WHy All Guns Are Always Loaded

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  • Brad69

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    Jul 16, 2016
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    Perry county
    https://newsok.com/article/3182635/live-round-fired-at-soldier-during-training-exercise

    PVT Fisher left behind a wife.

    He was shot with a .50 at about ten yards he lived for about two hours.
    He was on a “Dry Range” a M2 was pointed at the bleachers not in a safe direction as per SOP.
    The weapon was supposed to be using “dummy” rounds every Drill Sergeant was well trained nobody knew how that round got in the mix.

    Yours truly got to bring my Armorer out to the site to verify no obvious weapons malfunctions and help interview the Privates who had just seen a buddy bleed out.

    Commanders were relieved DS lost their careers and such.

    PVT Fisher was 19 he was in the third week of Basic Training he had his whole life in front of him.

    The Weapon Wasn’t Supposed to be Loaded.
     

    drillsgt

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    108   0   0
    Nov 29, 2009
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    Sioux Falls, SD

    Kirk Freeman

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    Mar 9, 2008
    47,969
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    Lafayette, Indiana
    https://newsok.com/article/3182635/live-round-fired-at-soldier-during-training-exercise

    PVT Fisher left behind a wife.

    He was shot with a .50 at about ten yards he lived for about two hours.
    He was on a “Dry Range” a M2 was pointed at the bleachers not in a safe direction as per SOP.
    The weapon was supposed to be using “dummy” rounds every Drill Sergeant was well trained nobody knew how that round got in the mix.

    Yours truly got to bring my Armorer out to the site to verify no obvious weapons malfunctions and help interview the Privates who had just seen a buddy bleed out.

    Commanders were relieved DS lost their careers and such.

    PVT Fisher was 19 he was in the third week of Basic Training he had his whole life in front of him.

    The Weapon Wasn’t Supposed to be Loaded.

    Mine was a five year old. Still see her eyes (they were open) when the .30RS plowed through her forehead.

    I remember "meye ryeeets" transforming into "eet ain't low-dead".

    I hate stupidity with a white hot hate ever since.
     

    cbhausen

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    128   0   0
    Feb 17, 2010
    6,379
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    Indianapolis, IN
    I will harp on this every time the subject comes up. Safe or safest direction first foremost and always. Cut the make-believe crap on whether guns are loaded or not because with some people the implication is that we can do stupid things when we “know” the gun isn’t loaded. Just don’t go there. Never ever point a gun at something you’re not willing to destroy. Period.
     

    cmamath13

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    28   0   0
    Mar 3, 2013
    1,539
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    Greenwood
    Thank you for sharing this important reminder. It can happen and we need to be reminded often to not be complacent with gun safety rules!
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    8   0   0
    Mar 9, 2008
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    Lafayette, Indiana
    I will harp on this every time the subject comes up. Safe or safest direction first foremost and always. Cut the make-believe crap on whether guns are loaded or not because with some people the implication is that we can do stupid things when we “know” the gun isn’t loaded. Just don’t go there. Never ever point a gun at something you’re not willing to destroy. Period.

    Pssst, when he pointed the SKS at the wall, he could not see the 5 year old on the other side. "Meye ryeets to point meye raffle gon in uh safe die-wreck-shun."

    No, cut the crap about rationalizing unsafe behaviour. It is loaded. Act like it. Too many people are dead because some want to act smarter than thou.

    It's loaded, always.
     

    Thor

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    Jan 18, 2014
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    Could be anywhere
    When I grew up hunting I was taught weapons safety not so much by my hunters safety course but buy my relatives who I hunted with. My dad and uncles were all WWII and Korea vets, they were sticklers for muzzle discipline and obviously empty weapons (break that gun open son and carry it that way, unload that weapon before you cross that fence; accidents happen, etc.). They had all been shot at enough to not want any weapons pointing at them.

    Treat it like it's loaded even if you know it's not.
     

    cbhausen

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    128   0   0
    Feb 17, 2010
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    Indianapolis, IN
    Pssst, when he pointed the SKS at the wall, he could not see the 5 year old on the other side. "Meye ryeets to point meye raffle gon in uh safe die-wreck-shun."

