Ballester Molina 1911

[CTC B4Z]

Anybody know much about these? Worth? Probably looking to get rid of it. Handed down to me but I am not a collector.

 

[jwamplerusa]

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/ballester-molina-the-underrated-argentine-45/

"The Ballester-Molina was designed to be a more economical pistol to produce than the 1911A1, which had been adopted by Argentina as the Pistola Sistema Colt Modelo 1927. It was produced by a company called HAFDASA, an Argentine franchise of the Hispano-Suiza firm created by Arturo Ballester and Eugenio Molina in 1929. The pistol was finalized in 1937, and production ran from 1938 until 1955. At that point, it was supplanted by new domestic Argentine production of the 1927 Colt.

Until 1940, the pistols were actually marked “Ballester-Rigaud”, named after Rorice Rigaud, the French engineer who headed the design program at HAFDASA. After he left the company, the name was changed to “Ballester-Molina”. The guns were used by a wide variety of Argentine military and police organizations, and 8,000 were purchased by the UK for use by Special Operations Executive during World War Two. These British contract guns fall between serials 12,000 and 21,000, and have a B-prefix additional serial number on the right side of the frame."

 

[MrSmitty]

Rumors are that some were made of steel from the Graf Spee, that the slide would ring when slide lock was released, because of the quality of the steel...well made guns, and beautiful too.

 

[indy1919a4]

Rumors are that some were made of steel from the Graf Spee, .

Oh God no it begins...

 

[Thor]

Good thread on them here: https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/handguns/330645-legend-argentine-pistols.html

I have two and a double shoulder rig to carry them.

Mine are both marked "POLICIA FEDERAL"

 

[shootersix]

ok 3 observations from me

1-you need to get that rust off the slide! steel wool and some oil should work, then dont put it back in that box!!!, get a silicone gun sock to store it in! cause that rust is thru the blue, and will come back (unless you want to refinish the gun), i'd also remove the grips, and check under them for rust!

2-its a parts gun, the serial number is 25471, but the number on the main spring housing is 51134

3-with those issues, keep it! shoot it! enjoy it!, basically its a 1911 without a grip safety, it was handed down to you, so you've got nothing in it...so shoot it!

 

[CTC B4Z]

That's the info I was looking for.

Thank you!

 

[Thor]

Actually, I think the 25471# is a rack number. The Serial number is the one on the mainspring housing. On the two I own neither has a number on the right side of the frame.

As for pricing un-rusted versions are currently priced 5-600$. There a B prefix (sold to the British) at RIA now listed at 11-1200$.

Here's a couple of good articles: https://www.guns.com/news/2013/08/19/the-ballester-molina-pistol-argentinas-almost-1911 https://www.shootingillustrated.com/articles/2019/10/17/classics-the-argentinian-ballester-molina/

 

[shootersix]

Actually, I think the 25471# is a rack number. The Serial number is the one on the mainspring housing. On the two I own neither has a number on the right side of the frame.

As for pricing un-rusted versions are currently priced 5-600$. There a B prefix (sold to the British) at RIA now listed at 11-1200$.

Here's a couple of good articles: https://www.guns.com/news/2013/08/19/the-ballester-molina-pistol-argentinas-almost-1911 https://www.shootingillustrated.com/articles/2019/10/17/classics-the-argentinian-ballester-molina/

Actually if that was the rack number it’s now the serial number, in the us the serial number has to be on the frame and since the main spring housing can be changed, the government wouldn’t allow that to be number for the gun

 

[Thor]

On the B-M the mainspring housing is part of the frame...not removable. The lower is not like a 1911; only the upper is identical. You can tell in the pictures that the font of the numbers is different from the rest of those on the pistol.

 

[edporch]

Rumors are that some were made of steel from the Graf Spee, that the slide would ring when slide lock was released, because of the quality of the steel...well made guns, and beautiful too.

I remember hearing G. Gordon Liddy say that on his radio show many years back when somebody gifted Mrs Liddy (as he used to say ) one.
I don't believe this turned out to be true though.

 

[Thor]

I remember hearing G. Gordon Liddy say that on his radio show many years back when somebody gifted Mrs Liddy (as he used to say ) one.
I don't believe this turned out to be true though.

The story of the steel is an interesting story, much of which did not come out until the British declassified the information in the '70s. Argentina has no indigenous steel and we were not going to sell them any at the time so they had to get it somewhere. As it turns out an Uruguayan salvage company that was a front for the British Secret Service salvaging a sunken battleship becomes a plausible story; especially considering the B prefix pistols used by the Brits in clandestine ops. One of the reasons they are labeled 11.25mm as opposed to .45acp is to make them not obviously armed by the allies.

Regardless, it's a fun story to tell and due to loss of records at HAFDASA in a fire it's hard to either prove of disprove.

 

[shootersix]

On the B-M the mainspring housing is part of the frame...not removable. The lower is not like a 1911; only the upper is identical. You can tell in the pictures that the font of the numbers is different from the rest of those on the pistol.

ok, I was mistaken, thanks for the info!!!