Carry gun selection

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  • BehindBlueI's

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    Why listen to me? Easy answer, don’t. These are all just thinking points based on my own experience. Carry whatever you choose, I just ask that you apply some logical and critical thinking to that choice. I call the logical decision making process “the calculus of risk”. Forming a realistic expectation of the situations you might encounter, your chances of being able to overcome that situation with a specific handgun, and your dedication to carrying a specific handgun.

    What is my experience? An adult life spent carrying a firearm domestically and overseas, but more importantly years in law enforcement dealing with people on the receiving end of violence. As a beat car I worked one of the highest homicide areas in the city. As a detective I work exclusively with robberies, people shot or stabbed or otherwise critically injured/killed. I haven’t kept count over the years but am into the triple digits on dealing with shootings. Many people bring experience to the table, and I read as much as I can, but everyone has some limitations. Coroners only see the ones who died, ER folks only see those who lived long enough to transport, and researchers tend to believe that people are denim clad bricks of jelly. While all of these bring knowledge to the table, each is limited in their own way. While not an expert in any of their field’s, I’m a fair hand at all of them. Overseas I’ve dabbled in threat analysis and protection plans, etc.

    How do I decide what’s a realistic threat? Gaven De Becker has several good books and even an automated computer program (MOSAIC) that helps answer that, but good ol’ common sense will get you close. Do you have anyone actively seeking to harm you? A domestic violence situation? Fired someone from work who’s sending threats? Arrest someone who’s posting on their Facebook they’re going to kill you? Al-Queda documents found that put a bounty on your head? Or are you worried about random violence? You know your neighborhood, your acquaintances, your co-workers, the crime rate in the areas you travel, yes? These are going to come into play. I’ve received credible death threats and had a terrorist bounty on my head, along with the rest of my crew, complete with photographs found in a cache. You can be assured I took additional safety measures during my remaining time in country. Remember that threat level changes, reevaluate when your situation changes.

    Now that I’ve gotten my threat level, how much risk do I believe I am likely to face? Here’s where I’ll lose people. There are lots of folks who will say prepare for the absolute worst scenario you may ever face. Those people should be considering a crew served weapon for when armored ninjas attack at battalion strength. A handgun is not a worst case scenario weapon. Handguns suck. Repeat it. Handguns suck. The only reason to carry a handgun of ANY KIND is convenience and concealability. You've already made the decision to trade effectiveness for convenience by not carrying a long gun, so don't get your panties twisted that someone else is placing the slide a bit further up or down the convenience/threat scale.

    The rest of us, facing no specific credible threat, are a bit more free when it comes to weapon selection. The remainder of this post will assume that your threat assessment results in either one dedicated individual seeking to harm you or, even more likely, no specific credible threat and an average risk of random violence.
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    How important is round count?

    Different people are going to have an acceptable minimum, but based on no specific credible threat and an average exposure to random violence, a typical encounter will have you shooting 3 rounds or less. More rounds is psychological satisfying, as is the availability of a reload. One officer talked about how good it felt to have a fresh magazine to reload with after he put down two armed robbers in a restaurant where he was off duty with his family. Note that the encounter was over. The majority of stories you see are like this. "I only had two rounds left, WHAT IF there had been another one" or WHAT if he hadn't fled or WHAT IF, etc. etc. I have yet to come across someone who was unsuccessful in a self-defense attempt who had emptied their gun. Again, hundreds of people shot, not one had an empty gun. They were either unarmed, disarmed, or never got a chance to unholster.

    Based on that, I put the floor at 5 rounds. More is better. Unless you are trying to swim or are on fire, you'll never regret having too much ammo, but round count alone should be of low value in your selection of a handgun for carry.

    The following events are actual events and illustrate the typical encounter:

    Anecdote #1:
    Victim approached by 3 armed suspects, victim attempts to draw his weapon, victim shot without getting the chance to fire, victim is presumably incapacitated and doesn't return fire, weapon found functional and fully loaded.
    Anecdote #2:
    Victim approached by armed suspect, victim draws weapon and fires one shot, striking suspect in head, kills suspect.
    Anecdote #3:
    Victim approached by armed suspect, victim draws and fires two shots, strikes suspect in abdomen with one, misses second shot, suspect flees. Victim later turns up at local hospital.
    Anecdote #4:
    Victim approached by two suspects, one of which is known to suspect to be a credible threat. Victim displays handgun in an attempt to discourage violence, unknown suspect shoots victim twice and flees. Victim retreats and doesn't return fire.
     
