Help with purchasing from private party, with shipping involved.

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  • jfed85

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    Searched but couldn't find anything.

    I found a firearm I'm interested in, it is an Indiana resident who is selling it. However, they are 3 hours away and with work and 3 kids it just isnt plausible (or financially smart) to make that kind of trip for it. I asked him if he could ship to my FFL, which he was fine with, and then if I could pay him via paypal once I confirm with my FFL that the firearm has arrived.

    Understandably, he doesn't want to ship until payment is made, and I dont want to pay until I know the firearm has shipped.

    Does anyone have any ideas on how this could be done in such a way to give both of us peace of mind?

    Thanks in advance.
     

    nrgrams

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    I have done it multiple times from private sellers. The best way I have found is when using PayPal, never use F&F. Always use G&S, even with the fees involved (3%). If he doesn't ship it, you are insured. The only kicker from what I hear is that PayPal isn't a fan of firearm/firearm related items. Stopping payment from your bank could be an option as well if he doesn't ship. I've been pretty fortunate and only have had good dealings with people. I have shipped guns via private sale to an FFL, but I would never ship one out without receiving payment first. Worse case scenario, you could meet him halfway?

    PS, GO BLUE!
     

    CampingJosh

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    You are asking for an escrow service. Nothing like that exists for firearms sales (that I know of).

    Don't use PayPal to purchase firearms. It's against their policies, and so your purchase won't have the consumer protections that PayPal usually provides.

    If you can't trust each other, then just pass on the deal.
     

    WebSnyper

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    I have done it multiple times from private sellers. The best way I have found is when using PayPal, never use F&F. Always use G&S, even with the fees involved (3%). If he doesn't ship it, you are insured. The only kicker from what I hear is that PayPal isn't a fan of firearm/firearm related items. Stopping payment from your bank could be an option as well if he doesn't ship. I've been pretty fortunate and only have had good dealings with people. I have shipped guns via private sale to an FFL, but I would never ship one out without receiving payment first. Worse case scenario, you could meet him halfway?

    PS, GO BLUE!


    Never done it, but there are escrow services (feasibility I'm sure depends on the value of the firearm being purchased):
    https://support.gunbroker.com/hc/en-us/articles/221688408-Using-an-Online-Escrow-Service
    as others said, I would think you could have issues with PayPal, as I believe firearm purchases are against their rules and I would not expect any protections there: https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/acceptableuse-full
     
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    JettaKnight

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    If it was a reputable INGO'er, I'd see no problem. If it's "Some guy" on FB or Armslist, then it's not worth the risk at all. Never engage in anything but FTF with those forums.


    And, if you're an IN resident, and he's an IN resident, then why are you wanting him to ship it to a dealer? :dunno:
     

    jfed85

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    If it was a reputable INGO'er, I'd see no problem. If it's "Some guy" on FB or Armslist, then it's not worth the risk at all. Never engage in anything but FTF with those forums.



    And, if you're an IN resident, and he's an IN resident, then why are you wanting him to ship it to a dealer? :dunno:

    Thats the issue, it’s just “some guy” on armslist. It’s a great deal and that’s why I was trying to figure a way, but I think I’m just gonna move on.
     

    Dead Duck

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    I have bought and sold quite a few firearms through auctions, forums and word of mouth sales all over the country.
    I've always used USPS Money Orders because it brings the Feds into it if things go awry. I send the money orders straight to the seller. Yes it's scary to send a stranger money but what can you do. If out of the state he sends from his FFL or just directly to my FFL. Nobody holds anything for anyone until something clears. I have heard of third party companies that supposedly will do this for a fee.

    If in the same state but too far to drive? I don't believe I've ever done it. I have driven up to 6 hours one way for the right deal. I have also taken a plane trip for the right car/truck deal. So call me crazy but if it's what I want then I try my damnedest to get it.




    My only "close call" with being ripped off was a scope that a guy had for sale on a sniper forum online. Been looking for this scope for years. After sending the money orders he kept giving excuses about everything from a house fire to his truck was stolen that the scope was in....etc... I did a deep dive on his info and found that his father is the Chief of police some Georgia town and they both lived at the same residence.

    So, I got nice color copies of all the correspondences from the forums, emails, USPS money order payments (Yes I copy or take pictures of filled out M/Os before sending them), detailed phone conversations and phone attempts we had and a detailed timeline of events. Including an email from a USPS inspector I spoke with about how this can be turned into a federal investigation if I so choose to. I put it altogether in a huge manila envelope and sent it USPS Certified with Signature Confirmation to his house and his daddy's police station.

