This is what the Anti-gun people are afraid of

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  • Ark

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    I must be missing something. Am I supposed to be on this asshat's side? Sounds like he tried his hardest to get arrested for being a crazy person threatening a mass shooting.
     

    jwleeper

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    This guy reinforces why this bad law was passed. If he is this stupid he can't be a responsible gun owner. Don't get me wrong, this law is unconstitutional. Just saying.
    Have a great day.
    Jim
     

    churchmouse

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    This guy reinforces why this bad law was passed. If he is this stupid he can't be a responsible gun owner. Don't get me wrong, this law is unconstitutional. Just saying.
    Have a great day.
    Jim

    Agreed but the law is not required for this incident. The man was an obvious threat. There are already laws in place for this. So yeah I get it but still.
     

    Karl-just-Karl

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    Another story the media is using (sensationalizing, actually) to spread paranoia and fear. It just happens to suck for the gun owning community because it involves guns.

    If it were homemade explosives and pressure cookers we could breathe a sigh of relief and feel good that somebody stopped/prevented a tragedy.

    Instead we are tense because the propaganda is being used against us. ANY gun owner could be the next guy to do this, right?

    It could be you, you, or even you. Yeah, I don't have a finger-pointing GIF for that.


    Take-away message? If you enjoy your 2A freedoms, don't be an asshat. The media can't/won't separate the wheat from the chaff.


    Who hasn't shouldered or pointed a firearm outside (through the window) of their home/LGS looking for a sight-picture reference? Anybody here ever line up your sights on the neighbors satellite dish? Anybody else hope that nobody sees you through the patio door and calls the cops?
     

    bwframe

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    Looks to me that this is what should happen? See something say something worked with this lunatic.


    The problem with red flag laws is that most don't have actual due process, the same as OURS, right here in Indiana. Anyone can drop a dime for any reason, including domestic squabbles and personal belief disagreements.

    ALL of these investigations should require approval by a judge signing a warrant BEFORE the investigation begins.
     

    JettaKnight

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    This guy reinforces why this bad law was passed. If he is this stupid he can't be a responsible gun owner. Don't get me wrong, this law is unconstitutional. Just saying.
    Have a great day.
    Jim

    So... without a law, how do you make that happen?
     

    GIJEW

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    The problem with red flag laws is that most don't have actual due process, the same as OURS, right here in Indiana.

    ALL of these investigations should require approval by a judge signing a warrant BEFORE the investigation begins.
    Does indiana's "red flag" law have REAL due process? Do you have the opportunity to defend yourself in court BEFORE a SWAT team comes to disarm you?

    I'd like to be shown that I'm wrong about this
     

    bwframe

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    Does indiana's "red flag" law have REAL due process? Do you have the opportunity to defend yourself in court BEFORE a SWAT team comes to disarm you?

    I'd like to be shown that I'm wrong about this
    I'm sorry, I don't think I was clear enough. I think you are getting at the same thing I was trying to say;

    Our Indiana Red Flag Law does NOT have true due process. They confiscate first and the "due process" is that you supposedly get a quick hearing to attempt to get them back.

    If you have the legal counsel money? If you can prove the confiscating cop, (possibly erring on covering his own tail,) wrong? If you can prove the complaining party is somehow insincere or biased?
     

    Karl-just-Karl

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    After seeing more of the self-shot video last night, this guy is getting everything he deserves. Thirty years old and completely off into his own fantasy land. Irresponsible gun handling, even if being done in the privacy of his own room, and open display of poor choices.

    The main problems are that one, he took video of his antics and self-reported by posting them to You-Tube. Two, in his prison interview he is claiming that he was just having "fun" in a "different" way. There was no tone of regret, he seemed to feel totally justified in what he was doing because it wasn't "real".

    Even if he had no true intent, the combination of handling firearms, loading magazines, handling ammunition and pulling the trigger on unloaded guns while pointing at people outside the window was just one oops away from tragedy.

    In this case I say the Red Flag laws were correct. It seems like the Red Flag laws can be seen in two ways. They are a favor to gun owners because they attempt to remove tools of destruction from irresponsible or angry people and prevent situations potentially causing more bad press for law abiding gun owners. Or, they are an infringement of rights based upon the Constitution and depend upon the responding officer's judgement of the immediacy of the threat.