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    BehindBlueI's

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    How important is caliber?

    Ah, the religion of caliber. In full disclosure, I'm an archbishop of the church of the .45.

    What calibers should I consider?
    With modern HP ammunition, any common defensive handgun caliber is sufficient for the majority of situations. I put the floor at .380 and the ceiling at .45APC, perhaps 10mm.

    My specific recommendation (assuming no arthritis, disability, etc) would be: 9mm, .38+P/.357, .40S&W, or .45 APC. There are differences between them, but the differences are minor in ending threats. If you like the grip angle, sights, etc. that's all going to be much more important than the difference between these calibers.

    They are commonly available, relatively inexpensive, quality defensive ammo is available and they are all fight stoppers. If you already own a .380. .45 GAP, .357 Sig, etc. there's no reason to rush out and replace it, but I wouldn't specifically seek out those calibers if I were purchasing a new pistol. Modern metallurgy and polymers have made some very small, lightly recoiling, pistols in the more intermediate cartridges, pushing .380 out of the niche it once occupied. .357 Sig, .45 GAP, and other boutique ammos can be tough to source and don't do anything the more common and proven calibers don't.

    What calibers should I avoid:

    .25 is the absolute last caliber you should carry. Even a headshot is not a reliable stopper. Other than perhaps a .22 short, I can't think of a less effective caliber.

    Anecdote #1: Victim is shot in stomach with .25 at almost contact distance, falls and attempts to crawl to safety. Shot again in the back, continues to crawl, is somehow flipped over and 4 rounds are put into his face at near contact distance.
    Anecdote #2: Victim, a uniformed police officer, is shot in the back of the head with a .25 at contact distance. Victim thinks he was punched in back of head, turns around to see firearm, gun fight ensues, suspect killed.

    .22, .32, .38S&W, etc are all underperforming rounds that should be avoided if possible.

    Why is the .380 your minimum?
    With quality ammo it will break a femur at reasonable self-defense ranges. It will penetrate deep enough into a torso or abdomen to reach vital organs and major blood vessels, and it can penetrate a skull.

    Why is 10mm your maximum?
    Quality ammo for the bigger calibers tends to be hunting cartridges. Hunting cartridges are not engineered the same as defensive rounds and will not be as effective in that capacity. The same reason I warn away from odd ball calibers, like the .41 magnum, that would otherwise be excellent choices. You are also getting into the territory where you are giving up more in control and followup shots than you are gaining in effectiveness.

    Why do you choose .45?
    Intermediate barriers, which are a real possibility in my line of work. Heavier/slower bullets hold together better and retain more velocity after going through an intermediate barrier. I feel quite comfortable with a .38+P when jogging or the like where the likely scenarios are different.

    What about muzzle energy, muzzle energy, etc? I'll over that in the next post.
     
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    BehindBlueI's

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    How important is over penetration?

    Closely related to caliber wars, but I will tell you that over penetration is never a concern for me in a defensive handgun. I've yet to come across the first fatality resulting from a handgun round that went through one person and struck another with enough force to injure or kill.

    [ame]http://www.amazon.com/Gunshot-Wounds-Ballistics-Techniques-Investigations/dp/0849381630[/ame]

    Per this book, a .38 needs to be traveling at 191 fps to penetrate human skin. A HP bullet traveling through two layers of skin and 6" of muscle (say an upper arm), has lost about 300fps. So it is possible to get a hit and it travel with enough force to injure someone else. However its extremely unlikely, and concerns about over penetration are greatly exaggerated when it comes to handguns.

    1) Bullets don't keep going straight once they hit a human body. We are not made of ballistic jelly, we are made of multiple types of tissue with different levels of...viscosity I suppose is the best term. Bones and dense muscle can deflect a bullet, keeping it in the body or routing it back out but at a different angle

    Anecdote #1: Victim shot in the buttock with .45 FMJ, it deflects up into abdomen and rapid bleed out causes death.
    Anecdote #2: Victim is shot in the chest with a .45 HP, no vital organs in chest hit, but it deflected down into abdomen, severed an artery, and he died under medical care
    Anecdote #3: Victim shot in chest with .45 FMJ, bullet penetrates skin, catches a rib, rides rib around under the skin, exits the back, victim awake and talking.
    Anecdote #4: Victim shot through arm into chest wall with .357 Magnum FMJ, runs half a block to house, walks back when police arrive. Awake and talking during medical care.

