Bullet and Case separation

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  • 1nderbeard

    Master
    Local Business Supporter
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    Apr 3, 2017
    2,529
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    Hendricks County
    Range buddy shot a cylinder of S&B 158Gr 357 loads in my lightweight 360 revolver. The last round didn't fire, and upon inspection of the brass the bullet was about 1/4 of the way out of the case. I'd heard of that problem before shooting hi power loads from a light revolver.

    Do you think this is load specific or something to be concerned about with any solid 357 load? I've shot some 110gr 357 prior to this without any issue. These were the hottest loads so far with the piece.
     

    Tyler-The-Piker

    Boondock Saint
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    Jun 24, 2013
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    I have some of that exact ammo coming in from sgammo hopefully in the next week or so. Will be shooting it in my wiley clapp gp100. I'll report back once I do.
     

    JHB

    Sharpshooter
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    Oct 7, 2016
    502
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    Columbus
    That is an ammo problem they are not crimped enough. The S&W 360 PD is the scandium framed and titanium cylinder version. They have the warning about no bullets that weigh less than 120G. The S&W forum has a weeks worth of reading on the subject.
     

    mark40sw

    Sharpshooter
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    Jul 5, 2015
    697
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    Roanoke
    I fight this issue on my 500 S&W magnums. Called "jumping the crimp", recoil will force gun and cases back while inertia of non fired bullets will start to move forward from the case. Happens even on a heavy x-frame with 8" barrel. I now use a redding "profile crimp" die to try to stop it.
     

    Hohn

    Master
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    1   0   0
    Jul 5, 2012
    4,444
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    USA
    I fight this issue on my 500 S&W magnums. Called "jumping the crimp", recoil will force gun and cases back while inertia of non fired bullets will start to move forward from the case. Happens even on a heavy x-frame with 8" barrel. I now use a redding "profile crimp" die to try to stop it.
    "Try" to stop-- is it effective?
     

    russc2542

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    Oct 24, 2015
    2,111
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    Columbus
    It is a concern with any revolver, more so the lighter the revolver or the hotter the load. It's only a problem with certain loads, particularly, weakly crimped ammo.
     

    Tombs

    Grandmaster
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    Jan 13, 2011
    12,021
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    Martinsville
    That is an ammo problem they are not crimped enough. The S&W 360 PD is the scandium framed and titanium cylinder version. They have the warning about no bullets that weigh less than 120G. The S&W forum has a weeks worth of reading on the subject.

    The rule about no hot rodded 110gr 357 magnum in a scandium frame gun isn't because of crimp jump, but because it sandblasts the top strap. A stainless steel gun can handle the sandblasting that such a load causes to the top strap. A scandium frame gun can have the top strap cut in half by this flame cutting effect.

    As for bullets jumping crimp on a PD series S&W, it's the nature of the beast. These are some of the hardest recoiling handguns on the planet.
    You may want to get into reloading and cook up your own loads with a very strong roll crimp if you want them to be impervious to the recoil.

    High recoiling revolvers are no different from kinetic bullet pullers.

    When I cook up hot rodded 357 magnum loads, I usually go with hardcast bullets that have a deep crimp groove in the bullet and really crimp the hell of out it. I haven't had any issues with my loads, but sometimes factory loads can be problematic if they're hot enough.
    AVNIDbG.jpg
     

    Drail

    Master
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    Oct 13, 2008
    2,542
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    Bloomington
    Defective product and it's not the crimp. It's the fit between the bullet dia. and the sized and flared brass. Adding more crimp will only make the problem worse - trust me. If you measure bullet dia. and then measure inside of the sized and flared case the case should be 2 or 3 thous. smaller than bullet dia. If it is not NO amount of crimp will hold the buillet in place. While a flyweight gun will make the problem worse the ammo is simply poorly constructed. No crimp can hold a bullet in place if it is the only thing gripping the bullet - there's just not enough surface area for that to work. A heavy crimp into a grooved bullet helps but not all bullets have a crimping groove. Jacketed bullets for semi auto rounds do not. Case neck tension is what holds the bullet. If you handload you can solve this problem by turning down the expander button in your die until it is under bullet dia. I used to work on 1911s a lot and I kept a box of .45 dummy rounds on the bench to test guns with. I turned down my expander to get a tight fit on the FMJ bullets and used them daily for over 16 years and none of them ever set back from all the feeding they did.
     
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    DadSmith

    Grandmaster
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    1   0   0
    Oct 21, 2018
    22,183
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    Ripley County
    Years ago I decided to crimp everything. I have used lees factory crimp dies for years and they work great. I have noticed more consistency in velocity and accuracy from crimping throughout the years.

    I ran into a problem when I first started reloading. My 1st handgun was a 44 magnum. I had several rds that had walked forward from the recoil. Didn't have internet then so you had to find books or an experienced reloader and gain knowledge from them. In my case the lgs owner was a reloader and he told me what I had to do.
     
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