Any INGO accountants in the house?

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  • Cameramonkey

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    Our church is experiencing a pretty significant drop in giving since the shutdown. We dont have but 3 on staff, but they are all cutting hours to conserve cash. Somebody suggested to the pastor that we might qualify for the CARES act to help cover payroll and other expenses during the shutdown. Unfortunately nobody in the congregation does the accountant thing and our finances are simple enough that typically we can handle it all. (taxes, payroll, etc) And when we do have a question, the folks at Quicken are usually able to give us the insight we need.

    Anyone here do the accountant thing that could answer some questions? And I'm sure if it got too detailed they would be willing to pay for your time.
     

    MCgrease08

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    I'm not an accountant and I can't help the situation, but I'm sorry to hear giving is down. It sounds like your church is in a tough spot. Prayers inbound.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    I'm not an accountant and I can't help the situation, but I'm sorry to hear giving is down. It sounds like your church is in a tough spot. Prayers inbound.

    Thanks. Its not dire, and not even sure we will take advantage of it because it could be down because people just havent adjusted yet. (signing up for online giving, mailing in checks, etc) But wanted to investigate all of our options in case it continues.
     

    churchmouse

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    Thanks. Its not dire, and not even sure we will take advantage of it because it could be down because people just havent adjusted yet. (signing up for online giving, mailing in checks, etc) But wanted to investigate all of our options in case it continues.

    What they are seeing at the church I work for is that folks are adjusting to low or no incomes until this insanity is past. It is really hurting them. a larger church with a staff that depends on the revenue stream from being employed there. I am part time (15 to 20 hours a week) but even that is a hit when you are budgeted for it.
     

    Vigilant

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    Look at the SBA, they are now offering disaster assistance for Covid, and just today I got an email to apply for a $10K advance that will most likely be forgiven. The application had non profits and religion questions on it so churches may be eligible.
     

    KittySlayer

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    Look at the SBA, they are now offering disaster assistance for Covid, and just today I got an email to apply for a $10K advance that will most likely be forgiven. The application had non profits and religion questions on it so churches may be eligible.

    The SBA will be your starting point. Keep in mind your only getting the loan “forgiven” if you are keeping your regular staff employed. If you lay them off or slash hours you have to repay the loan.

    The loan may(?) include rent, mortgage, and utilities but the hammer isn’t it won’t be forgiven unless you are not still paying employees.
     

    Vigilant

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    The SBA will be your starting point. Keep in mind your only getting the loan “forgiven” if you are keeping your regular staff employed. If you lay them off or slash hours you have to repay the loan.

    The loan may(?) include rent, mortgage, and utilities but the hammer isn’t it won’t be forgiven unless you are not still paying employees.
    Go back and reread, they are offering EIDL advances up to $10K that will be forgiven.
     

    KittySlayer

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    Go back and reread, they are offering EIDL advances up to $10K that will be forgiven.
    Thanks for clarifying, I have gotten a couple dozen “expert” articles and they are all over the map.

    This is week is going to look like the chaos of an armored truck crashing and scattering “Free” money all over the highway.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    The SBA will be your starting point. Keep in mind your only getting the loan “forgiven” if you are keeping your regular staff employed. If you lay them off or slash hours you have to repay the loan.

    The loan may(?) include rent, mortgage, and utilities but the hammer isn’t it won’t be forgiven unless you are not still paying employees.

    keeping our employees working all their hours is our primary goal.
     

    HoughMade

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    It's pretty tough to tithe on no income, but most of us still have our jobs. It's those not giving who still have jobs that astound me. Granted, if the church is not set up for online giving, now is the time, but last I looked the USPS still worked and you haven't had to lick a stamp in years.

    Giving to one's local church was never supposed to be about what's left over at the end, it's about faith and commitment even in tough times.

    I hope things look up soon.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    It's pretty tough to tithe on no income, but most of us still have our jobs. It's those not giving who still have jobs that astound me. Granted, if the church is not set up for online giving, now is the time, but last I looked the USPS still worked and you haven't had to lick a stamp in years.

    Giving to one's local church was never supposed to be about what's left over at the end, it's about faith and commitment even in tough times.

    I hope things look up soon.

