A tale of interchangeable back-straps and point of impact

[Backpacker]

After completing a Smith and Wesson armorer’s course on the M&P pistols, I took advantage of the discounted price for a full-size M&P 9 mm pistol. I had previously shot a range rental of the same pistol and found I could shoot it as accurately as my other pistols.

The pistol came with the medium back-strap installed. It seemed the pad of my finger was deeper on the trigger than I thought it should be, so I installed the large back-strap to position my fingertip on the trigger. All my targets showed I was hitting left (4” at 25 yards) and slightly low. Same point of impact whether I shot standing two handed or sitting and resting the gun on a bag. I moved the rear sight to the right and the point of impact moved to center on target but still slightly low.

For whatever reason, I decided to put the medium back-strap on. Next range session, all my shots were to the right but good for elevation. I pushed the rear sight back to center of the slide. Now the point of impact is pretty much point of aim. (The biggest factor now is the shooter’s poor eyesight and arthritic hands.) I would not have thought the back-strap would make such a difference.

 

[Tactically Fat]

Grip circumference makes a huge difference in the overall grip/sight alignment/firing of the pistol.

I think many people, especially men, could actually stand to use SMALLER backstraps, if possible.

The more of your hand you can get around the grip of a gun the better your grip on that gun will be. Often that means using medium or small backstraps.

 

[bauerr3]

I never used a backstrap other than the large on my MP, but I guess with the backstrap changing how your hand fits on the grip (which changes how your finger is positioned to get a consistent trigger placement) that makes sense. I'm interested to see if anyone else has noticed this

 

[aspiringsnd]

Grip circumference makes a huge difference in the overall grip/sight alignment/firing of the pistol.

I think many people, especially men, could actually stand to use SMALLER backstraps, if possible.

The more of your hand you can get around the grip of a gun the better your grip on that gun will be. Often that means using medium or small backstraps.

I couldn't agree more.

My first experience with interchangeable back-strap was a couple of years ago when I acquired a VP9. I installed the large back-strap thinking it was going to be necessary for my oven-mitt hands. However, after ~500 rounds down the pipe, I was a bit frustrated with my inconsistency. After hearing a statement made by Pat McNamara regarding trigger control (basically, his theory is to put as much finger on the trigger as possible) I went to the small back-strap. I immediately felt I had better trigger control, more consistent draws and better over-all handling/grip. I'm completely sold on running a smaller grip now.

 

[Doublehelix]

I couldn't agree more.

My first experience with interchangeable back-strap was a couple of years ago when I acquired a VP9.

I've had my VP9 for a couple of years now, and I went through a similar exercise. One of the cool things about the VP9 is that not only is the back strap interchangeable, but so are the grip side panels. You get 3 of each type (S,M, L), and after a bunch of testing, I ended up with some weird combination of the three that I can no longer remember, but something like (I am making this up): Med Backstrap, Sm Left Panel and Lg Right panel. It was some crazy combination, but it fits my hand like a glove.

I don't shoot it as much as I used to nowadays, but I think the concept of completely customizable grips is a great idea.

 

[russc2542]

Oh yes, backstraps can have a huge effect on not so much POI but natural POA, I say that because you can consciously force a good hit with bad ergonomics but with good ergonomics the good hits just happen.

I've had my VP9 for a couple of years now, and I went through a similar exercise. One of the cool things about the VP9 is that not only is the back strap interchangeable, but so are the grip side panels. You get 3 of each type (S,M, L), and after a bunch of testing, I ended up with some weird combination of the three that I can no longer remember, but something like (I am making this up): Med Backstrap, Sm Left Panel and Lg Right panel. It was some crazy combination, but it fits my hand like a glove.

I don't shoot it as much as I used to nowadays, but I think the concept of completely customizable grips is a great idea.

Yup, the VP9 and P30 grip is indeed glorious. Unless you have a really freakishly far from normal hand, it can be made to fit like it was molded for you.

Now someone needs to come up with a quick-change grip so my wife and I can shoot the same gun (I'm 6-4 275lb with mechanic hands, she's 5-4 100lb with dainty artist hands).

 

[halfmileharry]

After completing a Smith and Wesson armorer’s course on the M&P pistols, I took advantage of the discounted price for a full-size M&P 9 mm pistol. I had previously shot a range rental of the same pistol and found I could shoot it as accurately as my other pistols.

The pistol came with the medium back-strap installed. It seemed the pad of my finger was deeper on the trigger than I thought it should be, so I installed the large back-strap to position my fingertip on the trigger. All my targets showed I was hitting left (4” at 25 yards) and slightly low. Same point of impact whether I shot standing two handed or sitting and resting the gun on a bag. I moved the rear sight to the right and the point of impact moved to center on target but still slightly low.

For whatever reason, I decided to put the medium back-strap on. Next range session, all my shots were to the right but good for elevation. I pushed the rear sight back to center of the slide. Now the point of impact is pretty much point of aim. (The biggest factor now is the shooter’s poor eyesight and arthritic hands.) I would not have thought the back-strap would make such a difference.