    2) Quality HP expands and begins to fragment, further slowing it, reducing its ability to penetrate a second target. It also richochets less and fragments easier. This is why HP ammo originally existed. Early HP ammo and FMJ ammo were statistically the same at causing fatalities. Modern HP ammo is significantly more advanced and expands more reliably than early HP rounds.

    Anecdote #1: Victim is sitting in car, 9mm HP enters car door, grazes thigh, and then bounces off of center console. Expanded round found in floor board.

    I am more concerned with underpenetration and its failure to stop an aggressor, and that aggressor being able to continue to cause harm, than overpenetration injuring someone else.
     
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    BehindBlueI's

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    What criteria should I consider?

    Now you're getting into the meat and potatoes of the decision. Eliminate pistols that don't conform to your required round count minimum and your preferred calibers. This will still leave you with a significant amount of choices, so let's narrow it down.

    What's my budget?
    Pretty obvious, you can eliminate pistols that cost more than you are willing to spend. Don't forget to include the cost of a quality holster, spare magazines/speed loaders, practice ammo, and carry ammo. Avoid crappy guns. Research the failure rate of a particular handgun, stick to known quality brands, and don't skimp on the holster or carry ammunition. There are quality firearms at very low price points, and there are trash guns at higher price points.

    What fits my hand?
    This is huge, and should be one of your prime considerations. A grip that is too small or too large will result in a handgun you can't accurately shoot. Grip angle is very important, and often overlooked. The gun should point naturally for you. While training will overcome poor grip angle choice (and remember this is a personal fit, what fits your body mechanics may not fit mine), you will always have to work harder to be good with a gun that's a poor fit for you. I carry a Taurus snub nose because the grip angle of the modern S&W snubbies (and my hatrd for the keyhole, but another story) results in me having to cock my wrists more for a straight shot. The Taurus is more natural for me. Similarly, I carry a Sig over a Glock and a single stack over a double stack for the same reasons.

    What sights do I want?
    Your eye sight matters in this decision. I am partially color blind for red and must take that into consideration when selecting a sight system.
    Ideally, you want a high visibility sight set up that is durable and easy to acquire. You do not want target sights, they give up speed for accuracy. You do not want "big dots", which are the opposite extreme. You want combat sights, a blend of speed and accuracy. I prefer night sights for a duty weapon, for a regular carry weapon a high visibility set up like on the XDS is tough to argue with.
    Adjustable or fixed, both have their advantages. For pocket or ankle carry, fixed and low profile (snag free) is to be preferred. For a belt holster, especially a hooded one, adjustable sights become more of an option.
    Lasers and red dots have their advantages and disadvantages, study and train with them before making your decision to incorporate, but for a carry gun you MUST have quality irons you are comfortable with.

    What size do I want?
    I am comfortable carrying a full sized pistol in the majority of my activities, but sometimes (like at the gym) I want a smaller and less obstrusive carry piece. Understand what you want and how you will carry it. As long as the weapon meets your other criteria (capacity, caliber, grip, etc), that is. Be honest with yourself if you'll actually carry a larger pistol, if you are willing to take the discomfort or change your wardrobe around it. Remember effective holster selection can make a larger gun carry like a smaller one, and poor holster selection will make a smaller pistol carry like a larger one. Statistics on a piece of paper don't tell the whole story. Guns with the exact same listed dimensions may be shaped differently, resulting in a feel more or less to your liking than their supposed dimensional twin.

    Can I control the recoil of this weapon?
    Remember that caliber is only part of the recoil equation. A subcompact 9mm may very well have more felt recoil than a full sized .45 and be harder to bring back on target. If you can't get a proper grip, or the grip isn't shaped for your hand, recoil will be exacerbated. Bore axis and spring weight matter, a lower bore axis will push more straight back into the hand but have less muzzle flip. Really, the best way to determine this is to simply shoot the gun you are considering.

