Hassled by Buffalo Wild Wings for OC at Dupont, Fort Wayne

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  • mk2ja

    Master
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    14   0   0
    Aug 20, 2009
    3,615
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    North Carolina
    At approximately 2200 hours on 11 MAR 2011, I entered Buffalo Wild Wings on Dupont Road in Fort Wayne with a friend and a friend of his whom I had only met that night.

    The restaurant was not busy, so we quickly were seated at the table closest to the north east corner of the building (not counting the booths along the wall). Each of us removed our jacket and hung it on the back of the chair. While we decided what to order, we took turns making a trip to wash up; I went last.

    We placed and received our orders. Around the time we'd consumed about three quarters of our meals, a man who appeared to be a manager—though he never introduced himself or identified himself as such—approached our table and knelt beside the empty side of the table. Speaking in a lowered voice, he asked how we were all doing. We were doing fine, we assured him. He then moved on to his primary topic of discussion.

    Unfortunately, I did not record this conversation, so I cannot provide exact quotes, but they express the sentiment and flow of the conversation.

    Addressing me directly, the presumed manager stated that he did not know if I was a cop or if I had a permit. Then he informed me that he had received word from more than one patron that the sight of my openly displayed, holstered sidearm made them uncomfortable. He asked if there was any way I could cover it up.

    I politely declined.

    Pressing, he then asked if I would go place my sidearm in my vehicle.

    Again, I politely declined.

    The manager continued to reiterate these two requests multiple times. "Sir, I'm not sure why you're arguing with me. I'm politely asking you to simply cover it up or go put it in your car."

    Each time, I politely declined. "I understand that. I will not be doing either of those things."

    At one point in the midst of this, our waitress, Kayla, brought another iced tea to the table. Seeing her manager, smiling, she asked jovially, "Are you bothering my table?" He nodded yes and continued his requests; she turned and left.

    "I just want to make my other customers comfortable."

    "Why don't you take this opportunity to explain to them that I am not doing anything wrong, that I am not acting suspiciously, and that there is no reason to be uncomfortable?"

    "I'm just asking you to cover it up or go put it in your car."

    "I will not be doing either of those things. But I'll tell you what, if you want me to leave, I will comply with that request. But if you ask me to leave, I will not be paying for this food. Would you like me to leave?"

    "I can just write down your plate number. But, I just want you to cover it up and go put it in your car. Would you like a cop to come take care of this?"

    I was unconcerned with his threat. "I'm not doing anything illegal, but if you ask me to leave, I'll honor that request because this is your establishment."

    At no time did this man ask, instruct, or imply that I should leave. After several rounds of him asking and me declining, he stood and declared that he would be calling a cop to "come take care of this. They'll be here in a minute."

    As the presumed manager walked away, the friend of my friend looked at me and asked what that was all about. Sarcastically, I replied, "Somebody is unhappy that I have my gun visible to the entire restaurant," and I gestured with my left hand at the dining area. Then came an ironic remark, "Oh, I didn't even know you had a gun!"

    You see, the sidearm was on my right hip, towards the corner, and was not visible to more than the three tables/booths along the wall in the corner. My own friend knows I always carry, often openly, but the topic of whether I was carrying had not come up since the time I met his friend.

    We took our time finishing our meals, and when we were nearly done with our meals, I asked Kayla for our checks. We paid for our meals and then left. The time was 2300 hours.

    No cops arrived.

    But I won't be returning.
     

    mk2ja

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    Aug 20, 2009
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    North Carolina
    Other Facts

    None of us ordered alcoholic beverages.

    We were all wearing jeans.

    I had on a nice Rose-Hulman Engineers polo shirt.

    My face was not smooth-shaven, and I do have a military-style haircut that would need to be trimmed again if I was in the military yet. It's been a couple weeks since my last haircut.

    At one point, he did ask me directly if I had a permit, and I assured him that I did.

    After the man left our table, I verified with my fellow patrons that he had indeed not asked me to leave. They confirmed this. I also prepared my iPhone to record any conversations with law enforcement and instructed my friends that they were not to speak to the cops. My friend already knew that and was planning on saying nothing at all, and the other young man agreed to maintain silence.

    The friend of my friend has never shot a gun, but he had mentioned earlier in the meal that he wants to. I did take the opportunity to explain to him the importance of keeping silent when speaking with cops, to mention the difference between actually being detained by cops or them "simply having a conversation with you," the legality of my actions at the restaurant, and the requirement to leave if asked to leave by the property owner/manager.

    Kayla was pretty cute.
     

    Rookie

    Grandmaster
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    Sep 22, 2008
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    Kokomo
    Nice job of not caving to stupid requests.

    Question: what would be the legal issues of refusing to pay when asked to leave?
     

    gohard43

    Sharpshooter
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    4   0   0
    Apr 16, 2010
    621
    16
    Northside Indy
    Handled very well!!! I'm surprised he hassled you that much.....I've CC in there before..if I ever go back I just may OC!! Nice job though standing your ground :yesway:
     

    sj kahr k40

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
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    0   0   0
    Sep 3, 2009
    7,726
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    You handled that great, way to not be intimidated by the supposed manager, and I'm all for a OC event at Bdubs!
     

    mk2ja

    Master
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    14   0   0
    Aug 20, 2009
    3,615
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    North Carolina
    Nice job of not caving to stupid requests.

    Question: what would be the legal issues of refusing to pay when asked to leave?

    I'm not exactly sure, so I'm pretty glad that didn't actually come into play. I would only have refused to pay for the service provided by the restaurant if the restaurant expelled me.

    Oh, and I know someone will say it, so I wanna be first. OC event at BW3?

