M118LR Match dissected

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  • DadSmith

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    I dissected one of the M118LR Match rds I just got from Midway here are some pictures. I'd like to know if someone can identify the powder.
    Hopefully AmmoManAaron or Wolfhound can give us some history on this round.

    OAL: 2.810 - 2.812 I only checked 10 to get an idea of the oal.











     
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    indyjohn

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    For the powder variety, I would lean toward IMR 4064. According to my reloading diary my .308 pet load for 175gr SMK is 43.0gr of 4064. I chronoed that round on a warm day @ just under 2700 fps MV from my Match barrel M1-A. LC '90 Match brass, Winchester WLR primer.
     

    AmmoManAaron

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    Since your ammo is headstamped 2018, it's basically Reloader 15 and it should be 43.5grs, but as is typical with mass produced ammo that will vary a little.

    Older M118 LR used a non-cannister grade powder called WC 750.

    Boxes marked "Match M118" are even older and used IMR 4895.

    That's some short details, the actual history of the evolution of the varieties of M118 could fill an entire chapter in a book.
     

    DadSmith

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    Since your ammo is headstamped 2018, it's basically Reloader 15 and it should be 43.5grs, but as is typical with mass produced ammo that will vary a little.

    Older M118 LR used a non-cannister grade powder called WC 750.

    Boxes marked "Match M118" are even older and used IMR 4895.

    That's some short details, the actual history of the evolution of the varieties of M118 could fill an entire chapter in a book.

    Great information AmmoManAaron.
    +1

    "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AmmoManAaron again."

    Maybe someone will give you some Rep. Since I can't.

    This +1 ^^^^^^^^^^^^

    I see sealant at both the primer and bullet. Was it difficult to pull the bullet due to the sealant?

    Yes it was more difficult than normal. Had to go outside and hit my concrete step to get it to come free with my bullet puller.
     

    Wolfhound

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    Great information AmmoManAaron.
    +1

    "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to AmmoManAaron again."

    Maybe someone will give you some Rep. Since I can't.



    Yes it was more difficult than normal. Had to go outside and hit my concrete step to get it to come free with my bullet puller.

    I got him for you. +6 :yesway:
     

    natdscott

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    Why do you want to know why I want to know? ;)

    I thought I would ask pleasantly before I gave my own opinion, to see if there were some very specific insight he hoped to gain. Ya know, listen THEN speak....?

    Military ammo has been so pondered and dissected and produced so much angst about “cloning”—and so much if that information is ALL over the internet—that re-doing the labor had better just be for fun.

    Fun is a totally valid reason. Destroying good ammo in hopes that doing so will coax some God-like awareness from a tiny corner of the internet...well, that’s silly.

    ( Not that that was necessarily the intent of the OP. That’s why I asked. )
     
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    natdscott

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    Now you tell me lol. That would have been easier and smarter. Not to old to learn new tricks of the trade.

    Seating it deeper by 0.005”, 0.015”, and 0.025”, and testing, is also a way to “tune” military ammo to shoot better.
     

    Wolfhound

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    I thought I would ask pleasantly before I gave my own opinion, to see if there were some very specific insight he hoped to gain. Ya know, listen THEN speak....?

    Military ammo has been so pondered and dissected and produced so much angst about “cloning”—and so much if that information is ALL over the internet—that re-doing the labor had better just be for fun.

    Fun is a totally valid reason. Destroying good ammo in hopes that doing so will coax some God-like awareness from a tiny corner of the internet...well, that’s silly.

    ( Not that that was necessarily the intent of the OP. That’s why I asked. )

    Thanks for the explanation. I asked simply because the few times I've pulled sealed bullets it required a lot of effort (and words not to be mentioned on this forum). Since the OP expressed no such difficulty initially I thought he may have some super secret way of avoiding the foul language method that I have used in the past.

    Destroying one or two rounds of ammunition really doesn't bother me. Destroying classic military rifles is another matter and I don't want to open that can of worms right now. :):
     

    BE Mike

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    I pulled some of that ammo quite a few years ago for a special project. After research, I was surprised that the powder was a canister powder (Reloder 15).
     

    JeepHammer

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    I thought I would ask pleasantly before I gave my own opinion, to see if there were some very specific insight he hoped to gain. Ya know, listen THEN speak....?

    By design, TWO EARS, one mouth...

    I talked to the guys from ATK & GD, and neither gave up a specific powder for any of the speciality rounds.
    GD makes the powder for ATK, and they aren't talking, and they freely admit they don't know what the civilian version of Mk 12 or LR powder is, that's why they call it 'Classified'.

    I'm sure the 'Best Guess' of the internet types is somewhere between laughable, to very close, but until it gets released in a civilian version and the manufacturers confirm it, I'll take it as an 'Educated Guess' (at best).

    Not that they can't hit the nail on the head, my M1 Garand rounds from a civilian source formula ran exactly like .30 US in testing at Crane, which surprised the actual professionals to no end...
    Several M1 fans up there, and ran some for me to make sure it was safe for my M1s.

    I 'Lucked' into that powder/charge information, one of a thousand or more on the internet... Just shot really well...
    So some of the guys hit the nail on the head, it's just a question of 'Which' guy gets it right.
     

    DadSmith

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    I got out and shot a few different rds today in my Areo Precision 308.

    I grabbed 5rds of the M118LR 175gr and tried them out.

    0.892" 5 shot group at 50 yards. So if you double that at 100 yards its shooting 1.784" that's almost 2 MOA. Not exactly that great.

    I'll get my Ruger Precision 308 and see how that does sometime.

    I'm also going to try the accuracy tips to see if it improves accuracy.
     
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