    Slippery slopes, I understand. I am also having issues with defending the rights of supposedly mature adults to retain tools of lethality while they are displaying the mentality of a thirteen year old.

    Finally, all of this would have been averted if the guy hadn't felt compelled to share what he was doing with the rest of the world. Why would someone want to do that? If you want to argue Red Flag laws with me, fine, I will appreciate the discussion. But please explain to me first what purpose it serves to jump around a hotel room with several firearms, talk to yourself about shooting at people, pretend to shoot a mannequin head at close range and then POST IT TO THE INTERNET!

    Just having fun like the guy says? Maybe, but to display it to the world says something else to me...I need attention. What might be his next attention getting step? No one can say if there would ever be one. That is why in today's litigious society we have Red Flag laws, buy fear and liability are another topic.

    Is there evidence this guy requires further evaluation? Tell me why not.

    Why should I defend this guy's right to own firearms? I can't.

    Good job law enforcement!
     

    JettaKnight

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    I'm sorry, I don't think I was clear enough. I think you are getting at the same thing I was trying to say;

    Our Indiana Red Flag Law does NOT have true due process. They confiscate first and the "due process" is that you supposedly get a quick hearing to attempt to get them back.

    If you have the legal counsel money? If you can prove the confiscating cop, (possibly erring on covering his own tail,) wrong? If you can prove the complaining party is somehow insincere or biased?

    images
     

    Beowulf

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    Pointing firearms at people out the window constitutes criminal menacing at the very least, so really, he filmed himself committing a misdemeanor, if not a felony, depending on state statute. So, they could have acted on those grounds alone.

    Either way, I'm happy they went after this guy, as another mass shooting would do a heck of a lot more harm to the 2nd Amendment than this.
     

    Ark

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    Pointing firearms at people out the window constitutes criminal menacing at the very least, so really, he filmed himself committing a misdemeanor, if not a felony, depending on state statute. So, they could have acted on those grounds alone.

    Either way, I'm happy they went after this guy, as another mass shooting would do a heck of a lot more harm to the 2nd Amendment than this.

    Yeah this seems very prosecutable on its face without a "red flag" law.
     

    GIJEW

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    Pointing firearms at people out the window constitutes criminal menacing at the very least, so really, he filmed himself committing a misdemeanor, if not a felony, depending on state statute. So, they could have acted on those grounds alone.

    Either way, I'm happy they went after this guy, as another mass shooting would do a heck of a lot more harm to the 2nd Amendment than this.
    ^^^THIS^^^

    The problem I have with these "red flag" laws (which are red flags in themselves) is that they look and smell like the next trojan horse to be abused in attacking the the gun owning public.

    The NRA has called for enforcing existing laws--in addition to saying the mental health records of people ADJUDICATED mentally incompetent be added to the NICS data base--for as long as I've payed attention (over 30 years) and it often doesn't happen because of deliberate gov't malfeasance. then the anti-gun lobby agitates that there oughta be a law and their cronies in gov't take another bite out of our rights with another turd they won't enforce except when it affects law abiding citizens. and the cycle repeats itself.
    This time, they're attacking not only the 2A but 4A and 5A--in one "law". The slope is getting steeper and slipperier.
     

    GIJEW

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    Sure. But are you going to hold the guy in jail until trial? Doubtful.
    Having a court order to confiscate someone's in a case like this, pending trial, where there is actual evidence is entirely different from your bestest enemy being able to make a crank call and get a judge to have you "SWATTED".
     

    JettaKnight

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    Having a court order to confiscate someone's in a case like this, pending trial, where there is actual evidence is entirely different from your bestest enemy being able to make a crank call and get a judge to have you "SWATTED".

    It's a good thing Jake Laird's Law doesn't work that way.
     

    AmmoManAaron

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    Sure. But are you going to hold the guy in jail until trial? Doubtful.

    If it's unsafe for that person to have their firearms, they shouldn't be out roaming the streets while they await trial. The Red Flag law is simply the wrong solution to that problem and not even a very good one. Plenty of ways for said person to harm people without their firearms. Either they are a threat or they aren't.
     

    KellyinAvon

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    There was a SWAT hoax in Greenfield two days ago. Closed streets and everything.
     
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