    I don't want anybody to be able claim that I had a bad experience, so I went and got all my gun-toting buddies to come give them a hassle in return. So with that in mind, I would not want to organize the event, but I'd certainly attend :ingo:
     

    ATM

    will argue for sammiches.
    Site Supporter
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    30   0   0
    Jul 29, 2008
    21,019
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    Crawfordsville
    Sounds like a very calm conversation. Well done.

    You gave him some polite facts to consider and it seems to have given him pause on pressing you any further.

    If there were in fact other customers who complained, I'm sure they were given pause as well. They'll just have to reconcile whatever fear they thought justified with the uneventful outcome of your peaceful meal.
     

    mk2ja

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Aug 20, 2009
    3,615
    48
    North Carolina
    Handled very well!!! I'm surprised he hassled you that much.....I've CC in there before..if I ever go back I just may OC!! Nice job though standing your ground :yesway:

    You handled that great, way to not be intimidated by the supposed manager, and I'm all for a OC event at Bdubs!

    Thanks, guys! I know it is a touchy situation because if anything were to escalate, I would be in deep poo-poo. So I was very careful that I did not raise my voice or even appear to be agitated or emotional. Calm, cool, collected. I chose my words very carefully.

    I actually almost quoted Pirates of the Caribbean:
    "I am disinclined to acquiesce to your request."

    But I didn't. I didn't wanna be cheesy. THAT would have been the real crime.
     

    mk2ja

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    14   0   0
    Aug 20, 2009
    3,615
    48
    North Carolina
    Sounds like a very calm conversation. Well done.

    You gave him some polite facts to consider and it seems to have given him pause on pressing you any further.

    If there were in fact other customers who complained, I'm sure they were given pause as well. They'll just have to reconcile whatever fear they thought justified with the uneventful outcome of your peaceful meal.

    Thanks, ATM. He seemed to think that by tossing out the idea that the cops were coming that I would backpedal and change my mind. But those who are in the right have no reason to fear. Even if the cops arrived, I anticipated no real issues.

    I've been to that BWW several times with no issues. I'm surprised. That's one location I will not be returning to. Thanks for sharing.

    Yeah, I've been there a few times before, too, even OC'ing. He didn't seem too concerned about me *having* my sidearm as evidenced by the fact that simply covering it up would have satisfied him. But I did not want to do that and I was under no obligation to do that.

    It is vital that those of us who carry know exactly what our rights are and which ones we are willing to surrender.
     

    SirRealism

    Master
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    0   0   0
    Nov 17, 2008
    1,779
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    It sounds as though you handled it quite well. Congrats on remaining calm. If you were truly offending that many of his patrons, he could have asked you to leave. It makes you wonder whether anyone actually complained in the first place.
     

    bat54r

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Mar 1, 2009
    234
    16
    Fort Wayne
    I've also been to that BWW several times but the only time I have OC'ed was for a take out order and no one said a word to me, I guess I wasn't there long enough for some sheeple to see my sidearm and get butt-hurt. If an OC event were held there I would also attend. To the OP.....Well played sir, you handled that situation very well.
     

    femurphy77

    Grandmaster
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    30   0   0
    Mar 5, 2009
    20,268
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    S.E. of disorder
    O.k, this is how it went from the managers viewpoint;

    "I approached the obviously agitated young man who had been staring menacingly at the other customers all night. As I walked up to the table he started stroking the barrel of his barrett .50 cal in almost a sexual way and ordered me to kneel next to it.

    Knowing that I could have easily taken his life with the olive pit that I had just picked up off the floor I complied so as not to alarm the other patrons in the area. I told him and his guests that they WOULD finish their meals quietly, they WOULD pay for the meals and tip the waitress generously and that they WOULD do this post haste.

    Seeing my obvious superior intellect and masculinity, the agitated assailant immediately dropped his hand from his side and complied with my orders. As I got up to leave the table I assured his two, cowering by now, friends that they were very lucky that night that they weren't going to be making funeral arrangements.

    As an aside I told the beligerent "gentlemen" to wash my car and check the air in the tires before they left the parking lot!

    Now everybody get back to work and be sure to use warm water to top off the ketchup bottles on the tables because it mixes better with the ketchup still in the bottle.":rockwoot:


    In reality, good response on your part, very well handled in not allowing him to bring you down to his level of paranoia and escalation of a non-issue to a 10 o'clock newsworthy story!
     

    drgnrobo

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    11   0   0
    Mar 9, 2009
    1,492
    2
    ft. wayne
    You handled as well was anyone could & kept a cool head. A restaurant usually loses my business when this narrow minded thinking occurs with a legal gun owner .
     

    melensdad

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 94.7%
    18   1   0
    Apr 2, 2008
    23,986
    77
    Far West Suburban Lowellabama
    Apparently you did not see this posted by the door?

    images.jpg

    There are many threads where people have indicated that BWW is anti-gun. Letters and emails from their corporate office, which have also been posted many times, confirm they are an anti-gun business.

    We should not be giving our hard earned cash to businesses that are openly hostile to law abiding citizens and the 2nd Amendment.


    JMO
     
    Rating - 100%
    17   0   0
    Feb 24, 2009
    939
    16
    Beech Grove, IN
    Apparently you did not see this posted by the door?


    images.jpg

    There are many threads where people have indicated that BWW is anti-gun. Letters and emails from their corporate office, which have also been posted many times, confirm they are an anti-gun business.

    We should not be giving our hard earned cash to businesses that are openly hostile to law abiding citizens and the 2nd Amendment.


    JMO

    x2 - I personally dont spend my money at any business when I see a sign like that.
     
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