Imported Ammunition Question

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  • Kirk Freeman

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    Given the ammunition shortage/demand in the USA, why haven't European/Israeli/South American manufacturers stepped up imports?

    I assume they are in the pipeline but getting the 6s approved will be slow walked by the Biden Administration.

    Does anyone have any knowledge, barring that, any guesses?
     

    Old Bear

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    Don't forget that much of Europe was/is under strict lockdown due the the virus. This alone would put everything behind, especially if they were already running near capacity.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Don't forget that much of Europe was/is under strict lockdown due the the virus. This alone would put everything behind, especially if they were already running near capacity.

    Maybe, but that may be nation dependent. I used to know someone at Tiger but they now work for SIG USA. Don't have anyone as a broker anymore.

    Europe has such a large ammo infrastructure you would think that they could lift and shift.
     

    firecadet613

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    Here's my thoughts, as someone whos better half does international logistics for a living...

    Ocean Freight costs are thru the roof - easily 2-3x what it cost last year. Less vessels are sailing causing containers to get bumped.

    Air freight has also increased in cost and with ammo being heavy, it's probably not a viable option.

    I've had this same thought, but I believe what I stated above to has a lot to do with it.
     

    firecadet613

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    Fire, follow the money. Smart.

    Fewer ships=greater cost.

    They Euros could ship but the vig would be tiny because of the nut. Ok, anyone have confirmation.
    I'm a fan of S&B. Probably the brand I've seen the least, since covid started.

    Strange as it may be, I've seen quite a bit of IMI lately.
     

    gregkl

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    Here's my thoughts, as someone whos better half does international logistics for a living...

    Ocean Freight costs are thru the roof - easily 2-3x what it cost last year. Less vessels are sailing causing containers to get bumped.

    Air freight has also increased in cost and with ammo being heavy, it's probably not a viable option.

    I've had this same thought, but I believe what I stated above to has a lot to do with it.

    We ship injection molds over here from Asia. Some ocean freight quotes we get are close to what air ship quotes used to be. Add in an additional 25% tariff plus various surcharges and you create all kinds of tension with customers that agreed to pricing a year ago.:)
     

    firecadet613

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    We ship injection molds over here from Asia. Some ocean freight quotes we get are close to what air ship quotes used to be. Add in an additional 25% tariff plus various surcharges and you create all kinds of tension with customers that agreed to pricing a year ago.:)
    She mainly deals in full containers, but yes, record setting year for freight rates!

    *One carrier is up to 5x pre-covid rates!
     
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    IIRC it can take 6 months to get all the import paperwork approved, then add in arranging shipping and actual transit, then sitting in customs for who knows how long until it clears. So a year from start to finish wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility. I'm sure most of the bigger names have a constant stream of permit applications going in so brands like Aguila, for example, are coming in in regular shipments.
     

    maxwelhse

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    I was just watching a podcast, that is a few weeks old at this point so accuracy may be a little off, but the statement made was that there is that the primer shortage is worldwide. It was also mentioned that no one has yet to buy Remington as a complete entity so their plants are shuttered and due in part to that 100% of Winchester's production is going to the US military. They also said military contracts were 6-8 month behind when that started.

    I have no way to verify any of that, but it stands to logic on its own on the surface.
     

    Ziggidy

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    I was just watching a podcast, that is a few weeks old at this point so accuracy may be a little off, but the statement made was that there is that the primer shortage is worldwide. ...100% of Winchester's production is going to the US military. They also said military contracts were 6-8 month behind when that started.

    I have no way to verify any of that, but it stands to logic on its own on the surface.

    Just doesn't seem right.....someteeng eez up!

    No one has any and all that is produced is going to military. The increase in gun sales is pretty much over, the market is dry. No one can find ammo yet they're running at maximum.

    IMO, it doesn't add up.
     
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    Its all getting bought as soon as it hits the net or sales floor. Heard a fairly local shop got in 5 (yes, 5) pallets of steel cased .223 about a month ago. Sold out in less than half a day even with limits. Another shop got in quite a bit of hunting ammo along with some 9mm and 5.56, completely gone in 2 days.
    Websites are filling backorders and along with people being able to get notifications about new inventory, they're selling out even faster.
    Another website I belong to has numerous members in Canada and Europe. No shortages there and prices haven't changed much.
     
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    I was just watching a podcast, that is a few weeks old at this point so accuracy may be a little off, but the statement made was that there is that the primer shortage is worldwide. It was also mentioned that no one has yet to buy Remington as a complete entity so their plants are shuttered and due in part to that 100% of Winchester's production is going to the US military. They also said military contracts were 6-8 month behind when that started.

    I have no way to verify any of that, but it stands to logic on its own on the surface.

    Remington's ammo concern has been bought by the same folks who own Speer, CCI, and Federal. Those plants hadn't been shut down, and the new owners are in the process of bringing back laid off employees along with updating the machinery and processes.
    Winchester got the contract to run Lake City and had some hiccups during their early runs that didn't meet spec. Remember all the Win white box 5.56 from last summer? That was the ammo that didn't make spec. Now they're trying to make up the backlog for .mil. Once that is done they'll be back to regular production.
    But yes, primers are a big bottleneck right now. In the videos I've seen of primer production the process looks very archaic, slow, and labor intensive. Definitely not a job for the unskilled.
     

    gregkl

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    An interesting note about getting notifications. I get them at times and now I know I don't. I had a notification for a gun part set for the last couple months at least. Then one day I went to the sight to copy paste the item to do a search and lo and behold, they indicated "in stock". I jumped on it and order it. I still have not received a notification from them. Of course they went out of stock some time after I ordered mine.

    So, now I check periodically just in case.
     

    brchixwing

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    If you go further east, SG ammo confirmed the Russians had supply chain issues from lockdowns in April/May, Vympel shut down their primer factory:

    "So the story with this ammo starts with Covid19 shutting down the primer factory in Russia in April and May 2020, making primers very hard to get in Russia in 2020. The Vympel factory could not source primers for regular production so they disassembled a stockpile of 1970s vintage military surplus ammo harvesting the primed case, then stenciled their logo and '7.62x39' on the case and used that primed case to load lead core commercial ammo for the US market."



    Don't forget that much of Europe was/is under strict lockdown due the the virus. This alone would put everything behind, especially if they were already running near capacity.
     

    canebreaker

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    Winchester, Oxford, MS is running 24/7, but every other machine is down to give employees space.
    S&B has been shutdown, we may see the first shipment in January.
     

    IUKalash429

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    Meanwhile, a few hours north of us up in America's hat, Canadian gun owners are still readily buying 9mm in the 20+ cent-per-round range, 5.56 in the 40+ CPR range (I'm using USD in both of those price ranges), along with all the other unobtanium calibers we're hunting for down here. Popular ammo calibers remain in stock there, and prices haven't really spiked from COVID either. This is confirmed by folks I know in Canada, and by browsing some of the popular Canadian firearms retailer websites.


    Doesn't really answer the OP's question, but it's still relevant to global markets, imports, and supply/demand.
     
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