    What type of trigger and safety system do I want?
    Understand the advantages and disadvantages of SAO, DA/SA, DAO or striker fired. Understand the difference trigger travel and weight will have on your shooting. Typically, a lighter trigger with less travel is easier to shoot well. You should be able to comfortably pull the trigger without straining, the trigger should feel smooth and should break (fire the gun) must be consistent, preferably with minimal stacking but enough feel to be predictable. Reset, the point at which the trigger has moved forward enough to be ready to fire again, should be consistent and predictable. Remember weight and smoothness can be adjusted to a point via trigger kits and gun smithing. If you don't like the trigger, you will not like the gun. If you want a manual safety, be sure you can operate it quickly under stress. There are many firearms that have a safety that is too small or too stiff to reliably operate under in a sudden encounter.

    So, to summarize:
    You will never reach your potential with a gun that doesn't fit YOUR hand and preferred grip angle.
    You will never reach your potential with a gun that has inconsistent or poor trigger feel.
    Sights are a major limiting factor for handgun, you must choose something that you can quickly acquire and make accurate shots with.
    Choose something you will practice with and carry consistently.

    If the gun doesn't fit you, the caliber, round count, etc. are meaningless debates.
     
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    BehindBlueI's

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    How important is a backup?

    I consistently carry a backup while on duty, but am less concerned with it off duty depending on the situation. There are scenarios were a backup may come into play, and if you can comfortably and consistently carry one there is no reason not to. Just realize that in most self-defense scenarios you are not going to have time to switch weapons before the situation is resolved, one way or another. I carry a backup because people tend to know I am armed and if there is a struggle over my main weapon I still have...a backup. If I am ambushed in a physical fight and my main weapon is pinned or between me and the ground, I can get to my backup. These considerations are because of my job and specific threats, when I'm out of town and back into "regular guy facing regular random violence", I am much less concerned with having a backup on me.

    Isn't it all about shot placement?

    No. As some of my earlier anecdotes showed, shot placement doesn't guarantee bullet path and even a torso or head shot may fail to immediately incapcitate. Hence the importance of being able to control your weapon, get sights back on target quickly, and be ready for additional shots.
    Anecdote #1: Police shooting, suspect is hit in the chest with a .223 round and at least one .40 S&W round. Suspect falls, but immediately gets back up and continues to engage in a running gun battle for approximately 2 more city blocks.
    Anecdote #2: Suspect shot in the upper thigh with a .22 LR at near contact distance, flees. Shows up at hospital later.

    How important is ammo selection?

    Note that some calibers are more ammo sensitive than others. Different twist rates will have different levels of accuracy with different bullet weights, etc. This can be pretty pronounced or it may barely be noticable, hence the reason you shoot a little bit of everything to see what your gun 'likes'.

    Purchase quality HP ammo for your carry weapon. The debate on SXTs vs Gold dots vs Hydrashocks vs....is splitting hairs. Is one slightly better than another? Probably in a given scenario but not in another. Its easy to over think. Buy several different types of carry ammo, see which one is most accurate and controllable in your pistol and feeds with no issues, carry that.

    What do you carry?
    My primary and preferred weapon is a Sig P220 .45. The grip fits my hand, the trigger is great, the sights are appropriate, etc. In short, it meets all of my criteria as laid out above.
    My backup and secondary carry weapon is a Taurus ultralight .38 revolver. I've shot more expensive snubbies and none have been a good of a fit for me other than a Colt that was out of my price range at the time.
    I also regularly shoot a Glock 22, as its my issued duty weapon and if I'm ever detailed for a uniformed assignment I have to carry it.
     
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    churchmouse

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    We base our decisions on confidence with our hand and long gun choices. Round count is taken seriously but if you are a competent shooter (under stress) then it is not as important if you are only concerned with random violence. I doubt we will be facing a battalion of raging Ninjas but if we run into that I will remember this thread.
    I and my son carry 1911 variants. He carry's a double stack Hi-Cap .45 ACP and I choose a single stack but with the 10 rd CM Mags.
    Son in law carry's H&K USP in .45 ACP.
    Daughter uses a .44 special CA bulldog very effectively.
    Wife prefers a .22LR as she can not deal with recoil generated from larger calibers.

    This has been greatly expanded since being posted. Good stuff. Easy read and makes sense.
     
