Probable cause- DNR boat stops

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  • gregkl

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    Growing up in Michigan spending plenty of time on the water, DNR frequently pulled along side to check for safety equipment and licenses. We complied and never gave it any thought. DNR officers were all pretty cool.
     

    bocefus78

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    I'm pretty sure they can do a safety check for pfd's, fire extinguisher, etc with no pc.....and if they sniff out some pc while doing a safety check that's all they need to persue it.
     

    KJQ6945

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    I have always wondered how they got around the PC issue. Driving a car, carrying a handgun and fishing, all require a license, but fishing is the only one that justifies a license check. :dunno:

    I had bass boats for years, and have been "checked" most weekends while being on the lake. On at least two occasions, twice in the same weekend, by the same CO.

    It is almost comical to watch. Two rental boats in the same party cove. One, a double decker pontoon full of teenagers doing keg stands, and the second, a fishing boat with two guys fishing. The fishing boat will be stopped.
     

    t-squared

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    https://www.boat-ed.com/indiana/handbook/page/32/Enforcement-IC-14-15-10-1/

    No PC needed for them to stop you.

    We boated exclusively on Lake Michigan and got stopped multiple times every summer. I think, for us anyway, the reason was because we always had a bunch of my daughters friends with us. They seemed to do more stops on boats loaded down with people compared to just a couple out for the day. The stops were under a couple of minutes and consisted of making sure we weren't drinking and checking for life jackets. As soon as I raised the rear seat and the officer could see we had a crap load of jackets they were on their way!
     
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    KJQ6945

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    https://www.boat-ed.com/indiana/handbook/page/32/Enforcement-IC-14-15-10-1/

    No PC needed for them to stop you.

    We boated exclusively on Lake Michigan and got stopped multiple times every summer. I think, for us anyway, the reason was because we always had a bunch of my daughters friends with us. They seemed to do more stops on boats loaded down with people compared to just a couple out for the day. The stops were under a couple of minutes and consisted of making sure we weren't drinking and checking for like jackets. As soon as I raised the rear seat and the officer could see we had a crap load of jackets they were on their way!

    I guess the question should be, does the 4th amendment stop at the boat ramp?
     

    AtTheMurph

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    https://www.boat-ed.com/indiana/handbook/page/32/Enforcement-IC-14-15-10-1/

    No PC needed for them to stop you.

    We boated exclusively on Lake Michigan and got stopped multiple times every summer. I think, for us anyway, the reason was because we always had a bunch of my daughters friends with us. They seemed to do more stops on boats loaded down with people compared to just a couple out for the day. The stops were under a couple of minutes and consisted of making sure we weren't drinking and checking for life jackets. As soon as I raised the rear seat and the officer could see we had a crap load of jackets they were on their way!

    If the daughters friends were past puberty I can make an informed guess as to why you were stopped.
     

    1mil-high

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    They are permitted to conduct boater safety checks for the necessary equipment such as life jackets, fire extinguisher, flares on certain waterways. They would need reasonable suspicion or probable cause of a specific crime to detain you further than necessary to perform those specific functions.

    As far as the fourth amendment concerns I don't have the case law on it, but I believe that it falls in the same realm as sobriety check points would on the roadway. It must have been found to be reasonable by a higher court. That being said it has always seemed a little odd to me for that specific instance of not needing reasonable suspicion for a stop.
     

    Fargo

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    In a state of acute Pork-i-docis
    I have been told that the DNR officer can enter your home, Car and personal property WITHOUT A WARRANT.
    It is to stop poachers.

    Aren't the DNR officers the most powerful LEO's in the state?

    The thread linked below addresses both of these DNR promoted "concepts" and gives the caselaw where the Indiana courts have for over 30 years uniformly rejected the idea that the 4th Amendment doesn't apply to DNR officers.

    https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/great-outdoors/388761-search-conservation-officer.html
     

    Tactically Fat

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    Lot of myths in this thread...

    COs aren't any more "powerful" than any other LEO. They just have different purview / duties than City / Muni / County / Staties.
     
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