Police Confiscate Man's Firearm After Anonymous "Antifa" Members Accuse Him Of B

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • qwerty

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Sep 24, 2010
    1,514
    113
    NWI
    https://national-justice.com/police...-probable-cause-after-antifa-doxed-him-racist

    Nothing illegal or of a criminal nature was found during the search, but Sgt. Grgich was able to get a judge's permission to seize Casarez's*handgun, a pair of pants and a "racist" t-shirt*using a new law enforcement tool called a "gun restraining order," which was signed by Judge Jaime R. Roman.**

    The Sacramento County Sheriff's Office is bragging about being the first in the country to seize a firearm*using primarily the owner's political ideology as the excuse.*
     

    Route 45

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    92   0   0
    Dec 5, 2015
    14,884
    113
    Indy
    More info...

    kcra.jpg


    https://www.kcra.com/article/sacramento-county-man-white-supremacist-gun/33449460
     

    KellyinAvon

    Blue-ID Mafia Consigliere
    Staff member
    Moderator
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Dec 22, 2012
    24,791
    150
    Avon
    The Founders are spinning in their graves. Many need to lose their jobs. Lawsuits now. If there is not push-back (and I mean knock them on their sorry asses) right now, in 10 years it'll be us.
     

    qwerty

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Sep 24, 2010
    1,514
    113
    NWI
    Hate speech is free speech. I/we may not agree with what is said, but legally he is 100% entitled to say in in America.....in California...not so much.
     
    Rating - 100%
    128   0   0
    Jan 28, 2009
    3,656
    113
    Just goes to show you how most liberal run cities and police departments stand on believing terrorists over normal citizens. This will get worst.
     

    Lex Concord

    Not so well-known member
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    26   0   0
    Dec 4, 2008
    4,479
    83
    Morgan County
    Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn said:
    “And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

    Whether history repeats or rhymes, there are lessons in the past.
     

    SwikLS

    Shooter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Oct 26, 2015
    1,172
    113
    The Bunker
    Have no fear folks! Soon police departments in these areas will be defunded and there won't then be enough officers to answer these kinds of calls any more.
     

    JettaKnight

    Я з Україною
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Oct 13, 2010
    26,517
    113
    Fort Wayne
    So, we don't want dangerous people to have guns, but we don't want police to take them away?

    Got it.




    In this instance (and probably all like this) it's hard to judge from just a couple of news reports.
    It's possible the guy is the victim of shenanigans, or a dangerous wackadoodle, or a combination of the two.

    At least from the report, he definitely doesn't sound like anyone that would fit into our community. Praising mass killers is far stretch from just voicing conservative opinions.


    KCRA said:
    Casarez's gun violence restraining order expires Friday, but a hearing will take place this week to determine if it should be extended, the sheriff's office said.
    It seems the cops confiscated his guns for a period of [STRIKE]less than a week[/STRIKE] EDIT: Seizure was on July 15. What's the odds that something will be reported in the news then?



    PS - I'm glad I stopped wearing Levi's.
     
    Last edited:

    qwerty

    Master
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Sep 24, 2010
    1,514
    113
    NWI
    That article has a lot more info than the first. It also makes the first one look like it is agenda driven more than fact driven.

    It seems they both are agenda driven. The latter article an attempt to justify the "why" about removing someone's legally owned firearm because of what he believes or said. Nothing in either article support anything that would violate a law being broken. The entire warrant and Probable Cause is here: https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws.com/files/search-warrant-andrew-casarez-1595974650.pdf which is so flimsy it would only be signed in Cali.

    “This individual had a lengthy history of promoting violence online, targeting minority groups,” Nothing in the PC supports this. He had a DUI arrest...that is his criminal history.

    "The sheriff's office said detectives found open-source images online that Casarez posted, displaying "ideals for violence against minorities and called for murder and rape of law enforcement and people of Jewish descent." Nothing in the PC supports this. In fact, the word rape or Jew do not appear, and the word murder only appears when defining another persons actions, not the accused. The word threat is not used in any way to describe the accused other than "his access to firearm(s) make him a realistic threat to the community". "open-source images" is someone else's that was re-posted by the accused. Sounds like he got caught in a honeypot.

