Complaint - Karri's Guns

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  • djmoore914

    Plinker
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jun 24, 2009
    6
    1
    st john, in
    I don't typically bash companies online but felt this one was warranted. I built an AR9 pistol and put a Law Tactical adapter on it. I bought a BCG from Karri's Guns that is advertised as "Law Tactical Compatible". I received it and it didn't work. It wouldn't go into battery and when it did I had constant FTF. I switched out multiple components, trigger, buffer, spring, etc. and the only thing that was a constant issue was the BCG. I called Law Tactical and they said they had a list of approved BCG companies and Karri's Guns was not on it. As a last ditch effort, I took it to my gunsmith and he confirmed that it would not work with the adapter based on the design of it. At this point, I reached out to Karris Guns (who does not provide a phone number or name of anyone) and asked to process a return. They got back to me a week later and said they would ship me a new one. I told them Law Tactical said they were not on their list so I didn't want to risk damage to my gun and just wanted a return. They said they would accept a return and charge me a 25% restocking fee. I said it was their fault they falsely advertise and I was just asking for my money back (not the shipping both ways). All they did was send a link to their policy that they "warranty" the product that Law and my gunsmith says won't work. So you can keep shipping me new ones that won't function. Apparently, I am the first to complain out of "thousands" of purchases which I highly doubt.

    So long story short, if you need components, avoid Karri's Guns.
     

    Disposable Heart

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 99.6%
    246   1   1
    Apr 18, 2008
    5,805
    99
    Greenfield, IN
    Yeah, their parts look bad and they should feel bad. There are tons of Delta Team Tactical type sites trying to flip a buck on cheap Chinese MIM lower parts or genuine Sorta-Metal(TM) BCGs out there nowadays, like this Karri's Guns. If they aren't ToolCraft, Colt or Palmetto, companies with vetted histories that will supply material sheets and lot testing results, I don't trust their BCGs to be what they say. Heck, I can farm out BCG work to any machine shop, paint the things black and someone will buy them. "Is it MilSpec?" Sure, why not... That's the approach most of these hucksters take because they know it's volume rather than quality that makes them the money. One angry customer out of 20 isn't all that bad... :xmad:

    It's like barrels: They, lots of folks, say they are made of 4150 CMV, but is there a way for the average Joe to test the material for that, cost effectively? No, we take them at their word and wear out their cheap barrel in 150 rounds... But, the average user of those cheap barrels will never see more than two boxes of Tula in its lifetime and the cheap manufacturers KNOW THIS, bank on this. Nitride is a hit or miss too, some you can drag a file across the surface of the barrel and it doesn't dig in, hard as a rock. Others, soft as butter and you now have a fairly deep nick, poor nitriding quality.

    Buy cheap, cry cheap.
     

    Vigilant

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    21   0   0
    Jul 12, 2008
    11,659
    83
    Plainfield
    Yeah, their parts look bad and they should feel bad. There are tons of Delta Team Tactical type sites trying to flip a buck on cheap Chinese MIM lower parts or genuine Sorta-Metal(TM) BCGs out there nowadays, like this Karri's Guns. If they aren't ToolCraft, Colt or Palmetto, companies with vetted histories that will supply material sheets and lot testing results, I don't trust their BCGs to be what they say. Heck, I can farm out BCG work to any machine shop, paint the things black and someone will buy them. "Is it MilSpec?" Sure, why not... That's the approach most of these hucksters take because they know it's volume rather than quality that makes them the money. One angry customer out of 20 isn't all that bad... :xmad:

    It's like barrels: They, lots of folks, say they are made of 4150 CMV, but is there a way for the average Joe to test the material for that, cost effectively? No, we take them at their word and wear out their cheap barrel in 150 rounds... But, the average user of those cheap barrels will never see more than two boxes of Tula in its lifetime and the cheap manufacturers KNOW THIS, bank on this. Nitride is a hit or miss too, some you can drag a file across the surface of the barrel and it doesn't dig in, hard as a rock. Others, soft as butter and you now have a fairly deep nick, poor nitriding quality.