I can't run my glock19 g4 with any of the straps on it. Any of the straps installed I immediatelly shoot 3" at 10 o'clock. I don't shoot earlier generation glocks well at all.

 

[russc2542]

I can't run my glock19 g4 with any of the straps on it. Any of the straps installed I immediatelly shoot 3" at 10 o'clock. I don't shoot earlier generation glocks well at all.

A Glock with no backstraps is like any other gun with a 12xxxxxl backstrap. The ergonomics just don't fit everyone.

 

[ChalupaCabras]

Well, YOU'RE the armorer, and I'm just a dummy on the internet... But IMO interchangeable back straps are snake oil.

What happened to you is what happened to me and 99% of everybody else who wastes time swapping out the back straps - The guns ship with 'medium' grips installed for a reason. They are a gimmick, intended only to FOOL the buyer into thinking they are getting something extra in what is an extremely tight market for handgun manufacturers.

Even if there were some speck of utility in them, 99% of handgun owners can't shoot well enough to tell the difference to begin with, and 99% of those will never and have no intentions of ever investing the time and resources to change that.

A Glock with no backstraps is like any other gun with a 12xxxxxl backstrap. The ergonomics just don't fit everyone.

100% true... And completely irrelevant in regard to effective use of a pistol. 'Ergonomics' as popularly discussed online is a bandaid novice shooters commonly attempt to use in place of training; the popular thought is that a pistol that 'fits the shooters hand' will somehow 'naturally point' for them, and the won't have to spend so much time practicing. That's a nice thought, but like every other internet work around for training, I've never actually seen it in real life - Not shooting perfect scores for department qualifications with a Glock that doesn't feel the best in my hand, nor watching 5' 0" females qualify expert with the too big / oversize (according to the internet) M9 in the military.

Shooting well with ANY handgun is about applying fundamentals.

 

[Areoflyer09]

Most grips are too big for me. PPQ with medium backstrap, ok it not great. PPQ with small backstrap backstrap, better but not perfect. 1911s on the other hand fit my hands and point naturally. I don't have to fight the gun to make it do what I want, it just naturally does it.

Kinda the point of finding things that fit isn't it, finding an option where the ergonomics work with you and not against you? Otherwise there would only need to be one handgun and we could all just train to get over fitment issues.

 

[JAL]

Grips can make a difference, on pistols and revolvers. I've found some feel better than others. They've not shifted sight zero, but they do contribute to or mitigate "pulling" on the trigger which shifts the pattern. My hands are large but not huge and have very long fingers. I favor wider and larger grips. A back strap is one way of changing the grip circumference. The thickness of the grip panels is another. Just replaced the OEM panels on a new revolver with thicker ones and it feels much better in my hand. Still working on absorbing recoil with combination of wrist and arm. It's a large bore that's better to allow some recoil rather than trying to fight it and beating my hand, wrist and elbow up.

John

 

[russc2542]

Well, YOU'RE the armorer, and I'm just a dummy on the internet... But IMO interchangeable back straps are snake oil.

What happened to you is what happened to me and 99% of everybody else who wastes time swapping out the back straps - The guns ship with 'medium' grips installed for a reason. They are a gimmick, intended only to FOOL the buyer into thinking they are getting something extra in what is an extremely tight market for handgun manufacturers.

Even if there were some speck of utility in them, 99% of handgun owners can't shoot well enough to tell the difference to begin with, and 99% of those will never and have no intentions of ever investing the time and resources to change that.



100% true... And completely irrelevant in regard to effective use of a pistol. 'Ergonomics' as popularly discussed online is a bandaid novice shooters commonly attempt to use in place of training; the popular thought is that a pistol that 'fits the shooters hand' will somehow 'naturally point' for them, and the won't have to spend so much time practicing. That's a nice thought, but like every other internet work around for training, I've never actually seen it in real life - Not shooting perfect scores for department qualifications with a Glock that doesn't feel the best in my hand, nor watching 5' 0" females qualify expert with the too big / oversize (according to the internet) M9 in the military.

Shooting well with ANY handgun is about applying fundamentals.

I both agree and respectfully disagree. Poor ergonomics can be overcome with training but good ergonomics require less training. whether it's a pistol, long gun, or adjusting the seat on my wife's car when I drive it. she drives with it darn near all the way forward, I have it all the way back and would add a few notches and a 3" spacer behind the steering wheel if I could. When I worked in a shop, yes, I squeezed my 6-5 self into cars adjusted for a 5' granny as to not change their seat position to drive into the shop only because it was only to the shop. If I took a test drive to troubleshoot on public roads, you bet I adjusted everything.

Two problems I see: one: most people wouldn't know good fit or ergonomics if it were a brick hitting them in the face. two: people that look for ergonomics to fix bad habits or a lack of training.