 231, but no TG. 147 gr, neither. My Lyman book has load data but I notice that the specs are very much different than the Hornady book. What's up with that?

    2. I have the most loadings of a round for my 1911 in 9 mm and a couple years of basically test loads for the various pistols I have been trying (ala Doddg). I got all sideways loading for my CZ and their infamous short chambers and a bout with some coated bullets that were too inconsistent.

    I have always had good luck with FMJ RN so I'm sticking with them at least for now.

    These rounds will be used in a M&P 2.0 Compact for training classes, range time, and if I ever start gaming, that too. I'm not worried about PF since USPSA is not on my radar.

    Lastly, besides looking for input on where to find reliable data, I'd be interested in what you have found that you like.

    I'd also like some .38 Special data for my revolvers.:)

    You can use the Hodgdon data. Don't sweat the difference between a 147 XTP and 147 LRN. Use that data, and if you want to be safe, use the data from the next heavier bullet weight. You'll be safe using any 124gr or 125gr data for a 115, for example.

    This isn't nearly the problem I think you think it is.
     
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