    Buy cheap, cry cheap.
    But I heard on INGO parts is parts? Are you tellin’ me parts ain’t parts?
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
    191,809
    152
    Speedway area
    Yeah, their parts look bad and they should feel bad. There are tons of Delta Team Tactical type sites trying to flip a buck on cheap Chinese MIM lower parts or genuine Sorta-Metal(TM) BCGs out there nowadays, like this Karri's Guns. If they aren't ToolCraft, Colt or Palmetto, companies with vetted histories that will supply material sheets and lot testing results, I don't trust their BCGs to be what they say. Heck, I can farm out BCG work to any machine shop, paint the things black and someone will buy them. "Is it MilSpec?" Sure, why not... That's the approach most of these hucksters take because they know it's volume rather than quality that makes them the money. One angry customer out of 20 isn't all that bad... :xmad:

    It's like barrels: They, lots of folks, say they are made of 4150 CMV, but is there a way for the average Joe to test the material for that, cost effectively? No, we take them at their word and wear out their cheap barrel in 150 rounds... But, the average user of those cheap barrels will never see more than two boxes of Tula in its lifetime and the cheap manufacturers KNOW THIS, bank on this. Nitride is a hit or miss too, some you can drag a file across the surface of the barrel and it doesn't dig in, hard as a rock. Others, soft as butter and you now have a fairly deep nick, poor nitriding quality.

    Buy cheap, cry cheap.

    Precisely. But I built this AR for $350 bucks and it is as good yours. Bull****.
     

    KellyinAvon

    Blue-ID Mafia Consigliere
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Dec 22, 2012
    24,796
    150
    Avon
    I wish I still had the screenshot I had from a cheap parts supplier that had a (TM) after milspec like it was trade name, rather than a specification lol

    Yeah, I first heard the term mil-spec as a young Supply troop in the USAF. It means "from the lowest bidder" and "not as good as what we sell to the private sector".
     

    Disposable Heart

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 99.6%
    246   1   1
    Apr 18, 2008
    5,805
    99
    Greenfield, IN
    Yeah, Milspec isn't a bad thing but it can be. The military specifies what they want, tolerances, color pantone, markings required and the manufacturers are required to adhere to them. Actual Milspec for BCG specifies the steel, manufacturing process, tolerance level, heat treatment, etc... If I see one more nitride or 9310 BCG being touted as "milspec", I'm going to vomit with rage. lol It's C158, shotpeened, heat treated, MPI and HPT, not 9310 sorta-steel that some machine shop in Akron can get for cheaper. Does 9310 work as well? Sure can. But it's not "Milspec" and don't tell me it is and this is from a guy that doesn't have any C158 left in the house.

    I hate government contracts and generally avoid them in my job (quoting fabrication work). The paint is the worst: "Milspec Pantone number" or Color Milspec number is terrible. Of course, they only want 14 naval bulkhead electronics bracket parts, steel, small, about the size of a cigarette pack, two bends and one hole (usually cut by our laser). But it has to be the exact milspec paint number, which can be bought, but only in 5 gallon buckets at 714 fun-bucks a bucket and we'll never have to use that color again, and the paint dries out ricky-tick, so it's not easily storable. So 14 parts, normally if just powdercoated or made from stainless, would be like $6 a part now becomes $108 because of paint, THEN, I have to have the exact ink stamp, exact ink, paying someone to stamp a part number (NSN) in the side with paint that of course flecks off during transit, no matter what you do. Parts arrive at their destination, then are rejected because a tiny fleck of the number 4 fell off. Never you mind it says 4 and is as bold as bronze: it's flecked, your parts are rejected. Oh, by the way, here's the charge for supplying rejected parts.

    Wonder why those hammers cost the government $1500? Toliet seats $15,000? Because of idiotic paint, marking procedures, packaging, materials that were in vogue 50 years ago that are no longer available that have to be custom made at high cost to fulfill the milspec. Oh, you wanted it specc'ed for 201 series stainless? Why? No one other than China uses that now, it was a manganese and nickle saving measure in WWI. Never mind I have 304, ON MY SHELF, which has superior corrosion resistance, workability, strength and ease of weld, plus it's half the price and I have it RIGHT NOW. Nope, 201. Then your bid is rejected, too high a price, given out to some contract shop on the west coast who subs it out to China, works in the price of missed shipment fees, and still piles money on. Dorks.
     

    Disposable Heart

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 99.6%
    246   1   1
    Apr 18, 2008
    5,805
    99
    Greenfield, IN
    Precisely. But I built this AR for $350 bucks and it is as good yours. Bull****.

