The mechanics of shooting, I'm not getting better.

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  • WanderingSol07

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Aug 7, 2017
    413
    28
    North Central
    I started shooting this last May, first 2 guns were rentals, S&W Victory
    .22lr (450 rounds) and Browning Buckmark .22lr (1,900 rounds). In September
    I bought my first gun, a Browning 1911-380 (600 rounds). It fits my hand
    very well and I enjoy shooting it.


    Here are my bullseye (2") percentages at 7 yards, 30%, 56%, 26%, 32%, 32%,
    54%, 40%, and 41%. I shoot 50 to 100 rounds weekly, this is my last 2
    months activity. As you can tell I have good days and not so good days.


    I have eliminated caffine usage while still using the .22lr's, that helped!
    Also started using 2# weights to strengthen my wrists.


    I feel that I am not improving as I could/should. Those not in the bullseye
    are to the right, slightly higher and lower, everything would be in a 5"
    radius. I'm a left handed shooter, right eye dominant, but I am using my
    left eye for the sights. I shot the same pattern with the 2 .22lrs so I
    think it is me, not 3 guns all being off exactly the same.


    I really think about what I am doing while shooting, sight picture the same;
    middle of first joint on trigger; pulling gently but firmly, not jerking;
    keeping the front sight on target through the pull; raising gun to eye level,
    not lowering my head; keeping both eyes open; and a tight 2 handed grip on the
    gun, but not a deathgrip.


    Have taken 3 courses, beginner shooting, they say I have a good grip and
    stance.


    I feel as every shot should be in the bullseye and am surprised when I miss.


    Please tell me your story of improving over time, did you reach a plateau or
    a wall that took effort to overcome? How did you do it?


    Thanks,


    Tim.
     

    ryan3030

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    94   0   0
    Dec 2, 2010
    1,895
    48
    Indy
    Spend time with a good instructor.

    If you understand sight alignment and round placement is inconsistent, either the gun/ammo are flawed (incredibly unlikely) or you're flinching/moving the gun during the trigger pull.

    To fix "moving the gun during trigger pull", do a lot of dry fire practice. Specifically, focus on pulling the trigger while keeping the gun completely still.
    To fix flinching - the sub-conscious reflex we all have to counteract the gun's recoil - focus on executing the fundamentals of marksmanship, especially a smooth trigger pull. Slow down, focus on each shot. Execute a smooth, slow trigger pull.

    In my experience, about 90% of inaccurate pistol shooting is flinching (assuming the shooter understands sight alignment).
     

    Hopper

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    31   0   0
    Nov 6, 2013
    2,291
    83
    Hamilton County
    The best accessory investment I've made in this hobby was to get a LaserLyte laser target. I've had it for over a couple years now, and I still use it almost every week. Not every range trip is perfect, but I'm not wasting ammo like I used to... it's taught me good muscle memory from the repetition, as well as sight alignment and trigger control.

    Even with this setup and somewhat regular practice, not every shot is a bulls-eye for me either, but it's remarkable how quickly this allowed me to improve.

    I will say that I only go to the first knuckle on my index finger when shooting in DA (primarily with revolvers due to the heavier DA pull required). With semis, it's the pad of my finger on the trigger.
     

    Classic

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   1   0
    Aug 28, 2011
    3,420
    38
    Madison County
    Really give yourself time. You are building a set of fine motor skills. it may take years rather than months for you to get where you are going. I've been at it for 30 years and I still disappoint myself with my performance at times. Be patient and don't give up. Jerry Miculek is one of the current top notch shooters on the planet and I have heard him say often that if you want to attain a high level of performance be the first one at the range and the last one to leave. That's how he got to be a master.
     

    Vigilant

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    21   0   0
    Jul 12, 2008
    11,659
    83
    Plainfield
    TLDR, but, have someone who knows WTF they are doing go with you. Other option, sign up for one of the MANY LOCAL entry level classes. 3-4hours in a basic class is worth more than 10000 rounds downrange of self diagnosing
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
    191,809
    152
    Speedway area
    I started shooting this last May, first 2 guns were rentals, S&W Victory
    .22lr (450 rounds) and Browning Buckmark .22lr (1,900 rounds). In September
    I bought my first gun, a Browning 1911-380 (600 rounds). It fits my hand
    very well and I enjoy shooting it.


    Here are my bullseye (2") percentages at 7 yards, 30%, 56%, 26%, 32%, 32%,
    54%, 40%, and 41%. I shoot 50 to 100 rounds weekly, this is my last 2
    months activity. As you can tell I have good days and not so good days.


    I have eliminated caffine usage while still using the .22lr's, that helped!
    Also started using 2# weights to strengthen my wrists.


    I feel that I am not improving as I could/should. Those not in the bullseye
    are to the right, slightly higher and lower, everything would be in a 5"
    radius. I'm a left handed shooter, right eye dominant, but I am using my
    left eye for the sights. I shot the same pattern with the 2 .22lrs so I
    think it is me, not 3 guns all being off exactly the same.


