Trigger Pull Gauge

[Doublehelix]

I just got a new Lyman electronic trigger pull gauge, and I don't think it is reading correctly. The readings seem way too low to me.

I do have one of the old-fashioned Wheeler spring models as well that is probably only about 6 months old, and it i reading about 2X the readings from the new Lyman.

Before anyone asks, I have it set for lbs/oz and not kg/g.

I don't expect either to be 100% accurate, and I get that the values will vary depending on how the gauge is placed on the trigger, pull technique, etc., but the values are *consistently* way low, almost to where I think they need to be doubled.

For example, on my STI 2011 that Allen M. has worked on for me is reading at about 1 lb 7 oz pretty consistently on the Lyman, but it comes in at about exactly 3 lbs on the Wheeler gauge. I know he had it set at about 3 lbs after he was done.

I also checked a new SIG P320, and on the Lyman, I am getting pretty consistently around 3 lbs 10 oz, and on the Wheeler, about 7 lb.

Something is definitely fishy here, but I am not sure how to test or calibrate either unit.

Any suggestions here?

Thanks in advance.

 

[churchmouse]

I just got a new Lyman electronic trigger pull gauge, and I don't think it is reading correctly. The readings seem way too low to me.

I do have one of the old-fashioned Wheeler spring models as well that is probably only about 6 months old, and it i reading about 2X the readings from the new Lyman.

Before anyone asks, I have it set for lbs/oz and not kg/g.

I don't expect either to be 100% accurate, and I get that the values will vary depending on how the gauge is placed on the trigger, pull technique, etc., but the values are *consistently* way low, almost to where I think they need to be doubled.

For example, on my STI 2011 that Allen M. has worked on for me is reading at about 1 lb 7 oz pretty consistently on the Lyman, but it comes in at about exactly 3 lbs on the Wheeler gauge. I know he had it set at about 3 lbs after he was done.

I also checked a new SIG P320, and on the Lyman, I am getting pretty consistently around 3 lbs 10 oz, and on the Wheeler, about 7 lb.

Something is definitely fishy here, but I am not sure how to test or calibrate either unit.

Any suggestions here?

Thanks in advance.

All I can say to this is if you want to borrow mine or bring yours here we can do some back to back tests. I believe mine is spot on.

 

[kirtar]

You could try picking up a gallon jug of water which should weigh 8 pounds.

 

[Doublehelix]

All I can say to this is if you want to borrow mine or bring yours here we can do some back to back tests. I believe mine is spot on.

Thanks, I may take you up on that depending on what I find.

You could try picking up a gallon jug of water which should weigh 8 pounds.

I thought about something like that, but it is not a scale, it needs to "click" as if pulling a trigger though, doesn't it?

 

[Doublehelix]

OK, as as test, I just tried "weighing" a 5 lb weight that my wife has that has a strap on it to use when walking. Both gauges clocked in a just over 5#. That is a good sign, and I thought maybe the unit just needed a reboot or something.

Well... I came up to check my guns again, and I can see that it is a bit technique-dependant, but I am still getting readings that are much lower on the Lyman. I need to spend some time with it for a while and see if I can figure this out.

It is interesting that both units registered 5# on the weight however. This makes me think I must be doing something wrong with the trigger check.

 

[rosejm]

Fresh battery?


Have you tried uncoiled rice?

 

[actaeon277]

Can you adjust it? Well, I adjust instruments at work all the time. But they're made to do that. And I don't know your instrument, so I can't say.



Now, the next thing is to check to see how it is off. There are MANY different ways.
A "5 point check" will find most of the problems, or at least tell you what is a problem, and what kind.
Most instruments have a "zero" and a "span".
For you, "zero" is literally, zero.
Your "span" depends on the instrument. Let's assume 10 pounds.
Your 5 point check would be
0 percent - 0 lbs
25 percent - 2.5 lbs
50 percent - 5 lbs
75 percent - 7.5 lbs
100 percent - 10 lbs


To do those checks, you either need certified weights, which you probably don't have, or use 2 more instruments.
You use 3 instruments, because if 1 is off, you don't know which one.
If you have 2 instruments reading right along each other, then you know they are tracking each other. Most likely good, or they have EXACTLY the same problem.

