Join INGunOwners For Free
Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 59

Thread: Ron Pauls 0% income tax would create 'the most jobs in the history of the world'

  1. #21
    Grandmaster ATOMonkey's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by mrjarrell View Post
    The FT doesn't eliminate the income tax. It only hopes the income tax is eliminated and relies on the good will of congress to initiate a repeal of the 16th amendment. It also creates a huge entitlement program, in the guise of their "prebate". Add in the fact that it does nothing to actually reduce spending and income redistribution and it's a recipe for a truly distasteful meal. The 0% income tax is a far better solution. Let government downsize and leave the producers alone.
    Agreed on most points. 0% tax is just a likely to happen as unicorn powered electic power generation though.

    By the by...mandating states to pay a tribute wasn't a really awesome system either, and would do nothing to curb Federal spending or taxation, because there are no natural limits on it.

    My plan... Repeal the 16th amendment. Repeal ALL other Federal taxes, duties, fees, etc, including tariffs.

    One national sales tax with one rate for everyone.

    End new enrollment in all New Deal and Great Society programs. End all prohibition.

    Sit back and bask in the prosperity.

  2. #22
    Plinker

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by ATOMonkey View Post
    Going back to the gold standard would totally bone anyone with any debt.

    Your $100,000 mortgage that you thought was easily managable just became impossible to ever pay off.

    Unless you want to re-value the currency, by doing an FDR bank holiday and taking everyone's stuff and giving them back "new" reserve notes.
    Why?
    And the road we're currently on is heading straight for what you say will happen if we re-adopt the gold standard, hell, it's already happening!

  3. #23
    Grandmaster ATOMonkey's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Why?
    And the road we're currently on is heading straight for what you say will happen if we re-adopt the gold standard, hell, it's already happening!

    Going back to the gold standard would mean rapid deflation.

  4. #24
    Expert John Galt's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Bummer View Post
    Let's see,

    Poor folks would support the economy with all or most of their income, and pay taxes on it to boot. Rich folks would support the economy with a little of their income, and only pay taxes on that.

    That sure seems fair. For the rich. Sounds like class warfare to me, with the rich winning. I find myself wondering just who's envying whom.

    I think I prefer the idea of no taxes at all.
    We have to have taxation, simply to fund the limited dusties of government. The Fairtax is great, as it gives people a prebate, which covers the taxation on basic goods and services. That way, nobody really pays taxes on the essentials. Right now, goods and services have an embedded tax in them to cover the production/provision expense imposed by compliance costs (SS, Medicare, Medicaid, unemployment, workers comp, associated office personnel to deal with this, etc.) right now. Eliminate this imbedded expense and this would go away and would put our produced goods/services on a much better footing competing against imports. A Fairtax would also harvest all of the income taxes NOT being paid by illegal industry; drug dealers, prostitutes, etc. Pimps, ho's and pushers gots to eat and buy things! Tourism would provide a huge revenue stream, AND, it is a progressive tax (this should really turn the Libs on!), as those that buy more things (the evil "rich") would pay more taxes. The ultimate bonus is that it takes away the power from the government to pick winners and losers, which is what landed us where we (and the world) are at right now, broke.
    Dormant Marine, NRA Golden Eagle, GOA Life, SAF Life, ISRPA Life & FORMER NAGR Member.

  5. #25
    Grandmaster 88GT's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Garb View Post
    If you want to go that way, why not a Tariff? I'm not fond of any taxes, but this type is far better (in my limited understanding of our current economic system) than a national sales or income tax.
    If *I* want to go that way? Don't you think we have to? At least for starters? There is no way in hell we'll get the income tax eliminated without replacing it with something else. Even if we managed to eliminate all the other non-Constitutional spending, we'd still fall short of revenue needs because we lack the other historical income streams we used to have and have relied almost solely on income.

    As for tariffs, I'm all for them. It is oft forgot in these discussions of "Oh look how much better it was back then" that the U.S. received a VAST MAJORITY of its tax income from tariffs and duties. I posted in another thread several months ago a breakdown of the relative contribution personal taxes and tariffs/duties made throughout the course of our history. The only reason personal taxes were so low in our early days is because we had alternative income streams.

