Straw purchase connected to murder of 2 Ohio cops. Idiot arrested.

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  • BehindBlueI's

    Grandmaster
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    29   0   0
    Oct 3, 2012
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    Not the first and won't be the last.

    The gun used to murder IMPD's David Moore was obtained via straw purchase, and the buyer got 57 months in prison.

    A quick search just in Indiana, also shows convictions for:

    Scott Griffy, Terre Haute, who provided the gun Shaun Seeley used to kill Terre Haute police officer Brent Long in July 2011.

    Tarus Blackburn Jr., who provided the gun Demetrious Martin, 23, used in the December 2011 nonfatal shooting of IMPD officer Dwayne Runnels.
     

    snapping turtle

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    Dec 5, 2009
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    So the questions of are you an Indiana resident and are you a proper person are not enough in a person to person transaction?

    Now proving a true straw purchase is totally different. If you go into a store purchase the gun and then deliver it to a known improper person. Then yes 57 months is to light a sentence.

    This is is one of the reasons I (when selling) do a paper receipt with my drivers license number and the buyers drives license numbers and name recorded. One copy goes with the purchase on stays in my book. That at least proves residency for Indiana. My sale my rules but also get some flack once in a while here when selling. (Being mainly a collector and retainer I don’t sell many).
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
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    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
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    Speedway area
    So the questions of are you an Indiana resident and are you a proper person are not enough in a person to person transaction?

    Now proving a true straw purchase is totally different. If you go into a store purchase the gun and then deliver it to a known improper person. Then yes 57 months is to light a sentence.

    This is is one of the reasons I (when selling) do a paper receipt with my drivers license number and the buyers drives license numbers and name recorded. One copy goes with the purchase on stays in my book. That at least proves residency for Indiana. My sale my rules but also get some flack once in a while here when selling. (Being mainly a collector and retainer I don’t sell many).

    CYA is OK when you do not know someone.
    I am not giving out any info. Period. I mainly buy/sell on Ingo and friends in my circle so if I am not vetted enough on here then no worries. Keep it. There are others.
    Very few if any LGS deals anymore.
     

    MrsGungho

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    2   0   0
    Nov 18, 2008
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    East Side
    So the questions of are you an Indiana resident and are you a proper person are not enough in a person to person transaction?

    Now proving a true straw purchase is totally different. If you go into a store purchase the gun and then deliver it to a known improper person. Then yes 57 months is to light a sentence.

    This is is one of the reasons I (when selling) do a paper receipt with my drivers license number and the buyers drives license numbers and name recorded. One copy goes with the purchase on stays in my book. That at least proves residency for Indiana. My sale my rules but also get some flack once in a while here when selling. (Being mainly a collector and retainer I don’t sell many).

    this situation wasn't selling a gun to someone on INGO.
    this gentleman received funds, plus $100 to go buy the gun for the accused, a felon. He knew the accused could not own a firearm.
     

    LarryC

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    Jun 18, 2012
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    Frankfort
    So the questions of are you an Indiana resident and are you a proper person are not enough in a person to person transaction?

    Now proving a true straw purchase is totally different. If you go into a store purchase the gun and then deliver it to a known improper person. Then yes 57 months is to light a sentence.

    This is is one of the reasons I (when selling) do a paper receipt with my drivers license number and the buyers drives license numbers and name recorded. One copy goes with the purchase on stays in my book. That at least proves residency for Indiana. My sale my rules but also get some flack once in a while here when selling. (Being mainly a collector and retainer I don’t sell many).

    I am also a collector (and have a valid FFL-03 collectors license and lifetime LTCH) but I would never purchase a firearm from you! I follow the law to the letter, especially when dealing with firearms. It is very rare when I would sell a firearm.

    As far as entering a sale into a "BOOK". The only sales I enter into my Black book are those required by my FFL-03 license (C&R firearms) as required by law. I have read the BATF firearms laws and regulations from cover to cover!

    The only requirement to sell a firearm (including state law) is that the person be of legal age, an Indiana resident and that you "Do not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is illegal to possess a firearm". That means if I don't know or have no reason to suspect the person is a felon or has a criminal record I can legally sell the person a firearm!

