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  • eldirector

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    I need to update some of my "tech" here at my home and home office. Any phone/data wiring gurus on here?

    Project #1
    I have 2 phone lines that come off of my cable company's VOIP/router. One I have plugged into my standard home phone jack as per their instructions. The other has a LONG cable that plugs into line #2 on my 2-line business phone (line #1 plugs into another regular home phone jack).
    QUESTION: I'd like to eliminate that cable running around the room, and somehow plug BOTH lines into my home phone wiring (using some sort of adapter?) and then be able to use another adapter to plug my 2-line phone in wherever I want. Possible? What do I need to purchase or check in my wiring to make this work?

    Project #2
    I'd like to put in a Cat6e "patch panel" in the wall next to my router, then terminate the other end at a couple of locations around the house. I can pull the cable (I've done electrical). How difficult to terminate each end? I know I'd need special tools. I've just never done the "physical" layer (I'm a software guy).
    End result: I'm dumping my wireless router for a wired with POE, and placing dedicated wireless access points in 3 locations (office, upstairs, and either in the detached garage, or use an outdoor unit at the back of the house). Might run another wire to the family room entertainment center and use a small hub for the 2-3 networked devices there (and get them off of wireless).

    Gonna start chipping away at this over the next few weeks or so. Need to get these darn cables off of the floor, and I (read: my wife) is tired of the poor wireless signal in other parts of the house.

    Thanks in advance for any advice!
     

    ArcadiaGP

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    HHollow

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    Project #2
    You will appreciate the reliability and speed of the hardwired network. I did this on a 4000 ft2 house with cable terminations near several TV's and in some far reaches of the house. Then at several points I installed wireless transmitters and the whole property is hot.

    One thing. For 6 months part of my wire network was unreliable. I finially figured out that part of the net would fail whenever someone was in the basement (kids playing...). Reason was that my cat5e cables were near some fluorescent lights and there was interference when the lights were turned on. Solution: use shielded cable or avoid cabling routes anywhere near that kind of lighting.
     

    eldirector

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    @HHollow - Thanks for the reminder on shielding. Already planning on staying 18"+ away from electrical of any sort. I'll be sure to get plenum-rated shielded cable.

    @GPIA7R - That cable appears to be male-male. Might work for marriages, but I think I need a female end at the patch panel. Unless... wonder if they make F-F wall plates? Run this cable, plug into the BACK of the wall plate, and then a short patch cable from my router to the FRONT of the wall plate?

    BTW: Here are the access points I'm looking at:
    http://www.amazon.com/Ubiquiti-Networks-UniFi-Enterprise-System/dp/B004XXMUCQ
     

    JettaKnight

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    Why do you want plenum rated cable? Are you running this in your air ducts?

    No, you don't want some really long cable with ends on it (fishing it through walls would be a *****). You want a roll of Cat5e cable, solid wire and a 110 punchdown tool.

    At my central point, I have a sheet of plywood that I can attach anything I want - TV spliters, routers, and surface mount network ports. That was cheaper and easier than using a full rack mount 1U patch panel.

    You can use surface points for your computers and such or keystone wall plates. Either way, get a punchdown tool - easy peasy.

    You can get keystones with RJ11 for phones or anything else - makes for a clean installation. Pulling RG6 at the same time as cat5e makes life better for the future.


    Monoprice has all you need.


    EDIT:
    This is what I should have put in.
     
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    JettaKnight

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    For Project #1 -
    Is the run to this phone using multiple pair cable? You can dedicate one pair for each line then split it out at each end. You can buy adaptors for that or make your own.


    You can do this for ethernet as Base 100T only used two of the four pairs. However, the faster Base 1000T uses all four pairs, so don't do this for new installations.
     

    eldirector

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    For Project #1 -
    Is the run to this phone using multiple pair cable? You can dedicate one pair for each line then split it out at each end. You can buy adaptors for that or make your own.
    So, that I can check. Look for 2 pairs (4 wires), correct? Then, some sort of Y-connector for each end?
     

    JettaKnight

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    So, that I can check. Look for 2 pairs (4 wires), correct? Then, some sort of Y-connector for each end?

    Yup.

    I'm assuming this a standard old school two line phone where each line only uses one pair (like a standard single line phone).


    If it's old school wiring, there will be red, black, yellow, green. Red and green is the standard for phones - the other two are normally unused.

    Doing your own telephone wiring
    Phone-man's Home Phone Wiring Advice Page - Adding a Second Line to Your Existing Phone Jacks
    What do the yellow and black wires in a home telephone jack do? - HowStuffWorks



     

    eldirector

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    Awesome. Thanks, JettaKnight. I'll pull a wall-plate and check shortly. And thanks for the links, though that second one needs some serious user-interface help! (white text on blue background - yowza)
     

    Cameramonkey

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    eldirector

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    Ok, here is a phone jack.
    File%20Sep%2010%201%2053%2049%20PM.jpeg


    Blue/grey to the red jack. White/blue to the green. Black and yellow are unwired in the jack, and there are a LOT of unused wires in the bundle.

    So, I have enough wires, but I likely need to check every jack (yippee) and connect another pair for the second line.
     

    JettaKnight

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    Ok, here is a phone jack.


    Blue/grey to the red jack. White/blue to the green. Black and yellow are unwired in the jack, and there are a LOT of unused wires in the bundle.

    So, I have enough wires, but I likely need to check every jack (yippee) and connect another pair for the second line.

    If by "a LOT" you mean three pairs, then yeah.

    Looks like Cat3, or worse. Anyways, It's probably daisy chained around the house and the other pairs are unused.