    Okay, I just looked for the link, hoping it was a wiki doc, and sure enough, here it is: Tariffs in United States history - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The numbers aren't adjusted for inflation so it's hard to do a full-on comparison, but the relationship between income tax and non-income tax revenue is telling enough. Someone here argued against tariffs saying they had no historical role. I pulled this article to point out that the very reason we had such economic freedom in our early days was because we relied on tariffs/duties/etc.


    Tariffs are not without their disadvantages, but considering that the first rounds of taxation amounted to about a dollar per person to meet the federal budget, it only took a person about a modern work week to pay it off. The key is to rein in federal spending so that what we can reasonably collect in tariffs meets the budget requirements without creating a backlash of economic consequences in other areas.

  6. #26
    Expert John Galt's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by ATOMonkey View Post
    Going back to the gold standard would mean rapid deflation.


    What else is there when everything is inflated? Why is a $20 gold piece, that used to be worth $20 (the period of 1800-1900, same worth = zero inflation. Imagine that ) now worth about $1800? Is gold that much more valuable or is the dollar worth that much less?

    "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." - Thomas Jefferson
    Dormant Marine, NRA Golden Eagle, GOA Life, SAF Life, ISRPA Life & FORMER NAGR Member.

  7. #27
    Plinker

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post

    What else is there when everything is inflated? Why is a $20 gold piece, that used to be worth $20 (the period of 1800-1900, same worth = zero inflation. Imagine that ) now worth about $1800? Is gold that much more valuable or is the dollar worth that much less?

    "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." - Thomas Jefferson
    DING DING DING folks we have a winner!

    Read, re-read and re-read this post again because it's 100% correct.
    If you don't understand it do some more research and read more about the Federal Reserve etc. This IS the SHTF that you're all talking about.

  8. #28
    Grandmaster ATOMonkey's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by John Galt View Post

    What else is there when everything is inflated? Why is a $20 gold piece, that used to be worth $20 (the period of 1800-1900, same worth = zero inflation. Imagine that ) now worth about $1800? Is gold that much more valuable or is the dollar worth that much less?

    "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." - Thomas Jefferson
    No, I totally get it. So are you saying that we peg the dollar to whatever an ounce of gold is going for right now? That would be the FDR through Nixon "Gold Standard" which really wasn't much of a standard since the government could either mess with the price of gold, or the exchange rate between dollars and gold, as it was a fiat currency referenced to the going price of gold.

    If we go back to pre-FDR gold standard, where coins were actually made out of gold, we'll have to confiscate and re-issue all of our currency, or else, everyone with debt will instantly go bankrupt. If I have to hold $100,000 worth of pre-FDR debt I am totally screwed.

    We could use the English Silver Standard, which just moves all the time. One pound used to actually be worth a pound of silver sterling. Then a pound was worth 1/2 pound of silver sterling, and so on etc.

    So, what rate of Au oz. / $ do we want to use? Also, will we put that into the constitution or just let someone else dicker with it later?

  9. #29
    Expert lashicoN's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by JettaKnight View Post
    What's weird is a 0% income tax. Personally, I like things like the FAA (not TSA!), DoD, NASA and a bunch of other abbreviations. Right now, it's paying my bills.
    Weird, huh? Whatever floats your boat. I think being robbed, day after day, by people who then tell you what you are and are not allowed to do is weird. I think people who defend that institution are weird, but we're all different.

    If income tax was 0%, you would have some extra money in your checking. You could send a charitable check on over to FAA, DoD, and NASA. If the government kept their hands out of my pockets, I would love to give NASA some charity. I've always thought a system where we get to choose where our tax dollars go would be ideal. Don't like our police state? Direct your tax dollars elsewhere. Value exploration and the furthering of humanity? Donate 100% of your taxes this year to NASA.

    Unfortunately, we can barely get people to vote every four years, let alone every year. Maybe myself and 10 other people would like to be able to direct our tax dollars, but too many people wouldn't want to be bothered with personally being involved in the direction of our country every year.

    I would like 0% income tax. I'd like to live in a Constitutional Republic too. Neither are likely to happen.
    Live and learn. Live better and learn more.

  10. #30
    Expert Bondhead88's Avatar

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by ATOMonkey View Post
    Going back to the gold standard would mean rapid deflation.
    The only thing capable of creating deflation is the destruction (physically removing it from the market place) of currency. The same as the only thing capable of causing inflation is the creation (printing of currency). Economics 101


Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •