Firearms that are full auto by defect

[Viking Fires]

It may sound a bit out of the realm of possibility but it has happened once to my father and once to myself where a mechanical defect has caused a semi automatic firearm to fire either full auto or burst. My father had a 22LR M16 look a like made in the Philippines which he was out shooting in the 1980s, it was just a normal 22 plinker until on one occasion he put in the magazine, pulled the bolt to the rear and let is slam forward at which time it fired the entire magazine on full auto (without even touching the trigger!) It scared the hell out of him and he wasnt sure what happened. He replicated the conditions again and sure enough it fired off another magazine on full auto as soon as the bolt slammed home, after this the rifle broke completely and would not fire at all under any conditions.

In my own experience I had a WW1 era Luger P08 that would on occasion fire 2 or 3 round bursts with one pull of the trigger, I stopped taking it to the range after that and ended up selling it. What's the legality of being in possession of a firearm that fires full auto/burst through a mechanical defect? I recall reading one case where a guy was charged for trying to sell a rifle that fired on full auto through defect because he advertised that the rifle now fired on full auto, even though he hadn't made any modifications.

I would say the best thing to do would be to take the firearm to a qualified gunsmith for repair ASAP but I have always been curious what would have happened had an ATF agent been at the range when my P08 fired off its first 3 round burst and he'd asked to see my paperwork. Any thoughts or stories about this sort of situation?

 

[hopfdubois]

Take it in for repair? Nah, keep it in a safe place and don't tell anybody

 

[Thor]

 

[ces6508]

1911 with bent firing pin. First round went down range. 7th went through the roof. Poor LT wet his pants.

 

[K_W]

This happens with SKS's that pop primers and the fragment jams the pin forward. IIRK as long as it was a malfunction and not intentional and you do not continue to fire it that way, then there is not issue... but the burden of proof is on you.

 

[Mr. Habib]

It may sound a bit out of the realm of possibility but it has happened once to my father and once to myself where a mechanical defect has caused a semi automatic firearm to fire either full auto or burst. My father had a 22LR M16 look a like made in the Philippines which he was out shooting in the 1980s, it was just a normal 22 plinker until on one occasion he put in the magazine, pulled the bolt to the rear and let is slam forward at which time it fired the entire magazine on full auto (without even touching the trigger!) It scared the hell out of him and he wasnt sure what happened. He replicated the conditions again and sure enough it fired off another magazine on full auto as soon as the bolt slammed home, after this the rifle broke completely and would not fire at all under any conditions.

In my own experience I had a WW1 era Luger P08 that would on occasion fire 2 or 3 round bursts with one pull of the trigger, I stopped taking it to the range after that and ended up selling it. What's the legality of being in possession of a firearm that fires full auto/burst through a mechanical defect? I recall reading one case where a guy was charged for trying to sell a rifle that fired on full auto through defect because he advertised that the rifle now fired on full auto, even though he hadn't made any modifications.

I would say the best thing to do would be to take the firearm to a qualified gunsmith for repair ASAP but I have always been curious what would have happened had an ATF agent been at the range when my P08 fired off its first 3 round burst and he'd asked to see my paperwork. Any thoughts or stories about this sort of situation?

Enjoy your stay at Club Fed. 10 years and $250,000 fine IIRC.

 

[Hkindiana]

When I lived in Commiefornia, I was at a range when a guy showed up with his new DCM (forerunner of the CMP) Garand to shoot it. The first pull of the trigger fired three rounds. The range immediately shut down and called the police. The police showed up and hauled the shooter and his rifle away.

 

[hopfdubois]

When I lived in Commiefornia, I was at a range when a guy showed up with his new DCM (forerunner of the CMP) Garand to shoot it. The first pull of the trigger fired three rounds. The range immediately shut down and called the police. The police showed up and hauled the shooter and his rifle away.

The guy get in trouble with them?

 

[2A_Tom]

When I lived in Commiefornia, I was at a range when a guy showed up with his new DCM (forerunner of the CMP) Garand to shoot it. The first pull of the trigger fired three rounds. The range immediately shut down and called the police. The police showed up and hauled the shooter and his rifle away.

The hammer spring housing was in backwards. It happened to me once.

 

[Thor]

So, the Komifornia range dudes shut the range down and called the cops to arrest a guy for a malfunction, what a worthless bunch of douche bags...I just got back from a business trip to that worthless state, damn glad I don't live there. There should be a different reaction to accidental vs intentional.

 

[Falschirmjaeger]

I think the "accidental" MG owners will be fine if they fix or address the issue as soon as they learn of it. If it is not fixable, it has in fact become an MG and they'd need to destroy it or turn it over to the ATF. No sane prosecutor would try to go after someone trying to do the right thing. If the gun owner learns that his firearm has become an unintentional MG, and he then takes it home and puts it in the safe, or worse, tries to sell it, or takes it out to shoot full auto on the sly, that obviously puts him in a different category with respect to the law.

The Staples case at the link below is instructive, for those of you who aren't familiar with it. In that case the gun owner claimed he didn't know his AR was an unregistered MG, but was convicted any way. The Supreme Court held that the prosecution had to prove that he KNEW he was in possession of an MG. Interestingly, even when convicted, the gun owner only was fined and got 5 years of probation, and not the full 10 year stretch in Club Fed.

STAPLES v. UNITED STATES | FindLaw