Heat Treating ?'s

[MuayThaiGuy]

Well I have had this bug for a while to make something and the other day I was reading through this forum and looking at some of the DIY posts and now I'm really curious. I have read through some of the posts here and watched some youtube videos to get a feel for what it takes but I am completely clueless and hung up on the heat treating. I would most likely work on the knife with hand tools (because who has 1600 for a belt sander for their first knife) but I don’t think I feel comfortable with the homemade heat treating setups I've seen. So, school me on heat treating.
Is there someplace local that does it?
What are the wait times like?
What are the costs like?
What questions should I be asking?

Also, is there a good source to learn about the different types of steel for someone who doesn't have a chemistry background?

Thanks for the info guys!

 

[cubby]

Heat treating is the SINGLE most important part of making a knife. A few degrees or minutes one way, and the knife is just fancy garbage. For just a knife or two, the easiest way is to find a friendly Knifemaker to either do it for you, or send with their next batch. The later could be months of waiting. A lot of makers have heat treat ovenS and the ability to work them properly. Another option is to send your knife to a reliable heat treat. This costs money and is not cheap. But you usually get professional results.

you will get replies from those who say, "do it yourself!". And you. Defiantly can. Just remember. You can't verify your results. You can't truly be sure with the backyard methods. BUT. Heat treating was done thousands and thousands of years before technology gave us the modern, advanced way of heat treating. Results vary.


you will spend dozens of hours working on a knife you want to be proud of and use. In my opinion a professional is the only way to go, because I am too lazy to put in all that effort for a questionable result.

good luck! And share pictures!!

 

[cubby]

Wait times: usually a few weeks
cost: up too a few hundred dollars. All depends on who and how many.
questions: how long have you been heat treating? How much experience with CUTLERY. Stainless or carbon? Hardness ranges available? Equipment? Batch size at one time? Warpage and failure rate? Warranty and guarantee?

 

[Gabriel]

Texas Knifemaker's Supply heat teats air quenchable steels for about $5.50 a blade (click on "services" in menu on the left side of their home page).

Trugrit.com does heat treating also. There isn't much information about what types if steels they do on their website, but it's about $10 a blade.

I sent mine to Peters Heat Treat, but I sent 35 knives to make it less expensive.

 

[MuayThaiGuy]

Texas Knifemaker's Supply heat teats air quenchable steels for about $5.50 a blade

For 5.50 a blade plus shipping I don't see why I shouldn't leave it to the professionals for my first attempt.

Are there any steels that I should look for or stay away from? I like Stainless for its corrosion resistance, is it harder to work with?

 

[cubby]

I used Texas quite a bit early on. They do good work.

 

[dilligaf]

Texas Knifemaker's Supply heat teats air quenchable steels for about $5.50 a blade (click on "services" in menu on the left side of their home page).

Trugrit.com does heat treating also. There isn't much information about what types if steels they do on their website, but it's about $10 a blade.

I sent mine to Peters Heat Treat, but I sent 35 knives to make it less expensive.

I also use Peters Heat Treating. They are in my area ( Western Pa.) They do fantastic work with good turn around time. Never had any negative issues with them.

 

[cubby]

Peters is fantastic. My opinion, the best.

but in this case, pretty expensive.

 

[Mgderf]

Or you could try going to the other extreme, cryogenic treatment.
No idea of the cost, but the technology has been around for a decade or so, and is fairly well proven.

At very least it's interesting.

Cryogenic Tempering Services, Cryo Treatment Services by 300 Below, Inc.

 

[hrearden]

Tell you what, bud. I think youre looking just for a simple heat treat process just to learn it and get a feel for how it is done. Ive done numerous amateurish heat treat/case hardening jobs over the years and never had an issue with any of them. This includes 5 AK receivers (done in an oven with a jig I TIG welded myself not spot treated with oxy/acetylene torch). The biggest task at hand in any job I did was to soak the object for long enough to heat it all the way through and not warp or crack it upon quenching. This is why its probably wise to start with some junk and try a few jobs.

In the meantime, try this. Ive made one, I know it works, its sitting on my workbench currently.
How to Make a Soup Can Forge - YouTube
Youll need some form of a forge as a plumbing torch wont harden jack s#1t!

Also, for quenching, start out using ATF or veggie oil as the cool down is a tad slower than water and doesnt tend to make the object shatter. Some steels do better in water. Im not sure if you can find the heat treat curves online (probably) but thats how you find out what temp the steels like to be hardened at and what the proper quench media should be. If you get a steel that is fairly common, you can judge by the color at guessing what temp it is (also in the heat treat curves). The best part is, if this is just for learning, you can redo it if you d!ck it up. The thing about heat treating is its kind of a pain in the ass, which is why a lot of guys dont go through the hassle when home making a knife. Its easier just to remove material from a file or something similar.

 

[Combsie]

I actually heat treat for a living in St Joe, IN. I was also pondering this "heat treating knives" process. At my place of employment, we do not have a batch furnace, we have continuous furnaces that consist of Hardening(constant 1650' soak)->Quench->Temper(set this at desired hardness for the grade)->Soluble quench. From start to finish it's about a 2 1/2 hour process. Would this work for knife making steel?

 

[cubby]

Realistically, reading the "recipes" from the steel manufactors will probly be the best source. And if you work with that stuff daily, it wI'll make pretty good sense to you.... I am terrible with interpreting that type of thing, without experience.

 

[cubby]

I will wager you can do it though.

 

[rhino]

Question: if you send your blade to a commercial heat treater and it gets warped or something else happens during the procress, do they sent it back to you that way, or they try to fix it?

 

[cubby]

Question: if you send your blade to a commercial heat treater and it gets warped or something else happens during the procress, do they sent it back to you that way, or they try to fix it?

It depends. If you grind BEFORE heat treat, and it is too thin, most take no responsibility. A blade ground to thin will usually warp and be worthless. But they caution you of that, excessively.

most REPUTABLE heat treaters straighten any warped blades, caused by heat treat, before they ship back. Peters heat treat and Paul Bos all check each blade for straightness and adjust it accordingly. It is included.

If a blade is damaged during heat treat and it's their fault, they usually replace the MATERIAL. Not time or anything else though.