Now, when you use the 3rd (yours) you'll want to compare them at each step.
Write down, so you don't have to keep checking.

and run the test 3 times minimum.

You could have a set screw loose. This will give erratic reading across the board. They might read one type of error, but then shift after some readings, then shift again.
Same thing for a "cold" solder joint.

Then, does your error start off small, then get bigger as the weight gets bigger?
Does your error maintain across the readings. I.E. one pound off consistently?


There are some more test. But I don't know if you can adjust or fix.

But if you find out it's the same error, you can add subtract as necessary.
If the error get's bigger/smaller, you can make a chart to reference.

If it's hose'd (yes, that's a technical term), you can always take it apart.
After all, if it's broken, you can't break it.

 

[churchmouse]

Thanks, I may take you up on that depending on what I find.




I thought about something like that, but it is not a scale, it needs to "click" as if pulling a trigger though, doesn't it?

Sometimes if you pull through the release point you will add weight.

 

[actaeon277]

Well, I just looked online at your trigger gauge. Not sure if it can be "adjusted".

I see the trigger roller recesses.
Make sure that when you extend/retract it that it operates smoothly.
Also, make sure that when you use it, it is FULLY extended.

 

[actaeon277]

I see the range is 12 pounds.
checking it to 10 pound would give you about the same data. You can check it to 10 or 12, either one.

 

[actaeon277]

Sometimes precision electronics that measure weight can be temperature sensitive.
Are you using the instrument at room temperature, and it has been a room temperature long enough so that it is not cold on the inside?

 

[Doublehelix]

Sometimes if you pull through the release point you will add weight.

Hmmmmmm... That makes sense for sure, except in this case it is reading LOW rather than HIGH.

Well, I just looked online at your trigger gauge. Not sure if it can be "adjusted".

I see the trigger roller recesses.
Make sure that when you extend/retract it that it operates smoothly.
Also, make sure that when you use it, it is FULLY extended.

Sometimes precision electronics that measure weight can be temperature sensitive.
Are you using the instrument at room temperature, and it has been a room temperature long enough so that it is not cold on the inside?

@actaeon277, thanks for all of the great advice. I do not see any zero or calibration settings. I am sure it is just a "dumb device". I will see if I can check it at 5lb and 10lb with dumbells and see how it comes out. I don't have anything smaller than 5, or anything in between 5 & 10.

I might just need to find someone with the same device and compare them side-by-side.

 

[churchmouse]

Hmmmmmm... That makes sense for sure, except in this case it is reading LOW rather than HIGH.







@actaeon277, thanks for all of the great advice. I do not see any zero or calibration settings. I am sure it is just a "dumb device". I will see if I can check it at 5lb and 10lb with dumbells and see how it comes out. I don't have anything smaller than 5, or anything in between 5 & 10.

I might just need to find someone with the same device and compare them side-by-side.

My offer is still open.

 

[Doublehelix]

My offer is still open.

Thanks, I will probably take you up on that. I will PM you sometime on Monday or Tuesday. You are awesome!

 

[Flash-hider]

Have you communicated your issue with Lyman?

 

[Doublehelix]

Have you communicated your issue with Lyman?

Not yet. I want to make sure that the problem is with the unit and not the user.

 

[1775usmarine]

Is your firearm mounted or are you holding by hand? I was getting different readings till I mounted my firearms in a sturdy mount.

 

[churchmouse]

Is your firearm mounted or are you holding by hand? I was getting different readings till I mounted my firearms in a sturdy mount.

I have found a way to hold (a 1911) to stabilize it. I can secure it in the Parrot vice with the proper tooling if need be.

 

[Doublehelix]

Is your firearm mounted or are you holding by hand? I was getting different readings till I mounted my firearms in a sturdy mount.

I have found a way to hold (a 1911) to stabilize it. I can secure it in the Parrot vice with the proper tooling if need be.

Just by hand. Never thought about mounting it, but that is a great idea.

I use the same hand-held technique with the Wheeler unit that I use the with the new Lyman one, but assuming they react the same way to a load is a silly mistake. I will try it with the handgun secured.

Thanks for that suggestion, I love it!

 

[Doublehelix]

I tried testing it in a mount, and there is no difference. It is reading about half the value that I would expect, and about half the value of my Wheeler gauge.

I am sending it back and getting a new one.