    I have never had a package sent to me so fast as this scope was sent. It was beautiful. :):
     

    223 Gunner

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    Like Dead Duck, I have driven longer than 3 hours to buy something.
    If it is a rifle, it can be shipped right to your house per Indiana law, same as a FTF private sale.
    Hand gun must ship to an FFL, but can be transferred FTF.

    I always do google searches of email addresses and the names of people associated with the email address. I do this before ever responding to an email or meeting them in person when it comes to Armslist or Craigslist.
     

    JettaKnight

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    Like Dead Duck, I have driven longer than 3 hours to buy something.
    If it is a rifle, it can be shipped right to your house per Indiana law, same as a FTF private sale.
    Hand gun must ship to an FFL, but can be transferred FTF.

    I always do google searches of email addresses and the names of people associated with the email address. I do this before ever responding to an email or meeting them in person when it comes to Armslist or Craigslist.

    Says who? :dunno:


    Q: May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?

    A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun.
    [18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)]
    Q: May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier?
    A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.
    [18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]
     

    gregkl

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    Thats the issue, it’s just “some guy” on armslist. It’s a great deal and that’s why I was trying to figure a way, but I think I’m just gonna move on.

    I think you are wise. If you are busy with work and family, the last thing you want to do is get sideways on a deal. It would be better to meet the guy 1/2 way and invest 3 hours in driving vs. the time you would invest (and mental anguish) in fixing things that went wrong with the deal.

    There are plenty of firearms out there. Be patient.
     

    223 Gunner

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    Says who? :dunno:


    Q: May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?

    A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun.
    [18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)]
    Q: May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier?
    A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.
    [18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]

    The thread is speaking within the State of Indiana, where both parties live.
    Are you correcting the shipping of a hand gun?
    I guess I should have typed. A hand gun may be shipped from the sellers FFL to the buyers FFL.

    As we all know, a FTF deal of hand gun is perfectly legal as long as you believe the buyer is a "proper person". No back ground check or bill of sale required.
     

    JettaKnight

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    The thread is speaking within the State of Indiana, where both parties live.
    Are you correcting the shipping of a hand gun?
    I guess I should have typed. A hand gun may be shipped from the sellers FFL to the buyers FFL.

    As we all know, a FTF deal of hand gun is perfectly legal as long as you believe the buyer is a "proper person". No back ground check or bill of sale required.

    Before, you wrote "must", now your write "may".

    A ham sammich may be shipped from one dealer to another.


    If you're claiming that one Hoosier can't ship a handgun to another Hoosier, then please, explain where you got that idea.
     

    223 Gunner

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    I will give an explanation here, I should have stated that a handgun cannot be mailed through the postal service also known as USPS, by an Individual.
    Which is the much cheaper way to ship them. In order to do that it MUST ship from FFL to FFL.

    If someone is willing to get A$$ raped by UPS or FEDEX, as far as shipping handguns, then by all means in our State (Indiana) it is perfectly legal.
     

    JettaKnight

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    I will give an explanation here, I should have stated that a handgun cannot be mailed through the postal service also known as USPS, by an Individual.
    Which is the much cheaper way to ship them. In order to do that it MUST ship from FFL to FFL.

    If someone is willing to get A$$ raped by UPS or FEDEX, as far as shipping handguns, then by all means in our State (Indiana) it is perfectly legal.
    Very true, thanks for explaining it.

    The raping is relative - fuel cost for a 6 hour trip, and the time spent... overnight shipping ain't that bad.
     

    WebSnyper

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    Very true, thanks for explaining it.

    The raping is relative - fuel cost for a 6 hour trip, and the time spent... overnight shipping ain't that bad.

    I assume he was comparing it to shipping through a reasonable & willing FFL, rather than paying overnight shipping via UPS or FedEx as compared to driving oneself.
     

    223 Gunner

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    I assume he was comparing it to shipping through a reasonable & willing FFL, rather than paying overnight shipping via UPS or FedEx as compared to driving oneself.

    I have in the past used USDS, I believe their fee is $20 for the transfer + actual shipping. The last time I shipped a handgun (out of state) the actual shipping through USPS was $13 dollars.
    So $33 total.
     

    clayshooter99

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    Post the sellers general location, then you might find a fellow INGO who is close and could give a reference (do this by PM) or might even know the seller. I always use a USPS money order because the postal inspectors have no problem going after a fraud. Do everything by email to start with for the documentation.
     
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