    No, cut the crap about rationalizing unsafe behaviour. It is loaded. Act like it. Too many people are dead because some want to act smarter than thou.

    It's loaded, always.

    Psst, it wasn’t a safe direction, was it? Who’s rationalizing unsafe behavior here? I certainly am not. And the words “act” and “act like” are not in my vernacular when it comes to gun handling. Rules specifying observable and correctable behaviors are.

    No disrespect, Kirk. I simply choose to see things differently.
     

    Expat

    Pdub
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    Feb 27, 2010
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    I find this very interesting that multiple people can look at a loaded gun and determine it to be unloaded. I don't know if this is the same thing as the "i swear he looked like a deer" people or something different. When I check to see if a gun is loaded, I actually look. I am not putting on a show of my safety for bystanders. I have noticed some people like to make these big motions and gestures to show how safe they are being.
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    Oct 3, 2012
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    Pssst, when he pointed the SKS at the wall, he could not see the 5 year old on the other side.

    An object that will not stop the bullet isn't a safe direction, and cbhausen isn't rationalizing unsafe behavior. But you know that. You'd rather do your speech impediment shtick and play semantics, though.
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    I find this very interesting that multiple people can look at a loaded gun and determine it to be unloaded. I don't know if this is the same thing as the "i swear he looked like a deer" people or something different. When I check to see if a gun is loaded, I actually look. I am not putting on a show of my safety for bystanders. I have noticed some people like to make these big motions and gestures to show how safe they are being.

    Visual and physical check. I run my finger around the cylinder at the chamber openings, so I can both see and feel it's unloaded. We are taught to visually and physically check the chamber by our Range staff, and I just adapted it to revolvers as well.
     

    Ark

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    Feb 18, 2017
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    Indy
    https://newsok.com/article/3182635/live-round-fired-at-soldier-during-training-exercise

    PVT Fisher left behind a wife.

    He was shot with a .50 at about ten yards he lived for about two hours.
    He was on a “Dry Range” a M2 was pointed at the bleachers not in a safe direction as per SOP.
    The weapon was supposed to be using “dummy” rounds every Drill Sergeant was well trained nobody knew how that round got in the mix.

    Yours truly got to bring my Armorer out to the site to verify no obvious weapons malfunctions and help interview the Privates who had just seen a buddy bleed out.

    Commanders were relieved DS lost their careers and such.

    PVT Fisher was 19 he was in the third week of Basic Training he had his whole life in front of him.

    The Weapon Wasn’t Supposed to be Loaded.

    Oh, man. That's horrible.
     

    LP1

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    3   0   0
    Sep 8, 2010
    1,825
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    Friday Town
    Re Ayoob's story, I take issue with "straight up" being a "safe direction". The bullet is going to come down, somewhere. The only safe direction is towards a berm or backstop. The people in his class (and nearby) were very fortunate.
     

    cosermann

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    14   0   0
    Aug 15, 2008
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    Don't run cold ranges

    This was my first thought.

    Cold range => expect guns to be UN-loaded => cursory check looked, but didn't see, or rather, "saw" what was expected - an empty gun. Bang.

    The older I get the less ambivalent I am about cold ranges (except maybe for the most basic/introductory training).

    Cold ranges are antithetical to rule #1, and teach people to treat firearms two different ways regardless of the lip service paid to rule #1.
     

    Usmccookie

    Grandmaster
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    6   0   0
    Jan 28, 2017
    5,838
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    nwi
    A lot of real talk going on. Maybe it's a good idea to take another intro class to bring it back to the basics. It has been a few years since my last safety course. Having a almost ready to crawl infant and a preteen, my anxiety concerning my firearms has been peaked these past few months. This thread and reading a lot of the comments in the article has me thinking about getting a bigger safe and taking a safety course with my oldest daughter.

    As terrible as it is to read these stories, we need to be constantly reminded that safety rules are always written in blood.
     

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