NFA TRUST FAQ's

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  • hmaverick

    Plinker
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    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
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    Greenfield, IN
    Well, I thought I would try to add to the community by giving people a place to ask questions about gun trusts and their utilization. Ask away folks, I'm here to help.... and yes I am an attorney and yes I have done hundreds of these.
     

    Tactically Fat

    Grandmaster
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    22   0   0
    Oct 8, 2014
    8,270
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    Indiana
    Should a trust formed for NFA items only be used for NFA items?

    What about large assets like real estate? Or would it be more wise to establish another trust for things of that nature?
     

    T.Lex

    Grandmaster
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    15   0   0
    Mar 30, 2011
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    Should a trust formed for NFA items only be used for NFA items?

    What about large assets like real estate? Or would it be more wise to establish another trust for things of that nature?
    It depends. You should talk to an estate lawyer about your own specific situation.

    An NFA trust, generally, is revocable (at least in name - if it is revoked, that'd be bad for anyone possessing the NFA items). Depending on the situation, tax advantages may require an irrevocable trust. There are other permutations that may be important.

    Saying it the other way, I do not believe that the BATFE requires an NFA trust to only hold NFA items. So, you could put something else in there, but I'm not sure it would help anything.
     

    usmcdjb

    Sharpshooter
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    118   0   0
    Jan 16, 2010
    553
    27
    Wabash County
    OK, T.Lex said something that gets my wheels turning. What would happen if the trust ceased to exist (were revoked)? I have a beneficiary listed, and a trustee to hold the stuff until they are of age. So, does the trust cease to exist really until that point? Or do we have unowned NFA items floating around out there?

    I also have a situation I've been pondering - let's say one has a pending form 1 or form 4 with a trust. And during the wait time, they move, say out of state. What happens in this case? I believe the trust still exists. But the trustor/trustee is no longer where they were when they submitted the paperwork.
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    Should a trust formed for NFA items only be used for NFA items?

    What about large assets like real estate? Or would it be more wise to establish another trust for things of that nature?

    Most set up separate trust. I have done as many as 3 for people. One for their estate, one for their standard firearms and collectibles, and one for NFA items. The benefit is the ease of adding and removing items to the simpler trusts and the typical difference in beneficiaries and trustees, while still keeping peoples normal firearm collections out of the ATF's eyes. When someone does an NFA trust through me I can add a trust with sometimes different beneficiaries and different trustees for people to disperse their other firearms.
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    OK, T.Lex said something that gets my wheels turning. What would happen if the trust ceased to exist (were revoked)? I have a beneficiary listed, and a trustee to hold the stuff until they are of age. So, does the trust cease to exist really until that point? Or do we have unowned NFA items floating around out there?

    I also have a situation I've been pondering - let's say one has a pending form 1 or form 4 with a trust. And during the wait time, they move, say out of state. What happens in this case? I believe the trust still exists. But the trustor/trustee is no longer where they were when they submitted the paperwork.

    If you want a trust revoked at any point, the items will have to be transferred from the trust before that happens. They would be form 4'd to yourself or to another party. You'd want the atf to be notified of the address change and the trust address should be amended if you were to move mid application
     

    bigelowe

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 14, 2012
    290
    18
    bullitt county
    Why do some trusts include a schedule A and some do not? Why would you want a schedule A? Is it necessary to have a place for trustees to sign the trust for validity?


    I really want to set up an NFA trust, but it seems there are a lot of variances and indescrepencies from one trust to another. I dont want any trouble or questions. Lol
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
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    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    Ha. never had any trouble with mine. I prefer schedule A. much easier to add and remove property and does not require continuing lawyer usage.

    it's not necessary for trustees to sign the trust for validity.
     

    bigelowe

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 14, 2012
    290
    18
    bullitt county
    It seems one is putting a lot of trust in your nfa dealer and its employees by providing them with an itemized list of all your nfa items, your address and other pertinent information each time you buy a new nfa item that requires the tax stamp, since you have to supply a copy of the trust in its entirety to the BATFE everytime you apply for a stamp. Just my .02$
     

    stephen87

    Grandmaster
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    22   0   0
    May 26, 2010
    6,658
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    The Seven Seas
    Is there an age limit for a NFA trust? For example, I would like to set one up with myself and my family. My son is ALMOST one, but I want him included on there (with someone I trust with my NFA property) in case something were to happen to my girlfriend and me so he may possess them once he turns 18. Is that possible, or does he have to be of legal age to legally possess the item in question?
     

    indyjohn

    PATRIOT
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    Dec 26, 2010
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    In the trees
    Generally speaking, who (what?) is listed as the 'Grantor'?

    And are the 'Trustee'(s) those members of the trust that are to have access/rights to the property in question?
     

    tatic05

    Expert
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    20   0   0
    Dec 3, 2011
    1,205
    38
    Ft. Wayne
    Is there an age limit for a NFA trust? For example, I would like to set one up with myself and my family. My son is ALMOST one, but I want him included on there (with someone I trust with my NFA property) in case something were to happen to my girlfriend and me so he may possess them once he turns 18. Is that possible, or does he have to be of legal age to legally possess the item in question?

    I believe for NFA items they need to be 21. They can be on the trust but can't take possession until they are if age.
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
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    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    I believe for NFA items they need to be 21. They can be on the trust but can't take possession until they are if age.

    I do err on the side of caution. I set them up so that if you die before your beneficiaries reach 21 that the trustees take care of the property until your beneficiaries reach 21.
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
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    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    I do err on the side of caution. I set them up so that if you die before your beneficiaries reach 21 that the trustees take care of the property until your beneficiaries reach 21.

    Technically one can possess as a trustee at 18 but once again, I typically don't allow trustees in my trusts below the age of 18. I like trustees having full power to do anything and you cannot purchase an Nfa weapon at 18
     

    stephen87

    Grandmaster
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    May 26, 2010
    6,658
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    The Seven Seas
    Okay, if you would not include them on the trust, what would you recommend for them? I am not in a high risk lifestyle or career, but I drive a lot and accidents happen. If I were to die before my son hit 18, what would the options be? Obviously, I could have money set aside for items to be transferred either to him or to a new trust, but aside from that?
     

    hmaverick

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Oct 4, 2014
    89
    8
    Greenfield, IN
    Okay, if you would not include them on the trust, what would you recommend for them? I am not in a high risk lifestyle or career, but I drive a lot and accidents happen. If I were to die before my son hit 18, what would the options be? Obviously, I could have money set aside for items to be transferred either to him or to a new trust, but aside from that?

    I would make him a beneficiary. Select a trustee or two and if something were to happen to you, the items would stay with the trustees until your son reached legal age.


    Marc Halata
     
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