Advice on Out of State Gunsale

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  • doddg

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    135   0   1
    May 15, 2017
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    I am skittish about any sale not being 1:1 do to my inexperience with such things.
    I have had some strange things going lately with scams by email or cell phone (not gun related), and am getting shy.
    I had 2 people wanting to buy my Ruger GP100 .357 Wiley Clapp edition I had for sale, but things got strange about the particulars about payment time and gun delivery, and I never heard back from one and the other I withdrew.

    I have this 3rd person today who emailed me:

    "I'm in Ozark, Alabama.
    I have Federal Firearms License (FFL) to receive the firearm for me if you are willing to ship it once you receive your payment.If yes,what's your shipping cost to Alabama? (seems like a dealer could easily look up shipping costs from Indy)
    Or I can arrange for a local dealer in your area where you can drop it off and they will do what is necessary for me to receive the firearm at my FFL address without your concern... (this really got my attention b/c of "ease of "delivery").
    Please note that the shipping will take place once you receive your payment...."

    I replied saying I'd never shipped before and would have to have payment first, and suggested Pay Pal.
    Below was his reply.



    To:
    Gary Dodd
    Jul 7 at 6:37 PM

    Thanks for getting back to me .........I'm still interested in buying the gun
    I will mail a Certified Bank Check as means of payment to you,
    once you deposit the check,
    It will get clears within the next 24 hours.
    I want you to get back to me with the following information in order to facilitate the mailing of the check to you...

    Name to be on the check ....

    Mailing Address....

    Active Cell Phone #....

    Final Asking Price......

    Please note that the check will be mail out to you via Federal Express(Fedex) Or United Postal Service (UPS) so that the transaction can be complete before you ship the firearm.

    Perhaps I am ignorant, but I have alarm bells going off in my head.
    If this was someone in INGO, it would not be a problem (I could send an email inquiring about the person to a mod).

    If this person is a FFL dealer, I suppose they do business like this everyday; they are wanting to buy the Ruger GP100 .357 Wiley Clapp editions and resell it probably.
    I was not getting any bites on INGO, so I listed it on Armslist, and I have had 2 very strange experiences and this 3rd one makes me wonder.
     
    Last edited:

    d.kaufman

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    Yup. Definitely a scam. Ive seen this a couple times selling on armslist. I dont even reply to them
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Yup. Definitely a scam. Ive seen this a couple times selling on armslist. I dont even reply to them


    Dont reply unless you want to yank their chain and waste their time. I'll bet lunch the check they send is bogus... and it will take a week or two for the banks to figure it out and reverse the deposit leaving you with no gun and no money.

    And I'd expect a larger than expected check with an explanation of some sort that they want you to send them the balance as a legit money order after they "pay" for shipping charges for you.
     

    ditcherman

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    In the country, hopefully.
    I consider myself a risk taker and will give people the benefit of the doubt and I also do a lot of business on a handshake, but it they can't write in proper english it gets to be a hard no from me real fast.
     

    doddg

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    Thanks so much for verifying my instincts, appreciate it. :thumbsup:
    I really appreciate everyone taking the time to let me know: RUN!
    I'm a stickler about details, as you who know me might imagine, so that sent up red flags.
     

    rhino

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    Certified checks are not hard to fake and make it look legit to someone who is not familiar with the bank in question (if it even exists).
     

    rhino

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    Scary stuff, thanks, rhino!

    I didn't know what a certified check was until a couple of years ago. I went to the credit union to get one or a cashier's check (whichever was cheaper) and I learned that a certified check is just your own check that the bank stamps and certifies that at the time they checked, you had sufficient funds in your account to cover the check. I don't remember if they put a hold on the amount to ensure payment, but the stamp and signature looked pretty hokey!
     

    fullmetaljesus

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    Yea to mirror others.
    This is a very common scam.
    You would have been with out gun and cash.

    My suggestion would be, take the gun to the next Indy 1500 show. Sell it for cash and walk away happy.

    Last time I took a gun to sell there, it was gone with in 15 minutes of me walking in the door.
     

    doddg

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    I didn't know what a certified check was until a couple of years ago. I went to the credit union to get one or a cashier's check (whichever was cheaper) and I learned that a certified check is just your own check that the bank stamps and certifies that at the time they checked, you had sufficient funds in your account to cover the check. I don't remember if they put a hold on the amount to ensure payment, but the stamp and signature looked pretty hokey!


