Picked Up My Last Suppressor And Dealer Said They Had to Call In My 4473 Form

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  • Gluemanz28

    Grandmaster
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    Mar 4, 2013
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    So I picked up my last suppressor tonight and the dealer said they were required to call in my info after filling out my 4473.

    I asked why they needed to call it in and they said it was required.

    I told them that it must be their rules and not required by the ATF. The young guy said the owner has been doing this for 20 years and knows what he is doing.

    I never got rude but I did tell him that I have picked up three others and and the 4473 was not called in.
    He still stuck by his policy put forth by the owner.

    I let him know I wasn't upset with him, but driving 1.5 hours to their shop and get a delay from the ATF would not make me happy and cause me to not use their shop.

    The guy even said calling in my info could tell them if all people on my trust are proper persons.

    They received a proceed so I was able to bring home my last can so all is good.
     

    Trigger Time

    Air guitar master
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    204   3   0
    Aug 26, 2011
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    So I picked up my last suppressor tonight and the dealer said they were required to call in my info after filling out my 4473.

    I asked why they needed to call it in and they said it was required.

    I told them that it must be their rules and not required by the ATF. The young guy said the owner has been doing this for 20 years and knows what he is doing.

    I never got rude but I did tell him that I have picked up three others and and the 4473 was not called in.
    He still stuck by his policy put forth by the owner.

    I let him know I wasn't upset with him, but driving 1.5 hours to their shop and get a delay from the ATF would not make me happy and cause me to not use their shop.

    The guy even said calling in my info could tell them if all people on my trust are proper persons.

    They received a proceed so I was able to bring home my last can so all is good.
    So there had been some confusion by some atf examiners on this. Some previously had told ffl's they didn't need to call in a 4473 on suppressors on trusts and maybe non trusts processed suppressor. I know for sure on the trusts ones they were told they didn't have to.
    Then right around the same time the new 41p or f or whatever it is called was being pushed through last year they started changing what they were telling dealers. So dealers that never ran a 4473 on suppressors when they were picked up by the stamp holder started calling them in. That's because they were being penalized in their audits by the examiners even though they had been told by an examiner they didn't have to do it.
    This was bad info put out by the atf via some examiners. Not all of the examiners passed on this bad info. So some shops always had called them in.
    When you pick up your suppressor the 4473 you fill out must be called in. This is law according to the atf.
    If you get a delay don't blame the shop because they are complying with the law in order to keep their license (sot tax status) and themselves out of jail. Be mad at the feds and write or call your representation to get the law or regulations changed
     
    Last edited:

    ljk

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    May 21, 2013
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    Is yours on a Trust pre 41F?

    I can't only speak of pre-41F, which there is NO background check on the transferee at all.

    It's up to the individual FFL to decide. Also the ATF auditor plays a role too.

    I have had multiple suppressors transfered by the same shop, the earlier ones just fill/sign, the later ones they actually put through the NICS with NTN. In my case, Profire and USDS to be exact.

    Both shops explained to me that they were instructed by the ATF auditor to run the NICS sometime around early 2015.

    M&J, Premier Arms, Narrow Target always ran the NICS, ACME didn't.
     

    Trigger Time

    Air guitar master
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    Is yours on a Trust pre 41F?

    I can't only speak of pre-41F, which there is NO background check on the transferee at all.

    It's up to the individual FFL to decide. Also the ATF auditor plays a role too.

    I have had multiple suppressors transfered by the same shop, the earlier ones just fill/sign, the later ones they actually put through the NICS with NTN. In my case, Profire and USDS to be exact.

    Both shops explained to me that they were instructed by the ATF auditor to run the NICS sometime around early 2015.

    M&J, Premier Arms, Narrow Target always ran the NICS, ACME didn't.
    In some cases an old examiner said not to run a 4473 and the new examiner (what you call auditor) said they always were supposed to. Per ATF higher ups They MUST be running the 4473. It is not up to the shop or even the examiners descresion. I'm not typing second hand or third hand info here. I personally heard this coming out of the ATF's mouth
     

    M67

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    Jan 15, 2011
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    In pre 41F forms submitted on a trust, the dealer IS required to do a NICS check. It's been on the ATFs website for over a year stating the same thing
     

    M67

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    So with the post 41f they now don't have to?
    My experience on this is all pre-41f filed forms

    Post 41 forms on trusts won't need called in because an actual background check has been conducted on each responsible person in the trust, courtesy of the PITA responsible person questionnaire
     

    Gluemanz28

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    Mar 4, 2013
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    Is yours on a Trust pre 41F?

    I can't only speak of pre-41F, which there is NO background check on the transferee at all.

    It's up to the individual FFL to decide. Also the ATF auditor plays a role too.

    I have had multiple suppressors transfered by the same shop, the earlier ones just fill/sign, the later ones they actually put through the NICS with NTN. In my case, Profire and USDS to be exact.