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    Ryan53957

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    By valid points but I think another good point is what are you wearing. If I'm walking around town in shorts and a t shirt it's a heck of a lot harder for me to carry my S&W 40 full size than when I am wearing a suit or jeans and a jacket. But with that said it is also a big deal with how comfortable you carry with different concealment systems (if your carrying concealed)
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    By valid points but I think another good point is what are you wearing. If I'm walking around town in shorts and a t shirt it's a heck of a lot harder for me to carry my S&W 40 full size than when I am wearing a suit or jeans and a jacket. But with that said it is also a big deal with how comfortable you carry with different concealment systems (if your carrying concealed)

    Covered:

    What size do I want?
    I am comfortable carrying a full sized pistol in the majority of my activities, but sometimes (like at the gym) I want a smaller and less obstrusive carry piece. Understand what you want and how you will carry it. As long as the weapon meets your other criteria (capacity, caliber, grip, etc), that is. Be honest with yourself if you'll actually carry a larger pistol, if you are willing to take the discomfort or change your wardrobe around it.
     

    churchmouse

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    Wardrobe. Easy to conceal in fall/winter. More difficult in spring/summer. Full size semi-auto is tough to hide. I too am a firm follower of the .45 ACP but T-shirt weather makes it hard to do.
    IWB 5 shot snub .44 special does not print if the shirt is loose.
    WE always CC. Willing to adjust EDC and wardrobe for given occasion.
     
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    Cemetery-man

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    Interesting. Was just discussing this at work today with a co-worker. She was telling me she wants to start carrying a gun and was thinking about a small compact. She also said that she doesn't need to get a license because she's going to open carry it.
     

    Lil Bob

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    Thank you for the post. I am still considering what to carry. I have both a compact and subcompact 9mm. I read many different arguments over the need to have a hi capacity weapon versus a compact and those that do not think it is that important. I have struggled with this. I think in the end you have a good argument that makes sense. Choose the one that fits and one that you handle well. I think that I will take them back out to the range and shoot some more and make a choice between the two of them based on how I shoot with them not on round capacity.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Interesting. Was just discussing this at work today with a co-worker. She was telling me she wants to start carrying a gun and was thinking about a small compact. She also said that she doesn't need to get a license because she's going to open carry it.

    Yeah, I had to stick my nose into a conversation at Lowes a year or so ago. Two clerks chatting and one was giving the other ALL kinds of bad advice. As soon as he spewed that gem I couldnt keep my yap shut any longer. Even broke out my pink permission slip to have them show me where it specified concealed, and then elaborated on exactly what "LTCH" meant.

    Thank you for the post. I am still considering what to carry. I have both a compact and subcompact 9mm. I read many different arguments over the need to have a hi capacity weapon versus a compact and those that do not think it is that important. I have struggled with this. I think in the end you have a good argument that makes sense. Choose the one that fits and one that you handle well. I think that I will take them back out to the range and shoot some more and make a choice between the two of them based on how I shoot with them not on round capacity.

    Yes. And remember a small gun in your hand is better than a big gun in the vault. Carry, and carry often. I dont think anyone here would fault you for carrying your subcompact.
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    Thank you for the post. I am still considering what to carry. I have both a compact and subcompact 9mm. I read many different arguments over the need to have a hi capacity weapon versus a compact and those that do not think it is that important. I have struggled with this. I think in the end you have a good argument that makes sense. Choose the one that fits and one that you handle well. I think that I will take them back out to the range and shoot some more and make a choice between the two of them based on how I shoot with them not on round capacity.

    Good man. If you've got a timer and a target, you can get some objective information instead of going by 'feel'. I 'feel' better with my P229, but the timers say I shoot the P226 better by an Nth degree. If its a tie, carry the bigger capacity one IF you're willing to dedicate the effort into doing so consistently. Remember, there's nothing wrong with capacity, just not at the expense of fast and accurate.
     

    whiteoak

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    I have seen more shooting videos now that cameras are everywhere including dash cams like everyone else, and one thing that I have noticed is prolonged gun battles are not the norm. I agree with your conclusion that conflicts seem to end, or someone runs quickly once rounds start flying. Especially if some thug just picked a person or place to rob a random. I may just be justifying my sticking with a 6 shot snubbie in my own mind, but I still feel pretty well armed with the little Colt, even with "better options in the safe. But the K9 is getting a little more holster time also. One of the best things to come along in CCW firearms in my lifetime, has been the influx of the slim light 9mm carry gun class that has so many new options. It just seems like such a logical choice for CCW its not surprising how popular the small single stack nines are selling.
     

    Bfish

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    I have read this thread before but I guess I never did comment on it. Just wanted to say that its very good stuff BBI, I always like reading what you have to say. Thanks for putting this out there even if it was awhile back!
     
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