    Two options:
    (A) Land the orange pair to the black/yellow and use a splitter outside the wall.
    (B) replace that jack with a pair of jacks and use the blue pair for one and the orange pair for the other.

    You'll need to do similar at the other end where it terminates at your VOIP.
     

    citizenkane

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    Option A would probably be the easiest. Just make sure you get a line 1/ line 2 splitter at both jacks. Run two cords from the VoIP box to the jack and you should get line one and two out of the splitter at the other end once you wire that one. I would agree it's most likely daisy chained and as long as it hasn't been hacked up it should be pretty easy.
     

    Mr Evilwrench

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    I've set up a home-run system with phone, CAT-5, video, some other stuff. I used to have both landlines hooked up, but a VOIP will be equivalent. For those I would use two Keystone jacks and connect one as L1/L2, then crossover and wire the other as L2/L1. This way I could plug a single line phone into either line, or a two line phone in L1/L2. All my phone wire was R/G/Y/B, but what you have there should work if you figure out the wires and verify they're not used for anything else.

    Patch panels are easy as well. As has been said, you want to pull raw cable, and punch down the wires at each end. My system has patch panels with wires punched down on the backside, then patch cables in the front. It's a lot to describe in a short post, but it's very versatile.
     

    bulletsmith

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    A couple of issues:

    Plenum cable cost roughly double, but it will not give off toxic fumes in a fire. Non plenum cable will.

    Unless you are terminating properly, (and you likely will not) you can actually introduce more noise by using shielded cable. In the typical home install, shielded cable is a wast of money. Stay away from the fluorescent fixtures and anything electric wiring that is not in conduit and you will be fine.

    At this point in time, just about everybody is installing Cat6. I wouldn't bother with cat5e.

    If you care about following any sort of standard (TIA-EIA) you do not want to use the "spare" pairs in a cable for another link. The twist rate that provides shielding is not correct for data.

    As far as using cat6 for telephone goes, use only the blue pair for POTS lines, nothing else. It's just not done in a good installation.

    I would suggest you bite the bullet and pull a new run for each jack. Locate your patch panel and network switch at your distribution point. FYI - You will be hard pressed to find an actual hub these days. If you truly want to go that route, you will be shopping for a switch. It may sound trivial, but you are better off not using a hub even if you find one.
     

    Mr Evilwrench

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    I'm just on CAT-5 because I wired it all about 10-12 years ago. I'd do CAT-6 now, and would never use unused pairs on a data cable. I even pulled two CAT-5s in parallel one time for jacks on the opposite sides of a wall. I've been fortunate that all my cables only ever met power at 90°. UTP is fine.
     

    JettaKnight

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    A couple of issues:

    Plenum cable cost roughly double, but it will not give off toxic fumes in a fire. Non plenum cable will.

    Unless you are terminating properly, (and you likely will not) you can actually introduce more noise by using shielded cable. In the typical home install, shielded cable is a wast of money. Stay away from the fluorescent fixtures and anything electric wiring that is not in conduit and you will be fine.
    Agreed on both points.

    At this point in time, just about everybody is installing Cat6. I wouldn't bother with cat5e.
    Cat6 doesn't cost a lot more, so yeah.

    If you care about following any sort of standard (TIA-EIA) you do not want to use the "spare" pairs in a cable for another link. The twist rate that provides shielding is not correct for data.

    As far as using cat6 for telephone goes, use only the blue pair for POTS lines, nothing else. It's just not done in a good installation.
    Correct, especially if the telephone wire has a direct electrical path to the outside world that can introduce lighting derived spikes into your cabling. Telephones run at higher voltages and can introduce a lot of noise in your data lines. Run a separate cable. I'd recommend using RJ-11 keystones with all pairs punched down.

    I would suggest you bite the bullet and pull a new run for each jack. Locate your patch panel and network switch at your distribution point. FYI - You will be hard pressed to find an actual hub these days. If you truly want to go that route, you will be shopping for a switch. It may sound trivial, but you are better off not using a hub even if you find one.
    If you find a cheap (used) hub, buy it for me. I've got a few applications that require a hub and not a switch from time to time.
     

    eldirector

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    Well, I am certainly not pulling all new wire for the phone. A few locations would be a real bear. In all honesty, I'd prefer dropping the second line completely, but that is another conversation. So, I'll likely go with "option a" as described above. I really only need that 2nd line in my home office.

    So, for networking: non-plenum un-shielded Cat6 terminated properly on each end. I'll likely use wall plates with Keystone jacks (RJ45) on each end. A 4-up wall plate behind my router, and 1-up in the remote locations. Short patch cables from router to wall, and then wall to AP. I can get into the attic above those locations pretty easily. No fluorescent fixtures anywhere near, and I can easily avoid 110V power. I WILL be using POE injectors, or a new router with POE built in. Need to power the remote APs.

    Don't worry about the "hub". Those devices are wireless, or wired. They can stay wireless after all this if needed.

    Thanks for all the input! I've been out of this type of work for a good 10 years. Never made my own cable, either. Thankfully, not too old to learn some new tricks!
     

    Cameramonkey

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    OP, if you need to borrow any tools and RJ ends, let me know. Mighty pricey for a one shot deal. I may also have some extra faceplates and jacks.

    Jetta, I'll check my parts bin. I may have a spare hub for you.

    And definitely save your pennies and skip plenum rated cable. Unless you run any cables through your HVAC duct work, its within code to install riser cable. Plenum rated cable is only required if it is used in air handler spaces, like the space above a false ceiling or when using a duct to get from A to B. Its kosher to use riser in attics, inside walls, and in crawlspaces.
     
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