    Thanks. We have had online giving setup for YEARS. But few use it. Wife and I like it because we dont have to remember our checkbook. It just comes out of the account every week. Unfortunately there are many in our church that just arent tech savvy. At all. And there are a handful of older folks that dont even have DVD players for us to send them DVDs to watch the recorded service after the fact. :facepalm:

    The good news is some are stopping by and tithing as they drop off donations for the food pantry. We are currently in a wait and see, but much like the banks starting to set up even though its not law yet, we are getting prepared in case we need to take advantage of it.
     

    MCgrease08

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    Go back and reread, they are offering EIDL advances up to $10K that will be forgiven.

    I've heard some other folks warning churches to thread lightly and look at loan forgiveness with skepticism. I think it would be naive not to anticipate .gov taking into account where the church stands on social issues when it comes to deciding who gets loans forgiven.

    We've already had Democrats openly pushing to remove tax exempt status from churches and religious organizations. I don't think it would be a stretch to envision a Democrat controlled house or president deciding that churches don't get loans forgiven if they aren't on board the SJW train. Think refusing to perform gay weddings.

    If the student loan forgiveness program is any example, .gov isn't exactly known for keeping it's promises when it comes to forgiving loans.
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/...imulus-bill-affects-churches-and-individuals/

    Im not on the inside loop of dealing with this but have some links from those who are. Will try to post more.

    The key takeaways I have from conversations are that there is 350 billion for this but the eligible payroll is 2.4 trillion so the money will be gone very soon.
    A good working relationship with your bank is key, and I’m told we’re fortunate to be with citizens.
     

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    Vigilant

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    Just to update, we’ll past the 72 hour time limit on disbursements for the “up to $10K grant”, still nothing, along with no progress on the actual SBA loan. Looks as if they really want to bleed small business DRY, and just extend lifelines to large corps. Pretty disillusioned at the moment, laid off my help, and told my subs to stop what they’re doing for me, and I’ll pay them up until today, after today I’ll call them if there’s anything available.
     

    KittySlayer

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    If you want this PPP money to preserve your operations and keep your employees you better get in line fast.

    A good working relationship with your bank is key, and I’m told we’re fortunate to be with citizens.

    ^^^THIS^^^

    I have received multiple personal calls from my banker this past week including Friday around 8:30pm and four calls Saturday morning. He went above and beyond and got our application submitted early Saturday afternoon.

    The SBA was still changing the forms early Friday morning. Rumor was there was a D... measuring contest in the DC swamp between the SBA and Treasury. As much of a s... show as this is wait until forgiveness time rolls around. There will be a lot of failures and bad/defaulted loans this fall.

    For entertainment purposes read the Paperwork Reduction Act part of the instructions. “Recommended time to gather data and prepare form is 8 minutes.” Eight F’n minutes and it wasn’t even printed in purple ink.
     

    Vigilant

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    If you want this PPP money to preserve your operations and keep your employees you better get in line fast.



    ^^^THIS^^^

    I have received multiple personal calls from my banker this past week including Friday around 8:30pm and four calls Saturday morning. He went above and beyond and got our application submitted early Saturday afternoon.

    The SBA was still changing the forms early Friday morning. Rumor was there was a D... measuring contest in the DC swamp between the SBA and Treasury. As much of a s... show as this is wait until forgiveness time rolls around. There will be a lot of failures and bad/defaulted loans this fall.

    For entertainment purposes read the Paperwork Reduction Act part of the instructions. “Recommended time to gather data and prepare form is 8 minutes.” Eight F’n minutes and it wasn’t even printed in purple ink.
    The original EIDL loan app took several hours, if you were attempting anything resembling real numbers, well, it crashed their system, so the SBA launched another streamlined application that included the “grant”. Much quicker, but ZERO info for a bank to base a loan up to $2M on? By now since I have the one app in, and Chase doesn’t really have their ****tigether with the PPP loans yet, by the time I reapply, the $350B will be spoken for.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    The original EIDL loan app took several hours, if you were attempting anything resembling real numbers, well, it crashed their system, so the SBA launched another streamlined application that included the “grant”. Much quicker, but ZERO info for a bank to base a loan up to $2M on? By now since I have the one app in, and Chase doesn’t really have their ****tigether with the PPP loans yet, by the time I reapply, the $350B will be spoken for.


    We use Chase as well. Mainly because the old secretary used to work there. They drop the ball on this one and its off to another bank. They already **** us off by refusing to answer the phone EVER, and taking their sweet time to return our calls. It wasnt until they closed the lobby that we were actually able to get them to answer.
     
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