    "Detectives were told that if we wished to speak with Andrew we would have to go through his attorney, even though he has no known pending criminal charges." sounds like they got bent out of shape and retaliated.
     
    Last edited:

    JettaKnight

    Я з Україною
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Oct 13, 2010
    26,517
    113
    Fort Wayne
    Just a CZ-75? At least he has good taste in firearms.



    EDIT: After reading it, that PC is really, really, flimsy; IMHO, IANAL.
     
    Last edited:

    Ark

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    25   0   0
    Feb 18, 2017
    6,735
    113
    Indy
    From "this is only for dire and imminent threats" to "we take guns from anyone with bad opinions".

    Oh look it's exactly what we said would happen.
     

    chipbennett

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 18, 2014
    10,937
    113
    Avon
    So, we don't want dangerous people to have guns, but we don't want police to take them away?

    Got it.


    In this instance (and probably all like this) it's hard to judge from just a couple of news reports.
    It's possible the guy is the victim of shenanigans, or a dangerous wackadoodle, or a combination of the two.

    At least from the report, he definitely doesn't sound like anyone that would fit into our community. Praising mass killers is far stretch from just voicing conservative opinions.

    It seems the cops confiscated his guns for a period of [STRIKE]less than a week[/STRIKE] EDIT: Seizure was on July 15. What's the odds that something will be reported in the news then?

    PS - I'm glad I stopped wearing Levi's.

    For me, the issue is lack of due process - and explicit violation of fourth amendment protections. Upon the basis of what probable cause (of unlawful activity) was this seizure conducted?

    There is a difference between hateful/disgusting rhetoric, and evidence constituting probable cause that he intended to act unlawfully according to that rhetoric. The latter may constitute grounds for seizure; the former certainly does not.
     

    JettaKnight

    Я з Україною
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Oct 13, 2010
    26,517
    113
    Fort Wayne
    From "this is only for dire and imminent threats" to "we take guns from anyone with bad opinions".

    Oh look it's exactly what we said would happen.

    It's really hard to see just what Mr. Casarez has said, because of lot of it must be on the dark web, but I think it's fair to say it's much more vitriolic than, "bad opinions".
     

    JettaKnight

    Я з Україною
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    6   0   0
    Oct 13, 2010
    26,517
    113
    Fort Wayne
    For me, the issue is lack of due process - and explicit violation of fourth amendment protections. Upon the basis of what probable cause (of unlawful activity) was this seizure conducted?

    There is a difference between hateful/disgusting rhetoric, and evidence constituting probable cause that he intended to act unlawfully according to that rhetoric. The latter may constitute grounds for seizure; the former certainly does not.

    Question: if a judge signs off on a search warrant and seizure, is that not due process?


    And I'll agree the search warrant has a lot of flummery about people being cranky about COVID-19, so we need to act right meow.


    What I don't agree with is the general attitude that, "it's wrong if they temporarily remove someone's firearms, but don't arrest a person." And, "everyone that is subject to this is a good guy who's a victim." The latter seems more like looking at it subjectively (i.e. "this could be me") rather than objectively.
     
    Last edited:

    chipbennett

    Grandmaster
    Site Supporter
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 18, 2014
    10,937
    113
    Avon
    So, now "reasonable suspicion" constitutes "probable cause", and a mere police officer is a licensed psychiatrist. From the affidavit:

    Your affiant believes Caesarez's recent posts, the expectation to prove his loyalty as a result of being "doxed" are indicative of random acts of hatred carried out by a "Lone Wolf attacker." Motivated by his ideology and support of white supremacy. As a result of Caesarez's posts, blogs, and podcasts, your affiant questions Caesarez's mental stability. Caesarez's behavior suggests he is dangerous to others and his posts, blogs, and podcasts demonstrate that he is likely to use his recently purchased firearm dangerously in the present or very near future.

    The danger of "firearm restraining orders", demonstrated in the first-known use of one.
     
    Top Bottom