    I do ask people I don't know to see an Indiana DL as that proves the only requirements of age and residency. I do not record nor attempt to remember any information they give me! Apparently the government believes that is enough as they not only do not require I obtain a background check but do not even allow me to inquire via a 4473 or phone call etc.

    I personally believe there are plenty of "laws and rules" on the books from the Federal, states and BATF that I certainly don't need or want to add any more. In every case I have ever read when a person is accused of a Straw Purchase there has been proof the person knew the firearm recipient was know by them to be illegal to possess a firearm.

    In reality ANY criminal can (and those that desire too, does) obtain firearms. They do this by buying from other criminals or stealing them! There are millions of firearms in the USA and there is zero chance of stopping a person from obtaining one legally or illegally.
     

    Thor

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    2   0   0
    Jan 18, 2014
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    Could be anywhere
    this situation wasn't selling a gun to someone on INGO.
    this gentleman received funds, plus $100 to go buy the gun for the accused, a felon. He knew the accused could not own a firearm.

    Apparently, all criminals have not been arrested yet...:)...they are still out walking around and acting like proper people when they aren't.
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
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    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
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    I would also like to mention that when someone posts a gun up in the classifieds with all the CYA requirements they tend to languish in there. Asking for all of this from an Ingo member to me is a real push. No knock. CYA as you feel the need. Your item. You set the rules. I just know that the 200 or so Ingo members I know personally will step right over that item. It has been a topic of conversation on more than a few occasions.
    Asking for a person personal info and writing it all down is just a bit much. I do not have to show LTCH to purchase from a LGS but I do have to produce ID.
    Unless I am doing a 4473 then all info stays in my pocket. JMHO of course.
     

    Gabriel

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    9   0   0
    Jun 3, 2010
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    The shore of wonderful Lake Michigan
    I would also like to mention that when someone posts a gun up in the classifieds with all the CYA requirements they tend to languish in there. Asking for all of this from an Ingo member to me is a real push. No knock. CYA as you feel the need. Your item. You set the rules. I just know that the 200 or so Ingo members I know personally will step right over that item.

    Agreed. As soon as I see a list of requirements beyond "I'd like to have a glance at your DL to make sure you are from Indiana" I pass and look at something else. I also don't have a LTCH to show anyone anyway, so that's a no go.
     

    SnoopLoggyDog

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    I always ask to see a DL and LTCH, just to confirm the buyer is from Indiana. Nothing is ever recorded. Have never had a problem selling to, or buying from an INGO member.
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    I would also like to mention that when someone posts a gun up in the classifieds with all the CYA requirements they tend to languish in there.

    Probably because they also tend to be on the upper end of pricing. One might even suppose post-flip pricing of the "I'm totally not a business" type.
     

    DoggyDaddy

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    Like Larry C, I'm also a C&R license holder (FFL 03), so most guns I buy and sell are guns that qualify as C&R, so I don't have a choice about collecting certain information for my log book. If I'm buying, I have to record name and address (or FFL # if buying from an FFL holder, 03 or 01). If selling, I have to record name, address, DL# (or FFL#) with D.O.B.. ATF rules, not mine. I always try and be up front in my ads about these requirements though. I've only had one potential buyer back away from a sale because of it. For modern firearms (not C&R eligible), I don't have any such requirements.
     

    churchmouse

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    Probably because they also tend to be on the upper end of pricing. One might even suppose post-flip pricing of the "I'm totally not a business" type.

    Possibly but spending as much time as I am required to in the classifieds I get to see a lot. No knock to anyone that wants this security blanket.
     

    GodFearinGunTotin

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    Mitchell

    BehindBlueI's

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    Even with adders for gun use, it appears there is very little deterrence to people intent on being criminals. Huh...

    They are deterred while in prison. Once back out, much less so. There's probably a lesson in there somewhere, but one that is seemingly quite difficult to learn.
     

    DRob

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    I've sold several guns to private individuals. Some I have known for years. some are relatives who I trust. If you don't fit into one of these groups, I will require ID from you in order to buy my gun and I will provide a receipt for both parties. I had one INGO member give me a raft of feces over this some time ago. He went so far as to tell me he wanted a gun with "no paper trail". Sorry! If there's a paper trial to me, it's going to be extended to the buyer. I really don't mind if you don't want to play my game by my rules. There are other sellers and other buyers. I ain't mad at you. You just can't buy my gun.
     
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