    Don't gemme wrong. My Palmetto $350 special is a fine weapon compared to other guns at similar bill. It's an excellent value. But if full auto ever came into easily obtainable purview, that barrel would melt in two mags, that receiver extension is made from beer cans and not 7071 and the parts don't have the same attention to heat treat as a $700 piece of weapon.

    For a trunk gun, get me home rifle, it's not bad, could do ALOT worse. But hand it to the average Marine in Iraq, I would be bent, bore shot out and graphic pictures drawn all over it within a few hours, while the issue M4 would only have minor finish wear and the same graphics. :D
     

    Vigilant

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    21   0   0
    Jul 12, 2008
    11,659
    83
    Plainfield
    Don't gemme wrong. My Palmetto $350 special is a fine weapon compared to other guns at similar bill. It's an excellent value. But if full auto ever came into easily obtainable purview, that barrel would melt in two mags, that receiver extension is made from beer cans and not 7071 and the parts don't have the same attention to heat treat as a $700 piece of weapon.

    For a trunk gun, get me home rifle, it's not bad, could do ALOT worse. But hand it to the average Marine in Iraq, I would be bent, bore shot out and graphic pictures drawn all over it within a few hours, while the issue M4 would only have minor finish wear and the same graphics. :D
    It only gets the graphics at the first of the month when the Corps issues each Marine their new crayon allotment. After the first day, they can no longer draw any graphics, as they’ve eaten all the crayons.
     

    KellyinAvon

    Blue-ID Mafia Consigliere
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Dec 22, 2012
    24,796
    150
    Avon
    Yeah, Milspec isn't a bad thing but it can be. The military specifies what they want, tolerances, color pantone, markings required and the manufacturers are required to adhere to them. Actual Milspec for BCG specifies the steel, manufacturing process, tolerance level, heat treatment, etc... If I see one more nitride or 9310 BCG being touted as "milspec", I'm going to vomit with rage. lol It's C158, shotpeened, heat treated, MPI and HPT, not 9310 sorta-steel that some machine shop in Akron can get for cheaper. Does 9310 work as well? Sure can. But it's not "Milspec" and don't tell me it is and this is from a guy that doesn't have any C158 left in the house.

    I hate government contracts and generally avoid them in my job (quoting fabrication work). The paint is the worst: "Milspec Pantone number" or Color Milspec number is terrible. Of course, they only want 14 naval bulkhead electronics bracket parts, steel, small, about the size of a cigarette pack, two bends and one hole (usually cut by our laser). But it has to be the exact milspec paint number, which can be bought, but only in 5 gallon buckets at 714 fun-bucks a bucket and we'll never have to use that color again, and the paint dries out ricky-tick, so it's not easily storable. So 14 parts, normally if just powdercoated or made from stainless, would be like $6 a part now becomes $108 because of paint, THEN, I have to have the exact ink stamp, exact ink, paying someone to stamp a part number (NSN) in the side with paint that of course flecks off during transit, no matter what you do. Parts arrive at their destination, then are rejected because a tiny fleck of the number 4 fell off. Never you mind it says 4 and is as bold as bronze: it's flecked, your parts are rejected. Oh, by the way, here's the charge for supplying rejected parts.

    Wonder why those hammers cost the government $1500? Toliet seats $15,000? Because of idiotic paint, marking procedures, packaging, materials that were in vogue 50 years ago that are no longer available that have to be custom made at high cost to fulfill the milspec. Oh, you wanted it specc'ed for 201 series stainless? Why? No one other than China uses that now, it was a manganese and nickle saving measure in WWI. Never mind I have 304, ON MY SHELF, which has superior corrosion resistance, workability, strength and ease of weld, plus it's half the price and I have it RIGHT NOW. Nope, 201. Then your bid is rejected, too high a price, given out to some contract shop on the west coast who subs it out to China, works in the price of missed shipment fees, and still piles money on. Dorks.

    Hey!! That was $600 hammers and $1,500 toilet seats. Qatar leased us Al Udeid Air Base for $1/year for 99 years. They knew they'd make up for it selling us hammers and toilet seats.
     

    Hohn

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Jul 5, 2012
    4,444
    63
    USA
    Yeah, I first heard the term mil-spec as a young Supply troop in the USAF. It means "from the lowest bidder" and "not as good as what we sell to the private sector".

    Which is why companies like DD advertise being way better than mil spec requires.
     
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