So, what do I do if an FFL straight up loses my rifle?

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  • Ark

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    This situation is not yet resolved and may change, but I've been thinking about it and it may be in my interest to seek some outside opinions.

    Back in the first week of April, I picked up a new WASR10 on transfer through a local FFL. Transfer was $10 more than last time due to, frankly, covid gouging. The store was swarming with people, so I hurried through a quick visual check to make sure I got what I ordered and then got outta there.

    At the range the next day, I discovered that the front sight base was so badly canted that there wasn't enough adjustment available to get windage on target. Sigh.

    Said FFL has a gunsmith that works out of the store. I offered to have him fix it to save me a return and he refused, claiming that fixing a canted sight is something only the factory can do. :rolleyes:

    I contacted Century customer service and was told that, due to Indiana laws (?), it was necessary to have an FFL ship the gun. This is extremely weird, as I've shipped several guns myself for warranty service with other companies and received them at my home with no FFL involvement, but I was told by Century that this is how it absolutely has to be done, no exceptions, and I would have to pay a second (increased) transfer fee. They offered to provide the FFL a paid shipping label. I was told that the FFL MUST contact them by email with a ticket number to receive an RMA and shipping label. I put all this information in an email to the FFL, which was not answered.

    I drove the rifle to the FFL the next day and found the owner in the process of locking up. They have apparently switched to extremely short hours. I explained the situation, explained that they needed to contact Century for the return, and stood there while he opened his phone and found my email. He accepted the rifle and said it would ship out the next day as soon as they could find a box.

    11 days later I emailed Century to follow up and was told they never received communication of any kind from the FFL. I called the FFL and was simply told "yeah we sent it back". No tracking info, no elaboration on what "back" referred to. Century's response to that was that anything sent without an RMA would be refused on the spot and returned to sender. Some of their offices aren't able to accept or deal with firearms whatsoever. Their suggestion was to wait and see whether it washed up at Century or ended up back at the FFL.

    Needless to say, I am extremely unhappy with this FFL for completely ignoring my clear and repeated instructions in favor of shoving my $700 rifle into a box and throwing it on the UPS truck to parts unknown. It's been about 16 days since it was left at the FFL with zero indication of where it is from them or Century. Should I just keep waiting? If it doesn't turn up, is there going to be need to get law enforcement or the ATF involved? I've never dealt with anything remotely like this. I just wanted my stupid WASR to shoot straight, like any $700 rifle should out of the box.
     
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    55fairlane

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    I'm not run to the lawyer guy, but I think a call to your lawyer, the local ATF are in order.

    $700 dollar rifle or 7cent piece of candy, good business practices are good (and legal) practices
     

    Ark

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    Guessing they sold it to someone the next day on Accident. Good Luck

    That'd be a hell of a thing considering it's my property, not purchased or ordered from them, and would necessitate them lying to me about sending it back.
     

    churchmouse

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    Huh.
    Wondering who this wonderful FFL is so they might be avoided.

    And Century.

    Man if you did not sign anything when you handed him the gun you might be screwed. But getting the ATF involved is another can of worms in itself.
     

    Vigilant

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    Sounds as if that’s what has happened, or, it’s stuck in time space continuum, and you’ll have to fix your time machine to rectify this. But again, CENTURY. This isn’t the first Century sucks thread, unfortunately, it won’t be the last.
     

    Sigblitz

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    You don't need an FFL to send or receive your rifle for warranty work. But, your FFL will have a tracking number if they shipped it properly.
    Incompetence, incompetence. Maybe ATF can find it and lose it in the system.
     

    Ark

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    You don't need an FFL to send or receive your rifle for warranty work.

    The Century rep was 100% on this, they were not accepting anything from Indiana that did not originate from an FFL.

    Happily I did add the serial to my theft file. Feeling like the next course of action may be going in person this week to ascertain a tracking number and actual address to where they supposedly shipped it...or just look around and see if my rifle with my serial is sitting in a corner somewhere.

    I'll be more than happy to name and shame once I have the facts in order.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    You don't need an FFL to send or receive your rifle for warranty work. But, your FFL will have a tracking number if they shipped it properly.
    Incompetence, incompetence. Maybe ATF can find it and lose it in the system.

    This. I dont know of a way to properly ship a firearm that does not include a tracking number. Seems fishy to me.

    And if they shipped without tracking, doesnt that put the onus on the FFL to prove they no longer have it? And doesnt that imply liability on their part to make the owner whole? How is shipping with no proof any different than accidentally losing it by putting the shipping box in the compactor with all the rest of the cardboard and sending it to the dump? Either way I see the FFL is responsible without proof that he did no wrong and the guy in the brown truck lost it instead.

    But I could be wrong. I didnt even stay in a Holiday Inn last night.
     

    Mgderf

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    Contact the FFL again.
    Explain that you will give him/her x number more days before you report the rifle as stolen.
     

    churchmouse

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    Contact the FFL again.
    Explain that you will give him/her x number more days before you report the rifle as stolen.

    I would give him a call and the time it took me to drive there to provide a tracking number. Then take action accordingly.
    No tracking number/Bad Ju-Ju
     

    gmcttr

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    Assuming he didn't write down the tracking number, he should be able to go to UPS's website and look it up or call them for the info.
     

    Twangbanger

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    Sorry in advance for the lack of authoritative input, but in addition to the shipping tracking number, isn't the FFL required to sign the serial number in and out of their FFL "log book" when they took the gun in? And back out when they shipped it?

    There's a lot of unknowns here and it's beyond anything I've experienced, but I would be strongly considering reporting the gun missing. It has been unaccounted-for quite some time now, and according to the 4473s you have filled out, this gun is currently owned by you. I am not an expert but that would make me nervous. I don't think that gun went in a trash compactor. Sooner or later it's going to turn up, somewhere, and you want to put yourself on the right side of that.
     

    ljk

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    I'm not run to the lawyer guy, but I think a call to your lawyer, the local ATF are in order.

    $700 dollar rifle or 7cent piece of candy, good business practices are good (and legal) practices

    In my own experience, ATF doesn't care.

    This happened to me few years ago:

    Bought, paid in full for a silencer at LGS, not in-stock, but they had it on Form 3 so got the serial number to fill out Form 4 at the time I paid for it.

    I was asked to wait for a week before mailing it, which I did.

    Time went by, I kept checking with NFA, finally got told it was approved.

    I called into the shop asking them to look out for my stamp. 3 weeks later still no stamp according to the shop.

    30 days later I filed the request for Certified Copy of Approval, it arrived at my home a week later.

    I took it to the shop to pick up my can.

    Upon arrival, I was told they Did NOT have my can, nobody knew what happened.

    I told them I would call ATF if my can doesn't show up in 24 hours,

    It did not show up.

    I called NFA, I was told they only approve or disapprove forms, nothing else.

    Called ATF, was told to call NFA.

    Called NFA again, was told to contact local field office.

    Called the field office, left msg, waited for a call back.

    Nobody called back, Called/left msg repeatedly, Never got to speak to a live person, or call back.

    Finally, after another month of back and forth with all the parties involved and I was ready to file suit, I got a call from the shop owner telling me the can was "at the distributor and on it's way to the shop".

    I was provided with a tracking number. It arrived couple days later, then I took possession after finishing proper paperwork.

    My guess was the shop didn't pay the distributor for the can until the very end.

    But during the whole ordeal, the Feds showed absolutely zero interest on finding out what happened.

    The shop is no longer in business.
     
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