Join INGunOwners For Free
Page 15 of 18 FirstFirst ... 5 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 LastLast
Results 141 to 150 of 180

Thread: Breaking: Massive explosion in Beirut, Lebanon

  1. #141
    Master

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by SheepDog4Life View Post
    Understandable in that part of the world... but my first thought, and second thought, and current suspicion, after learning that large quantities of AN were seized 7 years ago and housed close to "fireworks" was a bomb making operation.

    I'm no chemist, but my limited understanding was that absent extreme heat and containment (as in the ship at Port of Texas City) it would take a "primary explosive" to detonate ANFO so I'm a skeptic that a "firework" could explosively detonate AN without FO in a relatively open warehouse.

    Again, pure speculation on my part, but I think it cannot be ruled out that one end of this warehouse was a working bomb making shop with ANFO mixed in close enough proximity to HE primary explosive components that this accident was just waiting to happen. Perhaps a couple "finished products" at the end of the line waiting to be shipped?

    It would also explain why 7 years of pleas to sell off the AN were ignored since this was, basically, an endless supply for IED manufacture. And it was "prilled" AN, pelletized for demolition/construction/mining blasting, not fertilizer.

    So, to people that have the knowledge, can powder based fireworks detonate unadulterated AN?
    Not all fireworks are just BP based, esp in other countries.. some concussion effects are
    Potassium perchlorate & metal powder.. and they have quite a shockwave..

  2. #142
    Master johntheplinker's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfhound View Post
    I will take your word on that. I know very little about high explosives. Basically just what I read. The biggest stuff I played around with in the Army was Bangalore torpedoes and we were relatively far away when those went off.

    Unrelated, the people directly responsible for this "accident" are either a fine red mist now or if cartoons are believable, in orbit.
    You got ripped off! When I was in we got to play with all kinds of fun stuff, especially over in Germany. Even got to place charges and blow an actual bridge along with more mundane stuff like cratering charges and abatises(abatisi?).

    And no doubt quite a few of the folks who survived made themselves scarce.
    Tulta munille! HAKKAA PÄÄLLE

  3. #143
    Expert SheepDog4Life's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by singlestacksig View Post
    Not all fireworks are just BP based, esp in other countries.. some concussion effects are
    Potassium perchlorate & metal powder.. and they have quite a shockwave..
    Right... like a big blasting cap.

    Like I said, I'm no expert or even a novice, I just recalled that McVeigh used blasting caps to detonate 350 lbs of Tovex in order to detonate a couple tons of ANMH/ANFO. Basically took a "bomb" to detonate the ANMH bomb.

    I guess if the whole warehouse had been engulfed, with an majority of the AN under intense heat, it would seem more plausible to me that fireworks could detonate it... a lot easier to imagine the "perfect storm".

    Also quite possible that other materials in the warehouse, either coming or going out of the port, ruptured during the fire and made for a more sensitive mixture.

    I guess what really raised my antenna was, if initial news reports are correct, the port and warehouse authorities had issued multiple appeals over the years to allow the AN to be auctioned off and were denied. The cynical appearance is that TPTB wanted to retain it for some reason... forgoing easy money from the auction and incurring storage expenses/space.
    I informed you thusly. I so informed you thusly!

  4. #144
    Grandmaster

    User Info Menu

    Looks like Lebanon is in for further problems. People are really mad about this blast and it appears many are correctly blaming the government.

    Lebanon is bracing itself for a return to the massive demonstrations and riots which gripped the streets for much of last year, leading to closures of highways, banks, and public buildings. Like the years-long banking crisis, the government is seen as directly responsible for this week's epic tragedy.

    Yes people are angry tonight in #Beirut - what does the government expect?
    We basically have been living on a ticking time bomb in this city for the past 6 years with 2,750 tons of ammonium nitrate impounded in Beirut's port since 2014
    It doesn't get much more damning than that.
    The Democrats 2020 policy platform: "Burn it all down"

  5. #145
    Grandmaster

    User Info Menu

    Follow-up on the previous post:

    Shots, tear gas and flames as protests against Beirut explosion grow

    Lebanese riot police fired tear gas at demonstrators trying to break through a barrier to get to the parliament building in Beirut on Saturday and shots were heard in growing protests over this week’s devastating explosion.
    ...
    About 10,000 people gathered in Martyrs’ Square, some throwing stones. Police fired tear gas when some protesters tried to break through the barrier blocking a street leading to parliament, a Reuters journalist said.
    The Democrats 2020 policy platform: "Burn it all down"

  6. #146
    Grandmaster hoosierdoc's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by T.Lex View Post
    Well, there are competing interests - especially there.

    No one wants to get caught sharing it with Hezbollah, but some were probably look for ways to make that happen (at least in small shipments). And others just want to make the money off of it. And with Russians involved, some oligarchs may have wanted a cut, too, but which ones and for how much. I can totally see (most of) it sitting for 6 years.

    And, if I'm Mossad, that works just fine. Its not like this was some secret, apparently.
    even if it's $1000/ton (which would be high).,we're talking maybe $3M.

    that's not a lot of pie to split
    Amazing Grace, how sweet was her sound.

    Love them as if you'll lose them.

  7. #147
    Grandmaster Alamo's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierdoc View Post
    even if it's $1000/ton (which would be high).,we're talking maybe $3M.

    that's not a lot of pie to split
    In a legal market. If you are selling it to terrorist organization like Hezbollah, or you are Hezbollah and you want to move it quietly without the Israelis or anyone else noticing, I suspect the price might be higher.

  8. #148
    Expert wagyu52's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Want to steal some explosives? Take half of it and blow the other half up to cover your tracks.
    Tetelestai.

  9. #149
    Grandmaster Leadeye's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by T.Lex View Post
    Yeah, having seen bureaucracies up close and personal, I have no problem believing that line.

    Plus, in that part of the world, a couple thousand tons of AN can be... lucrative. Part of the delay may've been arguing about how to split up that particular pie.

    Always follow the money
    Where's the Kaboom? There was supposed to be an earth shattering Kaboom.

    Marvin the Martian

  10. #150
    Grandmaster

    User Info Menu

    Very good article from Wired analyzing the Beirut blast from a scientific and forensic perspective. It covers the chemistry, physics and some medical perspectives of the blast and does a lot to dispel some of the more crazy speculations.

    Two interesting details:
    • The primary explosive was the same as the Oklahoma City bombing, but Beirut was about 1000x bigger.
    • Ammonium nitrate for fertilizer has additives to makes it harder to explode. This appears to be a form that is intended for blasting (like in mines).

    The Tragic Physics of the Deadly Explosion in Beirut

    Last edited by Phase2; 08-09-2020 at 04:49.
    The Democrats 2020 policy platform: "Burn it all down"

Page 15 of 18 FirstFirst ... 5 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •