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  1. #21
    Grandmaster

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    Simply tell your congress critters,

    "Your fears don't trump my rights!"
    Dormant U.S.Marine/ NRA Benefactor-Life

  2. #22
    Plinker

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    Quote Originally Posted by eldirector View Post
    I didn't realize those were the only two choices.
    There is probably only one choice, if these are the "two choices" we insist on, because 90% of the public is too ill-informed, and too apathetic, to understand why "a" is a bad choice, and "b" is not a bad choice....

    a) background check implemented at FFL's required for ALL sales (no private sales), and ALL sales registered, or
    b) no new law regarding background checks.

    If we can change "b" to something that actually has a chance, PERHAPS we won't get "a" shoved down our throats (or up somewhere else)...

    a) background check implemented at FFL's required for ALL sales (no private sales), and ALL sales registered, and
    b) background check implemented by anyone who wants to sell a gun, and only sales at FFL's registered....

    Politics is real, unfortunately, and we don't get the choices we'd like.

  3. #23
    Grandmaster Cameramonkey's Avatar

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    Funny thing is I keep hearing folks say "Yeah, I like the Libertarians views. They have some good ideas." (some of them are nuts like open borders, no taxes, anarchism, etc) but overall, its like being a Republican and a democrat, but without the big govt or cronyism. You know, like being a normal responsible American.

    If everyone that really thought that mainstream Libertarianism/lite (Libertarianism without the extremes I noted above) was a good idea, we would likely elect a Libertarian president.

    And no, Libertarians don't just steal from Republicans. That's a myth. There are lots of moderate dems who share the same basic liberal principles of Libertarianism.

    Not that I actually believe this will ever be resolved. It takes everyone having the balls to actually pull that lever, and the faith that we will all pull the same lever as well and not think that we are the only one who would. (thus "throwing away" the vote)



    Last edited by Cameramonkey; 4 Weeks Ago at 22:07.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk Freeman View Post
    A confused cop is an arresty cop.
    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierdoc View Post
    also, where do we sign up to touch Frank's equipment?

  4. #24
    Grandmaster jamil's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by AJMD429 View Post
    There is probably only one choice, if these are the "two choices" we insist on, because 90% of the public is too ill-informed, and too apathetic, to understand why "a" is a bad choice, and "b" is not a bad choice....

    a) background check implemented at FFL's required for ALL sales (no private sales), and ALL sales registered, or
    b) no new law regarding background checks.

    If we can change "b" to something that actually has a chance, PERHAPS we won't get "a" shoved down our throats (or up somewhere else)...

    a) background check implemented at FFL's required for ALL sales (no private sales), and ALL sales registered, and
    b) background check implemented by anyone who wants to sell a gun, and only sales at FFL's registered....

    Politics is real, unfortunately, and we don't get the choices we'd like.
    It doesnít work that way. No new laws are needed. Appeasements is why we have the hoops we have to jump through now. This isnít about stopping ďgun violenceĒ. If it were theyíd look at and try to solve the root causes. This is about checking off agenda items. They donít like the idea of armed citizens. This is about ending that one gun at a time.
    -spreading the word to end the r-word is retarded
    -activism is retarded because, what if youíre full of ****?

  5. #25
    Grandmaster jamil's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cameramonkey View Post
    Funny thing is I keep hearing folks say "Yeah, I like the Libertarians views. They have some good ideas." (some of them are nuts like open borders, no taxes, anarchism, etc) but overall, its like being a Republican and a democrat, but without the big govt or cronyism. You know, like being a normal responsible American.

    If everyone that really thought that mainstream Libertarianism/lite (Libertarianism without the extremes I noted above) was a good idea, we would likely elect a Libertarian president.

    And no, Libertarians don't just steal from Republicans. That's a myth. There are lots of moderate dems who share the same basic liberal principles of Libertarianism.

    Not that I actually believe this will ever be resolved. It takes everyone having the balls to actually pull that lever, and the faith that we will all pull the same lever as well and not think that we are the only one who would. (thus "throwing away" the vote)



    A Libertarian canít get elected because they run bat-**** crazy ideologues every time. Even when they have an opportunity to nominate someone sane, they pick a kook. At least they didnít pick the murderer kook last time.

    I like many of the principles of libertarianism, but not the ideology. Itís not compatible with human nature.
    -spreading the word to end the r-word is retarded
    -activism is retarded because, what if youíre full of ****?

  6. #26
    Grandmaster DoggyDaddy's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by eldirector View Post
    How about:
    If someone that shouldn't have a firearm, say, if convicted of a violent felony, and they are found with a firearm in their possession - regardless of HOW they obtained it (FFL, private sale, theft, gift, borrowed, or found) - they are arrested and charged with a felony, get to spend a little time back in lockup, and the firearm is confiscated. Interesting enough, this could also be used for ANYTHING a convicted felon should not have: weapons, drugs, alcohol, cars, etc....

    To top it off, if the criminal is stupid enough to buy a new gun through an FFL, they would get denied, and could be prosecuted for TRYING to do something illegal.

    Yes, I know this does not STOP someone who MIGHT commit a crime from getting a firearm prior to any crime being committed. Considering criminals get the majority of their firearms illegally anyway, there is no change. Considering good, upstanding citizens are already getting their firearms legally, and NOT committing crimes with them, there is no change.

    Extending the current broken system, that is proven to be ineffective, will not miraculously fix this issue. It does not matter how much folks want it. It does not matter how much hand-wringing folks do. It is known not to work.

    Which then begs the question.... why are folks pushing it? What is the REAL motive?
    I don't recall the exact rate of prosecution for lying on the 4473, but I think it's something like a fraction of a percent. If it were so important to keep guns out of the "wrong hands", it seems to me that this would be a priority. Again, we have all the existing laws we need (and moreso). Just enforce them. Stop trying to pass more and more bull**** laws that don't do a damn thing anyway.

  7. #27
    Grandmaster actaeon277's Avatar

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    And how are we going to get CRIMINALS to do background checks?


    Cause requiring me to get a background check when I sell a gun to my brother doesn't seem like it's going to stop A SINGLE CRIME.


    Ask the State of Indiana how those UBCs worked out for it for TWENTY YEARS.
    Lot of money and effort wasted that could have been better spent on TRYING and CONVICTING criminals.
    "Una salus victis nullam sperare salutem."

    "A citizen may not be required to offer a 'good and substantial reason' why he should be permitted to exercise his rights. The rights existence is all the reason he needs." Benson Everett Legg - Woolard v. Sheridan

    If you're a noob, develop thick skin, and read the FAQs

    Actaeon - act'-tee-on
    The death of Actaeon - http://www.paleothea.com/Myths/Actaeon.html


  8. #28
    Grandmaster Cameramonkey's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamil View Post
    A Libertarian canít get elected because they run bat-**** crazy ideologues every time. Even when they have an opportunity to nominate someone sane, they pick a kook. At least they didnít pick the murderer kook last time.

    I like many of the principles of libertarianism, but not the ideology. Itís not compatible with human nature.
    Not always. Gary Johnson wasnt crazy. But excluding him, Yes I agree. They do tend to run on the cray cray side.

    And yes, they are not exempt from the extremists. I hate trying to deal with the zero taxes, anarchist part of the party.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk Freeman View Post
    A confused cop is an arresty cop.
    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierdoc View Post
    also, where do we sign up to touch Frank's equipment?

  9. #29
    Marksman

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    I have long said that if instead of voting for candidates we took a test on our views and our answers were translated into votes, about 25% each would be Dem and Rep, while the rest would be libertarian. You may not have noticed but there has been a profound shift in politics even though it is not widely discussed AND will take a few years to filter through the congress.

    So as not to hijack this I will make a new thread...

  10. #30
    Marksman alabasterjar's Avatar

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    Uh...no. Nope. Not one inch.
    24toeo.jpg

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