AR pistol and 30 rd mag confusion.

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  • vincess

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Dec 14, 2017
    95
    8
    Indy
    Admin/MOD's,
    I wasn't sure where to put this, so sorry for slapping it here. Also, I did a search and couldn't come up with any answers to this situation.

    I recently went to my usual indoor range, and proceeded to to test out my brand new AR pistol. I've never tried one out before, and did (at least what I thought) was a good amount of research on the laws of using said pistol. Now this is where I failed? Or the the RSO did, that's why I'm asking here.

    According to to him, one can not use a mag with more than 10 rounds, (like the 30 round mag I had in). Said it ceases to become a pistol once I've done that.

    Thoughts one way or the other?
     

    T.Lex

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    15   0   0
    Mar 30, 2011
    25,859
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    Please name the range, and if possible, the RSO.

    Without providing specific legal advice to you or anyone else that may read this, your description of the conversation suggests that the RSO is incorrect, or a there's a misunderstanding, or a there's a miscommunication.

    In Indiana, mag capacity is not relevant to a handgun/rifle designation.

    If the RSO was saying that in some jurisdictions it is, and that it is awesome to be in Indiana where that kind of thing doesn't matter, then he/she is correct.
     

    Bigtanker

    Cuddles
    Emeritus
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    24   0   0
    Aug 21, 2012
    21,688
    151
    Osceola
    Yeah. The RSO is wrong. The only thing you can't do is put a regular stock on it, that would make it an SBR, and you'd need to pay the $200 tax for that. Also no vertical for grip. That makes it a AOW ( I think). Again, a tax stamp is needed for that.

    Technical, you could put a belt fed upper with a pistol length barrel on it and be perfectly legal with a 500 Rd belt.

    I'm interested in what range this was at. Point Blank maybe?
     

    Vigilant

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    21   0   0
    Jul 12, 2008
    11,659
    83
    Plainfield
    Yeah. The RSO is wrong. The only thing you can't do is put a regular stock on it, that would make it an SBR, and you'd need to pay the $200 tax for that. Also no vertical for grip. That makes it a AOW ( I think). Again, a tax stamp is needed for that.

    Technical, you could put a belt fed upper with a pistol length barrel on it and be perfectly legal with a 500 Rd belt.

    I'm interested in what range this was at. Point Blank maybe?
    Actually, the VFG is ok if OAL is 26”+
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
    191,809
    152
    Speedway area
    RSO is a moron. Period. I have 4 AR pistols He would crap himself if he saw the HD pieces. Both have dual 30's in the mag well. That would make for a very interesting conversation.

    Please name the range. That would hurt nothing save for the fact a few of us will be going there to run some high cap mags in out AR pistols.
     

    Tactically Fat

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    22   0   0
    Oct 8, 2014
    8,270
    113
    Indiana
    Another caveat: Were you mentioning hunting with it? Like perhaps it's a .300bo pistol and you intend to deer hunt with it?

    I can also see some miscommunication/misunderstanding about that, too.

    But, yes, please name the range.
     

    Usmccookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Jan 28, 2017
    5,838
    113
    nwi
    I'm down for an ingo ar pistol mag dump event at this range. Bonus points for drum mags and big ole breaks.
     

    Disposable Heart

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 99.6%
    246   1   1
    Apr 18, 2008
    5,805
    99
    Greenfield, IN
    Awaiting the name of the range...

    I went to Point Blank yesterday and bought an inexpensive .22 pistol and they were really trying to pump me for my email address. Their 'manager' or floor supervisor even tried to tell me that it's needed for the 4473. I was adamant that they have all the information they need when they cuck under to the ATF so they can kick in my door, THEN, he tried convincing me that they emailed out their deals to us. If it wasn't for the .22 being half the cost because of a loose front sight (which I fixed with Loctite lol), I would have walked out.

    I've been using up the 'free range time' cards that I've collected and have heard some idiotic and stupid things from the RSOs there. One shot every 5 seconds, which was rescinded by another RO who said it was every other second. They jumped me at another session for doing doubles with my AR, hitting within a 3x5 card at 15 yards, but two stalls over, two Carmelites were goofing off on their lunch break and waving guns at everything that moved. No Wolf/Tula, BrownBear .223 etc... but M193 (which is hard as heck on any plates/backstop, etc...) is allowed. No more than 10 rounds in a mag (which is where this might stem from) but then a guy a few rows down let the RO shoot his AR9 with a full 33 rounder jammed in it.
     

    vincess

    Plinker
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    Dec 14, 2017
    95
    8
    Indy
    Thanks guys, and I always appreciate all the information (and entertainment) here at INGO. I looked for the INGO booth at the Indy gun show last weekend, but didn't see it. I really wanted to pick y'alls brain about said pistol before I bought it. I guess without being "direct" about the name of the range......, at said aforementioned range, I've had issues before in regards to this. I reached out to owners online, they apologized and said next time just reach out to mgmt, that there was probably just a misunderstanding. I had a ANGLED fore grip on it, but that was not addressed. On top of that, I had a sig brace and was shouldering it, but nothing was said about that as well. After it was all said and done I began to question whether or not this actually is a pistol, so I didn't bother with mgmt. I did more research, but only ran in to more ambiguity in regards to shouldering a pistol with a sig brace. I have no problem removing the angled grip, and replacing the sig brace with the blade brace that came with it, to help clear up any uncertainty at ANY range in the future. Thanks again guys.
     

    STFU

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    16   0   0
    Sep 30, 2015
    2,421
    113
    Hamilton County
    I live in Carmel and am only 10 minutes from the Point Blank range.
    I concur with DH above. While it is a nice facility, it is not that great. The staff are dumb as doorknobs and arrogant to the point where they think their scheiße don't stink.
    Used to practice there with my kids...not anymore. The only thing I have ever bought at that place is the MidWest ammo but only when it is on sale!
     
    Last edited:

    BR8818

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    12   0   0
    Nov 20, 2018
    716
    63
    Anderson
    Afg is totally legal leave it on if you like it. Vfg is legal if >26" oal and it doesn't matter which brace you are useing as long as it's not a stock. Also shoulder it all you want it's all about intent if you intended it to be a pistol it's a pistol.
     

    Usmccookie

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Jan 28, 2017
    5,838
    113
    nwi
    Thanks guys, and I always appreciate all the information (and entertainment) here at INGO. I looked for the INGO booth at the Indy gun show last weekend, but didn't see it. I really wanted to pick y'alls brain about said pistol before I bought it. I guess without being "direct" about the name of the range......, at said aforementioned range, I've had issues before in regards to this. I reached out to owners online, they apologized and said next time just reach out to mgmt, that there was probably just a misunderstanding. I had a ANGLED fore grip on it, but that was not addressed. On top of that, I had a sig brace and was shouldering it, but nothing was said about that as well. After it was all said and done I began to question whether or not this actually is a pistol, so I didn't bother with mgmt. I did more research, but only ran in to more ambiguity in regards to shouldering a pistol with a sig brace. I have no problem removing the angled grip, and replacing the sig brace with the blade brace that came with it, to help clear up any uncertainty at ANY range in the future. Thanks again guys.

    Sounds like you were perfectly legal in all regards, as stated. I'm not a lawyer, but shouldering a brace is fine as that was not the design intent. The afg is gtg as well. Sounds more like you were a p.b. they suck. Theres threads all over online as to how much they suck. Shoot point blank sucks. It is worth repeating. I shoot there since it is free, and I still hate it. But free is free and I shouldn't be b****ing.
     
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