Remington 5 1/2 Small Pistol Primers

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  • CraigAPS

    Expert
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    3   0   0
    Jun 26, 2016
    900
    18
    Muncie
    I went to the only shop near me to pick up some more SPP. I still haven't used the ones I have, but I figured another 1000 couldn't hurt. I went in and asked for "small pistol primers." He said he was out of CCI but had some Remington. I asked what the difference was and he replied it was essentially the same thing. After I got home, i looked at the box and it said "No. 5 1/2 Small Pistol Primers." After some Googling, I've seen that these are either Magnum or Match primers. Anyone have any insight? Will be loading 9mm and .38 sp.
     

    indyjohn

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    77   0   0
    Dec 26, 2010
    7,505
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    In the trees
    I found myself wanting an extra 1000 as well. My resource only had magnum primers and when asked told me the magnum may add to MV but not to a degree that I would be able to discern. My 115gr 9mm loads are not at maximum, so I bought them.

    I would have to go look in my journal to be sure, but it seems I've used the Rem 5 1/2s before and didn't have any problems.
     

    CraigAPS

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Jun 26, 2016
    900
    18
    Muncie
    I found myself wanting an extra 1000 as well. My resource only had magnum primers and when asked told me the magnum may add to MV but not to a degree that I would be able to discern. My 115gr 9mm loads are not at maximum, so I bought them.

    I would have to go look in my journal to be sure, but it seems I've used the Rem 5 1/2s before and didn't have any problems.

    I've been looking around THR and the S&W forums. I've seen several people say they've used them without problems. I've also seen they might add a bit of velocity, and a few said they were told by Remington that the actual make up is the same as the 1 1/2 but has a thicker cup which is why Remington recommends them for .357 and .40 loads.
     

    2in1evtime

    Master
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    61   1   0
    Oct 30, 2011
    3,444
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    retired-midwest
    Yes remington recommends the 5 1/2 for 357 mag and 40 s&w but they work just fine in 9mm and 38spcl. over a chrono i had no speed difference of any issue. They are just a heavier cup for higher pressure cartridges according to remington.
     
    Last edited:

    canebreaker

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 2, 2020
    261
    43
    Horn Lake
    I started out reloading with Remington 5 1/2's. I could get a sweat ladies load with 2.4 gr Bullseye and a 110 gr LRN. I ran low after 2 sleeves and bought a sleeve of Winchester SPP. That's when problems in my 38 spl started. Having a 1,000 rounds ready for the range 1 in 6 was a squib on average. 2.6 grs was the lowest I could use with them.
     

    Gaffer

    Shhhh.......
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    5   0   0
    Dec 12, 2016
    721
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    Southern IN
    Naw, you should probably not use them. I will give you $10 for them to get them off your hands, being the nice guy I am! :>)
     

    CraigAPS

    Expert
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    3   0   0
    Jun 26, 2016
    900
    18
    Muncie
    I started out reloading with Remington 5 1/2's. I could get a sweat ladies load with 2.4 gr Bullseye and a 110 gr LRN. I ran low after 2 sleeves and bought a sleeve of Winchester SPP. That's when problems in my 38 spl started. Having a 1,000 rounds ready for the range 1 in 6 was a squib on average. 2.6 grs was the lowest I could use with them.

    So, you did notice a difference in velocity. Is 2.6 gr what you stuck with for regular SPP or did you go higher?
     

    CraigAPS

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    3   0   0
    Jun 26, 2016
    900
    18
    Muncie
    Naw, you should probably not use them. I will give you $10 for them to get them off your hands, being the nice guy I am! :>)

    And, since you're being such a nice guy, I should definitely bring them to you! It'll be a quick 5 hour round trip!!
     

    shibumiseeker

    Grandmaster
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    49   0   0
    Nov 11, 2009
    10,707
    113
    near Bedford on a whole lot of land.
    Keep in mind that hotter ignition does not automatically mean that it will increase velocities for the same powder loads. It might, but in this case, hotter means literally that, the compound puts a hotter flame into the powder charge to more reliably ignite powders typically used in magnum loads. Hotter does not translate to a high pressure flamefront from the primer (point in fact it's often lower), but it might ignite SOME powders a little faster increasing charge pressure a little.
     

    CraigAPS

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Jun 26, 2016
    900
    18
    Muncie
    Keep in mind that hotter ignition does not automatically mean that it will increase velocities for the same powder loads. It might, but in this case, hotter means literally that, the compound puts a hotter flame into the powder charge to more reliably ignite powders typically used in magnum loads. Hotter does not translate to a high pressure flamefront from the primer (point in fact it's often lower), but it might ignite SOME powders a little faster increasing charge pressure a little.

    I was assuming canebreaker's squibs with the same charge and only switching from the 5 1/2s to Win SPP would've been caused by a drop in velocity. Am I mistaken? What else would cause the squibs? He said he had to up the charge by .2 gr to make the rounds with the WSPP reliable. (Not trying to be argumentative. I'm curious. Still REALLY new to reloading. Just want to understand things.)
     

    shibumiseeker

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    49   0   0
    Nov 11, 2009
    10,707
    113
    near Bedford on a whole lot of land.
    I was assuming canebreaker's squibs with the same charge and only switching from the 5 1/2s to Win SPP would've been caused by a drop in velocity. Am I mistaken? What else would cause the squibs? He said he had to up the charge by .2 gr to make the rounds with the WSPP reliable. (Not trying to be argumentative. I'm curious. Still REALLY new to reloading. Just want to understand things.)

    The issue is that each primer manufacturer has different formulations for their compounds. They all start with a base of lead styphnate but then they will adjust admixtures (ground glass is one admixture because of its thermal transfer characteristics), and even within the same manufacture, there is slight variances in batches. So one manufacturer may be very different than another manufacturer and those differences can have a large degree of overlap. Primers have changed over the years even within the same manufacturer and type. CCI did a big change in the late 80s that caught many of us off guard.

    Reliable ignition is a complex interplay between the cup thickness and hardness, the compound, the firing pin strike force and even the firing pin nose shape, the powder used, case volume, and even the temperature. There's no simple formula that says do X for Y.

    The upshot is that sometimes you can drop a different primer in and it will perform just fine. Other times you will need to adjust one of the other variables (charge weight, seating depth, powder type, etc) to get the same results. You won't know until you've experimented with it. The standard advice when switching primers is to drop a little charge weight if it's close to max because it COULD change, then work back up to where you want to be.

    Here's some good reading on primers:
    https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/ammunition_st_mamotaip_200909/100079
     
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