    I really think about what I am doing while shooting, sight picture the same;
    middle of first joint on trigger; pulling gently but firmly, not jerking;
    keeping the front sight on target through the pull; raising gun to eye level,
    not lowering my head; keeping both eyes open; and a tight 2 handed grip on the
    gun, but not a deathgrip.


    Have taken 3 courses, beginner shooting, they say I have a good grip and
    stance.


    I feel as every shot should be in the bullseye and am surprised when I miss.


    Please tell me your story of improving over time, did you reach a plateau or
    a wall that took effort to overcome? How did you do it?


    Thanks,


    Tim.

    I can see a few issues just from your description but to list would only cause you more confusion I think. There is a series of things that have to happen just after you get a clear sight picture.
    Get some instruction.
     

    Bigtanker

    Cuddles
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    24   0   0
    Aug 21, 2012
    21,688
    151
    Osceola
    Monday nights at Midwest Gun & Range, Romain Yoder does a great class on shooting. The class is 2 hours, 6:00-8:00, and is like $15.
     

    Sniper 79

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    19   0   0
    Oct 7, 2012
    2,939
    48
    Probably the best those guns will shoot. They are not target guns.

    Spend some time behind something that is capable of punching tiny holes if that is what's desired. If you can keep them in the black you are good to go otherwise. Work on keeping both eyes open and speed will come.
     

    BE Mike

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    18   0   0
    Jul 23, 2008
    7,536
    113
    New Albany
    Just putting rounds down range won't make you a better marksman. You need to study the fundamentals of marksmanship. With good trigger control, any decent pistol should be able to group very well at 7 yds. It sounds like you have already picked up a few bad habits by shooting quite a bit without having a good understanding of what you need to do to shoot well. It is hard to break bad habits on your own, but can be done with training. It just much slower than having a good instructor. You really need to go back to the beginning and learn the basics.
     

    WanderingSol07

    Sharpshooter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Aug 7, 2017
    413
    28
    North Central
    Yes, flinch I suspect, is a problem for me. One reason I think this is if I shoot someone elses gun I do quite good the first magazine. For example last month I shot a Kahr .380 and a Remington R1 .45ACP. For both of them I hit a 4" steel target at 15 yards 7 of 8 shots. I then went back to my .380 and could not hit the same target once out of 8 shots.

    I dry fired once with a laser pistol, will get the laser cartridge that will go in my gun.

    The .22lrs I shot had 5" barrels, I would consider them target pistols. I was up to 60% in the bullseye with them at 7 yards, I just expected the same performance increase with my .380 over time as I did with the .22lrs. My .380 has a 4.25" barrel.

    I have another class coming up next Sunday. I'll see if the instructor offers any one on one time. Elkhart is a 3 hour one way drive for me.

    Thanks much for the suggestions, this is very good to hear!

    Tim.
     

    55fairlane

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Jan 15, 2016
    2,216
    113
    New Haven
    Lots of people are saying flinching, trigger slap, ect......do the ball & dummy drill......have a friend load your magazine with both live rounds and a spent round or a dummy round, don' look, don' know the order, fire the gun, if your doing any flinching, ECT, it will show up on the dummy round.....

    Lots of dry fire helped me......

    Aaron
     

    BE Mike

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    18   0   0
    Jul 23, 2008
    7,536
    113
    New Albany
    Just a guess, but here's what's happening: Look at the target; get sights aligned; look back at the target while yanking the trigger, closing the eyes and then looking back at the target to see what happened. Like I said, you need to start over from the beginning with some idea of the fundamentals of marksmanship. Good ear protection and eye protection will also help make you more mentally relaxed to accept the noise, smoke and recoil. Any bullseye shooters in your neck of the woods? If so, talk to an expert, master or high master about the fundamentals of marksmanship. They are always using and refining them. Once your marksmanship skills improve, then you can add in speed, reloading, moving, tactics, etc.
     
    Last edited:

    halfmileharry

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    65   0   0
    Dec 2, 2010
    11,450
    99
    South of Indy
    I don't know how old you are or how good your eyes are but my shooting went south due to my aging eyes. Precision alignment of the sights is just a memory for me now.
    I had some good shooting glasses made and it helped a lot but it's not the same as a good set of young eyes.
     

    IndyGlockMan

    Master
    Rating - 100%
    23   0   0
    Jul 19, 2011
    1,943
    38
    Fishers
    I saw your percentages on the 2", but how about 4", 6", etc... ???
    If you can put all rounds in a 6" circle at 7-10 yards, you're doing very very well for only learning to shoot since May.
    There's a lot of shooters with decades of experience that can't pull that off so don't be too hard on yourself.
    With only 6 months shooting, you are already way ahead of the curve.
    Keep shooting and practicing those fundamentals and dryfire practice at home. You'll be fine.
     
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