Need Identification Help

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • 1032JBT

    LEO and PROUD of it.......even if others aren't
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Feb 24, 2009
    1,641
    36
    Noblesville
    I got a new gun for my birthday......:rockwoot:problem is I don't know anything about it. Here are some pics to aid in the ID.

    Overall picture:
    oldgun001.jpg


    Barrel and ramrod (notice octogon down to round shape):
    oldgun002.jpg


    Closer view of above picture:
    http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz265/fpd9317/oldgun003.jpg

    Hammer and trigger assembly:
    http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz265/fpd9317/oldgun004.jpg

    Closer view of above:
    http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz265/fpd9317/oldgun005.jpg

    Underside of trigger guard has serial number punched in X581
    http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz265/fpd9317/oldgun006.jpg

    Barrel and "reciver" have same serial number:
    http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz265/fpd9317/oldgun007.jpg



    All the numbers I have found on this gun match and on top of the barrel you can see a punch line that shows the barrel is matched up to this gun. I can't find any manufacturer name anywhere but I did find a letter stamped into the left side in the metal, it is only the letter "R" with nothing else around it.


    Any help you guys can give me would be great, even if it's just giving me a road to start down. Thanks in advance!!!
     

    EvilleDoug

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jan 8, 2010
    3,676
    38
    Evansville
    I wish I could help, but I have no idea. I'm sure once the "old timers" get in here (no offense) they will be better able to help out.
     

    possum_128

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    13   0   0
    Mar 21, 2008
    2,487
    84
    Martinsville area
    Look likw a .50 cal black powder Hawkin carbine of some type. I have one like it made by Tradtions. As far as brand, any markings? these were and still are made by a number of manufactures.
     

    1032JBT

    LEO and PROUD of it.......even if others aren't
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Feb 24, 2009
    1,641
    36
    Noblesville
    Look likw a .50 cal black powder Hawkin carbine of some type. I have one like it made by Tradtions. As far as brand, any markings? these were and still are made by a number of manufactures.



    The only marking I found other than the serial number is the letter "R" on the left side in the metal
     

    oldbikelvr

    Marksman
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    May 1, 2010
    265
    18
    Bloomington, IN
    When I was shooting a lot of black powder in the 80's there were a lot of guys building custom guns. My dad has a Kentucky Rifle that his grandad (a blacksmith) built from scratch in the 40's I believe. My dad's cousin was building custom muzzloaders in the 80's as well. If there are no markings, this may be what you have.
     

    Hiram2005

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    7   0   0
    May 9, 2008
    814
    16
    Plains of Hamilton County
    I'm pretty sure you have an old one there. I've had a couple similar in the past. What's known as a trade musket. This one is still percussion lock. A lot of these were converted to cartridge, using a type of rolling block known as an Allin conversion.

    They were called trade muskets as the purpose was in trading with the Indians for furs and such. Should be a smoothbore and probably about a 20 gauge in size.

    If I saw it in person I could probably tell you more.
     

    steif

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 100%
    80   0   0
    Feb 8, 2009
    403
    18
    rifle

    Hi,
    I think they are on the right track, It looks to be a mix of parts and put together rifle. No big deal, because that's what they did and still do today.

    I think the barrel was original octagon the full length, then they machined it to round , I've seen some rifles with this it is generally called a cannon muzzle octagon breech barrel. the stock and lock look to be a british enfield, perhaps 1853 pattern. I've seen similar marked tower as well. if it was a early gunsmith putting it together I would think it would be marked by him, the lack of name and only numbers stamped makes me think it might be a home brew rifle that a hobbyist might have done in the 1940's or 50's, using what parts he had or found locally. he probably buffed all the original markings off the lock and barrel.

    but, this is my opinion, it might be completely wrong. and there very well could be some marks under the barrel or behind the lock if it's taken apart.
    does it have a plate on the opposite side of the lock in the wood, or just screws?
    nice interesting rifle whatever it is.
    Good luck finding out about it.
     

    Hiram2005

    Expert
    Rating - 100%
    7   0   0
    May 9, 2008
    814
    16
    Plains of Hamilton County
    Hi,
    I think they are on the right track, It looks to be a mix of parts and put together rifle. No big deal, because that's what they did and still do today.

    I think the barrel was original octagon the full length, then they machined it to round , I've seen some rifles with this it is generally called a cannon muzzle octagon breech barrel. the stock and lock look to be a british enfield, perhaps 1853 pattern. I've seen similar marked tower as well. if it was a early gunsmith putting it together I would think it would be marked by him, the lack of name and only numbers stamped makes me think it might be a home brew rifle that a hobbyist might have done in the 1940's or 50's, using what parts he had or found locally. he probably buffed all the original markings off the lock and barrel.

    but, this is my opinion, it might be completely wrong. and there very well could be some marks under the barrel or behind the lock if it's taken apart.
    does it have a plate on the opposite side of the lock in the wood, or just screws?
    nice interesting rifle whatever it is.
    Good luck finding out about it.

    Normally the locks would have a name on them and this made people think that was the name of the gunmaker. Actually this was the name of the lock maker. The actual gunmaker marked his name on the barrel normally. Most of the ones like this had no name on the barrel or the lock.
    You are probably correct about the Enfield lock, it does resemble those.
     

    2cool9031

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    43   0   0
    Mar 4, 2009
    6,569
    38
    NWI
    I'm pretty sure you have an old one there. I've had a couple similar in the past. What's known as a trade musket. This one is still percussion lock. A lot of these were converted to cartridge, using a type of rolling block known as an Allin conversion.

    They were called trade muskets as the purpose was in trading with the Indians for furs and such. Should be a smoothbore and probably about a 20 gauge in size.

    If I saw it in person I could probably tell you more.
    Code:

    I agree...from the pictures, it seems to be a trade musket. I believe the indians in South America still use them.
     
    Top Bottom