    Both shops explained to me that they were instructed by the ATF auditor to run the NICS sometime around early 2015.

    M&J, Premier Arms, Narrow Target always ran the NICS, ACME didn't.

    All four suppressors were on a trust pre 41F including the one i picked up yesterday.
     

    chezuki

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    Mar 18, 2009
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    All four suppressors were on a trust pre 41F including the one i picked up yesterday.

    Then they all should have been called in.

    Believe me, I understand the frustration. Not only did I wait over 9months for my can, I got a friggin' "delayed" when they called in the 4473. :faint:
     

    Bfish

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    Feb 24, 2013
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    I've picked up 5 pre 41f cans over the course of the last 4 or so weeks I think. I had to do a 4473 for all of them. Of all of the cans I have, I've never not had to do a 4473 when picking it up as of recently or even 3ish years ago. So basically my experience has alway been as such, and I know it's mirrored by really large dealers such as capitol armory and many others.
     

    Gluemanz28

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    You've always had to fill out the 4473... the difference is whether or not the shop called it in.

    yep, have always been required to fill out a 4473 but not called in.

    Does anybody have a reference to where the pre 41F are supposed to be called in. If I'm wrong I need to apologize the the guy at the shop where I picked up my suppressor.
     

    confused89

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    I feel your pain. I had to wait 20 minutes while they called mine in. I was very confused when they did this as all of the other one I have bought had not been called in. Very stupid to me as you have to have a background check to get the item and then when you pick it up you have to have a back ground check? Are they afraid that they screwed up when they ok'ed you the first time? Seriously ATF, pull your head out of your collective rear.
     

    M67

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    I feel your pain. I had to wait 20 minutes while they called mine in. I was very confused when they did this as all of the other one I have bought had not been called in. Very stupid to me as you have to have a background check to get the item and then when you pick it up you have to have a back ground check? Are they afraid that they screwed up when they ok'ed you the first time? Seriously ATF, pull your head out of your collective rear.

    With an individual filing there is no NICS conducted, only a 4473 filled out, since as you pointed out, 1 background check had already been performed.

    With a pre 41F filed trust, technically, there was no background check done since it was an entity. Even though the ATF could google people and their addresses, a background check was not technically done. So a NICS is conducted to make sure the person acting on the trust's behalf is a proper person
     

    Trigger Time

    Air guitar master
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    yep, have always been required to fill out a 4473 but not called in.

    Does anybody have a reference to where the pre 41F are supposed to be called in. If I'm wrong I need to apologize the the guy at the shop where I picked up my suppressor.
    You were Wrong. Two people who have got it from the ATF in an official conversation just told you so. So,that's not up for debate.
    Call the ATF, they will be happy to let you know where to get it in writing if that's what you need as proof. You should ask them if shouldering an arm brace is legal while they're on the phone.
    I never get why people come in and argue with dealers over paperwork. It's not like ANY dealer in the history of selling guns enjoys it and then you always get the customer who always knows more than you coming in and getting upset.
    If I had a shop I'd be firing customers and sending them down the street like John Willis at SOE
     

    Gluemanz28

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    You were Wrong. Two people who have got it from the ATF in an official conversation just told you so. So,that's not up for debate.
    Call the ATF, they will be happy to let you know where to get it in writing if that's what you need as proof. You should ask them if shouldering an arm brace is legal while they're on the phone.
    I never get why people come in and argue with dealers over paperwork. It's not like ANY dealer in the history of selling guns enjoys it and then you always get the customer who always knows more than you coming in and getting upset.
    If I had a shop I'd be firing customers and sending them down the street like John Willis at SOE

    Yea I'm not sure that ATF agents are consistent in the answers they provide.

    It wasn't much of an argument, more like asking why the other Suppressors I ordered from Silercer Shop and were sent to Power Sellers were not called in.

    I guess those shops are gonna be raided and shut down for their bad practices of not calling in the 4473 upon pickup? In fact I can't believe it hasn't happened already with the large amount of suppressors they sell and transfer.
     

    Trigger Time

    Air guitar master
    Rating - 98.6%
    204   3   0
    Aug 26, 2011
    40,112
    113
    SOUTH of Zombie city
    Yea I'm not sure that ATF agents are consistent in the answers they provide.

    It wasn't much of an argument, more like asking why the other Suppressors I ordered from Silercer Shop and were sent to Power Sellers were not called in.

    I guess those shops are gonna be raided and shut down for their bad practices of not calling in the 4473 upon pickup? In fact I can't believe it hasn't happened already with the large amount of suppressors they sell and transfer.
    Atf examiners are NOT agents. The examiners actually know all of the regulations or cam find them out because they are the ones that do the ffl audits and ding shops for not following rules and also,refer things to actual agents for enforcement if needed.
    I got my info straight from an examiner and I can give you her phone number or a picture of her business card if you'd like to call her and ask any question. She's very nice and pro gun and likes helping people follow the law and regulations so they don't get jammed up
     

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