Why do gun manufacturers stay in states that are anti gun?

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  • busted1200

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    Thoughts on this? I know some have moved, Magpul and Weatherby left CA for Wyoming. Kimber opened up shop in Alabama, but I think they still have a presence in NY. I would think pro gun states would be trying to lure them away. Why the hell would you operate a business in California, Massachusetts, New York, Illinois etc.... when they are essentially trying to put you out of business?
     

    gmcttr

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    Cost of moving a plant, disruption to business/production, leave most of your employees without a job, have to hire and train new employees, the local owners/operators like where they live, you're owned by a large parent company that only cares about the immediate bottom line, etc., etc.
     

    busted1200

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    Rock River was founded in 1996 in Illinois and Stag 2003 in Connecticut. Pretty sure they knew where their state stood on firearm s and the 2nd amendment. Why didn’t they choose to open up shop in a gun friendly state?
     

    croy

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    Rock River was founded in 1996 in Illinois and Stag 2003 in Connecticut. Pretty sure they knew where their state stood on firearm s and the 2nd amendment. Why didn’t they choose to open up shop in a gun friendly state?

    This is the real question. Other companies you just lose too much. Experienced workers, kinks in new machinery which would slow down production thus hurting your profits.
     

    Butch627

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    In the case of Rock river and springfield they could move to wisconsin and most of their employees could commute if they don't want to flee the state themselves. In light of Illinois financial and anti business climate compounding their anti gun stance I find their decision most puzzling. Then again I didn't think much about their decision to support legislation that hurt other gun businesses in Illinois.
     

    KLB

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    Rock River was founded in 1996 in Illinois and Stag 2003 in Connecticut. Pretty sure they knew where their state stood on firearm s and the 2nd amendment. Why didn’t they choose to open up shop in a gun friendly state?
    They probably grew up there and like where they live. The state hasn't stopped them from their chosen business, so they didn't need to move to be successful. Most people do not think in such black and white terms.
     

    jamil

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    Rock River was founded in 1996 in Illinois and Stag 2003 in Connecticut. Pretty sure they knew where their state stood on firearm s and the 2nd amendment. Why didn’t they choose to open up shop in a gun friendly state?
    Entrepreneurs don’t always think everything out. Businesses often start out where oeople live. Literally. Like in their homes. And then they just grow from there.

    People don’t want to move. They grow attachments to their friends, community, and it’s often where their families are. There’s a personal cost as well as a finacial cost to moving. And then there’s the financial cost. It’s hard and expensive to move a company, not to mention the impact it has on employees.

    That said, there comes a point where it becomes existentially obvious that they have to move to an environment friendlier to their survival. For the mentioned reasons, they’re maybe too reluctant to read the tea leaves early enough.
     

    LCSOSgt11

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    Les Baer moved to Iowa after being toyed with by IL. I still wonder why Springfield Armory is still in IL though. Of course, from other posts, losing good employees, disruption of business, etc. are certainly good reasons not to move, however, a business should not suffer along with the lunacy that is IL. Of course, 95% of that lunacy is situated in Chicago, the "City of Freeloaders."
     

    bgcatty

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    These companies that are in anti 2A states need to conduct cost benefit analysis big time for everyone employed by their business. Leaving tax blood sucking places like Illinois, Massachusetts, New York and New Jersey would enable these companies to enjoy lower corporate taxes, lower property taxes, lower cost of living for all of their employees, etc. and on and on. Take IN for example which has and will continue to offer companies tax incentives to move to IN could offer these manufacturers a lot of benefits to lure them to IN. Could you imagine if the idiots that currently operate Remington had moved to IN years ago what they could have saved in taxes alone? With Remington in bankruptcy court a move to IN based on operational expense savings alone would make tremendous sense. The upfront costs of such a move would have been recovered relatively quickly simply based upon the costs of doing business in New Jersey-New York versus IN. Why Henry has not moved all of its operations out of Bayonne, NJ is beyond my imagination. Having moved out of NJ over a decade ago to IN and counting all the $ saved in property taxes alone made the move the unquestionable right move to have made at the time and it continues that way. The money saved by Henry and their employees would be incredible. Just thinking!!!
     
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    ART338WM

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    One reason and one reason only leaps to mind. Doing so must BEST serve their financial interests. 9 of 10 of all business decisions are driven by money above all other considerations. But it seams I read about a firearm manufacturer or firearm related business relocating to a gun friendly state VERY often these days. Even reading quite often now where firearm companies as well as some ammo makers refusing to sell their products to PD's in anti-gun cities or states.
     

    boosteds13cc

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    I have quite a few friends that live in nazi illinois and they always express that majority of the state loves guns it's just sad that a city dictates what the entire state does.
     

    WebSnyper

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    One reason and one reason only leaps to mind. Doing so must BEST serve their financial interests. 9 of 10 of all business decisions are driven by money above all other considerations. But it seams I read about a firearm manufacturer or firearm related business relocating to a gun friendly state VERY often these days. Even reading quite often now where firearm companies as well as some ammo makers refusing to sell their products to PD's in anti-gun cities or states.

    You would think most/many of the more 2A friendly states would also be potentially lower cost of living states with lower wages, and often not extremely unionized areas, etc, which could also help the bottom line. I wonder if many of these businesses have done a long term cost/benefit study of a move?

    Like you, I have seen a few moves, but seems you would see more.
     

    russc2542

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    You would think most/many of the more 2A friendly states would also be potentially lower cost of living states with lower wages, and often not extremely unionized areas, etc, which could also help the bottom line. I wonder if many of these businesses have done a long term cost/benefit study of a move?

    Like you, I have seen a few moves, but seems you would see more.

    Again, it really does come down to the expense of moving a production line. It isn't like packing up your house and moving, there has to be a building set up, working, and ready to receive the equipment, the machinery has to be perfect, rework your whole supply chain (not just production parts but maintenance guys, security, even down to where you get the TP for the bathroom, you have to either move or retrain the labor pool, management team, and execs. you also lose any certifications or accreditation you have (ISO, OSHA, etc) until you can re-certify. While you're moving, you aren't producing and you're producing below usual for a while afterwards. How often have you heard of some manufacturer that was doing great until they moved production? I can think of a few.

    Not to mention that it takes a colossal amount of planning. When the times are good, they don't worry about it, they're making money why would they stop? (ie: pre-election). when times are hard, they don't have the liquid cash to do it (now). The way around it is saving up in the good times and planning for the bad but that takes self control and there are a number of things preventing it. for one thing, shareholders don't like when the company announces it'll move, shareholders also don't like missing out on their share of the profits (don't save it up, give it to us). For another (and I don't pretend to be a business major knowing every bit about it) it isn't easy for a company to just stick money in a savings account like you or I would... lack of money making money aside, there are protocols and regulations.

    Thus the companies that do move are usually either small enough to have the flexibility or large enough to have multiple plants.
     

    Spear Dane

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    Thoughts on this? I know some have moved, Magpul and Weatherby left CA for Wyoming. Kimber opened up shop in Alabama, but I think they still have a presence in NY. I would think pro gun states would be trying to lure them away. Why the hell would you operate a business in California, Massachusetts, New York, Illinois etc.... when they are essentially trying to put you out of business?

    Because it's horribly expensive and disruptive?
     

    seedubs1

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    Nailed it

    Cost of moving a plant, disruption to business/production, leave most of your employees without a job, have to hire and train new employees, the local owners/operators like where they live, you're owned by a large parent company that only cares about the immediate bottom line, etc., etc.
     
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