    I knew that a Cashier's check is drawn from an escrow account the bank sets up when the purchaser buys one, whereas the Certified Check still comes from the purchaser's account.
    Therefore, the Cashier's check would be preferable, but evidently you'd better be calling the bank to verify funds anyway.
     

    Haven

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    A few things, the guy doesn't say he is an FFL, he says he has an FFL to receive it for him. This could mean he is a customer of an FFL that he uses for transfers.

    Second, please remove the personal information (guy's name, e-mail address).

    Third, if they are going to send money it has would have to be a Cashier's Check, and would need to be sent via USPS. The cashier's check should be able to be checked for being real without being able to be canceled like a "certified check" could be. Sending via USPS makes it a federal crime if it is fraud. Plus, I would use your local FFL to do the transfer/shipping to them, I don't know if they can verify the FFL or not. But if they can, then if it is fraud, the FFL on the other end will have the details of who picked it up.

    Just my thoughts. Though to be honest, I haven't bought anything from someone else via FFLs nor have I sold anything that way either.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Fake checks are the "new" hotness. (at least the last 5-10 years) That is the risk, not a legit one that gets cancelled. They typically are not verified by the bank at the time of deposit as long as they appear legit, and you find out the hard way when the bank on the other end says "uh, this isnt a real check. We didnt issue this. We aint paying."

    One additional layer to Haven's suggestion. USPS money order. I know for a fact that if you cash them at the post office when you receive them, they use an automated system to verify them. You would know right then and there that it was fraudulent because they wouldnt give you the money because it would fail the verification. I found this out the hard way one day when I went to cash one and they wouldnt because the verification system was down that day. I had to come back the next day to get my money.

    But good luck getting the feds to get off their asses to actually prosecute the fraudster. I wouldnt actually put any stock in actual results unless you knew somebody.
     

    rhino

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    Fake checks are the "new" hotness. (at least the last 5-10 years) That is the risk, not a legit one that gets cancelled. They typically are not verified by the bank at the time of deposit as long as they appear legit, and you find out the hard way when the bank on the other end says "uh, this isnt a real check. We didnt issue this. We aint paying."

    One additional layer to Haven's suggestion. USPS money order. I know for a fact that if you cash them at the post office when you receive them, they use an automated system to verify them. You would know right then and there that it was fraudulent because they wouldnt give you the money because it would fail the verification. I found this out the hard way one day when I went to cash one and they wouldnt because the verification system was down that day. I had to come back the next day to get my money.

    But good luck getting the feds to get off their asses to actually prosecute the fraudster. I wouldnt actually put any stock in actual results unless you knew somebody.


    Safest non-cash option in my opinion. If I don't the buyer, it's cash or USPS money order.
     

    doddg

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    Thanks guys! Appreciate all the input.
    I will just stick with 1:1 selling like I have done for 2 yrs.
    I let the person in question know right away that I wasn't interested in any shipping and non-cash transactions, and thanked him for his interest.
    I don't have to be in a hurry to sell anything anyway, and if the gun for sale in question doesn't garner any interest, it will just stay in the safe: it's "money in the bank."
    I have others that can take their turn meanwhile, and they are less expensive and will probably sell in short order like most of my hobby "tools."
     

    snorko

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    I have received these replies word for word. First email is always short and vague. Either "interested" or "is this still available". Neither these nor the follow up messages specify the gun for sale, just call it "the item" or something.

    This is very common and lots of folks have in their ads that they will not respond to such vague messages.
     

    doddg

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    May 15, 2017
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    I have received these replies word for word. First email is always short and vague. Either "interested" or "is this still available". Neither these nor the follow up messages specify the gun for sale, just call it "the item" or something.

    This is very common and lots of folks have in their ads that they will not respond to such vague messages.


    Lesson learned.
    Just like Haven said, "the guy doesn't say he is an FFL, he says he has an FFL to receive it for him."
    Fooled me, I didn't catch that, and thought he was an FFL.
    That initially is what appealed to me and got me hooked.
     

    doddg

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    I had the exact same message from Armslist a couple of weeks ago. I will never sell a firearm unless it’s face-to-face in my state.


    I'm feeling the same way.
    I quit selling anything on Armslist for awhile now, and just use INGO, but I hadn't sold my Wiley Clapp quickly, as is my custom, so I put it into Armslist.
    I have sold things and bought items on Armslist in the past w/o issue, just the usual, "Do you want to trade for a shotgun?" or an offer that is $100 less than price w/o any other comment.
    I just respond to those ads by my counter of raising the original price $100. :laugh:
     
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