M1916 Berthier find

[Wolfhound]

I picked this up at the Muncie Gunshow. It's an M1916 French Berthier in 8mm Lebel caliber. It doesn't have much in the way of markings. No import marks and just the marking on the left side of the receiver shown in the photos below. The rifle had been hanging on a wall for years and was screaming to be cleaned up and oiled. The stock cleaned up really nice and the barrel looks good just a little frosted with strong rifling.

I have some corrosive ammunition on hand but decided to wait until my reloading stuff arrives to shoot it. I have a MAS36 but this rifle seems to be a much different animal.

 

[churchmouse]

That cleaned up really well.

 

[Ballstater98]

I had an attic find in that realm I rescued and cleaned up. The 8mm Lebel and 5 round clips are rough to find, but I've gotten lucky recently.

 

[Wolfhound]

Thanks CM I am very happy with the rifle though I admit having little knowledge about them.

Ballstater98 - Very nice carbine you have there. I ordered one 5 round clip from Liberty Tree Collectors. It was not cheap. Seems like someone would start making reproduction clips for them. I have some brass, bullets and reloading dies on the way.

 

[Ballstater98]

I was informed factory 8mm Lebel is "seasonal" which means when it hits sites or shelves you nab it. I think I'm on every 'notify when back in stock' list. I'm not a reloader, so I rely on Precision Cartridge up here to make my ammo.
There are reproduction 3 rounders everywhere. I too wonder why the 5 rounder demand is not being capitalized on.

 

[Wolfhound]

I was informed factory 8mm Lebel is "seasonal" which means when it hits sites or shelves you nab it. I think I'm on every 'notify when back in stock' list. I'm not a reloader, so I rely on Precision Cartridge up here to make my ammo.
There are reproduction 3 rounders everywhere. I too wonder why the 5 rounder demand is not being capitalized on.

Grafs currently is showing 8mm Lebel PCI ammo in stock. It's a little over 1.50 a round.

Do you have any 8mm Lebel brass you would like to sell?

 

[Ballstater98]

Grafs currently is showing 8mm Lebel PCI ammo in stock. It's a little over 1.50 a round.

Do you have any 8mm Lebel brass you would like to sell?

No, I haven't even fired mine yet. It turned into my winter project. I need a gunsmith to look at mine 1st just to be safe. That won't be until June or July. I want it to go bang not boom. If it is a wall hanger, so be it. I'll keep you in mind though.

This was the only spot I saw in an uncleaned barrel.




Plus, I can stop in at PCI after work as it's on my way home.

 

[bgcatty]

French military firearms are absolutely as funky as you can get! Period. My son bought a French MAS 36 and it is just plain weird. That "curled" bolt is plainly "unconventional" to say the least. The cartridge is also funky. As a result I've been forced to cough up the money to get dies to reload for the rifle and, surprisingly once I got the loads dialed in the rifle does not shoot bad at all. Now my son wants a French rifle that shoots the 8mm Lebel. I say: Really???

 

[Leadeye]

Looks good!

 

[Wolfhound]

Ballstater98 - Please do keep me in mind once you start shooting the Berthier. Selling brass could be a good way to offset your ammo cost and it will help me out also.

bgcatty - Agreed that French firearms are oddities. But, if I compare my MAS36 to the M1916 the MAS seems less refined and mass produced. The M1916 seems to have a much higher level of craftsmanship and better finish.

Leadeye - Thank you sir. I am looking forward to shooting it in a week or two.

 

[Ballstater98]

Ballstater98 - Please do keep me in mind once you start shooting the Berthier. Selling brass could be a good way to offset your ammo cost and it will help me out also.

Win, win always works for me! You have first dibs. I currently have 110 rounds (50 1948 black sealed)

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I love me some Berthiers! I think they have some of the nicest aesthetics of any milsurp bolt gun. Nice find Wolfhound!

Here are mine...

1907-15 carbine:


Remington 1907-15 sporter:


And my model 1916:

 

[DoggyDaddy]

I was informed factory 8mm Lebel is "seasonal" which means when it hits sites or shelves you nab it. I think I'm on every 'notify when back in stock' list. I'm not a reloader, so I rely on Precision Cartridge up here to make my ammo.
There are reproduction 3 rounders everywhere. I too wonder why the 5 rounder demand is not being capitalized on.

It definitely seems to be seasonal. I'm on Sportsman's Guide's notify list, as well as SGAmmo's. I try and pick up a couple of boxes (when it's in stock) whenever Sportsman's has their free shipping promotions. I've had great luck with the Prvi Partizan ammo and I also reload. The only thing is, I have a Lee Quick Trim and Lee can't (or won't) make a trim die for it, which makes no sense to me since they make the other dies. You probably already know this, but 8mm Lebel was the first smokeless cartridge.

 

[Wolfhound]

DoggyDaddy - Thank you. Those are some really nice rifles you have. I also noticed there was not a case trim die for the 8mm Lebel. I plan to use a different trim die and just carefully measure as I trim small amounts at a time. Not sure what else to do. Have you ever seen one of the Remington Berthiers? My understanding is that the French ordered some through Remington and then rejected them for some reason. What I read stated they were then sold here in the US as sporting rifles. I have never seen one in person.

Edit: After looking a little closer your sporter rifle is a Remington. My mistake. How does it compare to the French models?

 

[Gary119]

May be a little far for you guys but you might try Traildust in Bloomington. If i remember correctly they had 8mm Lebel on the shelf last time I was in there. Might be worth a call. They usually have odd casings for reloading also.

 

[Wolfhound]

May be a little far for you guys but you might try Traildust in Bloomington. If i remember correctly they had 8mm Lebel on the shelf last time I was in there. Might be worth a call. They usually have odd casings for reloading also.

Gary, Thanks for the heads up. I will try to get down there and check them out.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

DoggyDaddy - Thank you. Those are some really nice rifles you have. I also noticed there was not a case trim die for the 8mm Lebel. I plan to use a different trim die and just carefully measure as I trim small amounts at a time. Not sure what else to do. Have you ever seen one of the Remington Berthiers? My understanding is that the French ordered some through Remington and then rejected them for some reason. What I read stated they were then sold here in the US as sporting rifles. I have never seen one in person.

Edit: After looking a little closer your sporter rifle is a Remington. My mistake. How does it compare to the French models?

The Remington really doesn't look any different than the French made rifles, but it doesn't have the "N" marking on the barrel, meaning it is safe for the hotter Balle N rounds. Now with that being said, the Prvi Partizan ammo works just fine in it, as it's not as hot as the old surplus Balle N.

Edit: More pics of the Remington markings...

 

[halfmileharry]

Froggers. LOL !!!
Ok, they look pretty cool.
Nice find Wolfhound. That's in good shape.
I know'd DD would check it out.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

Froggers. LOL !!!
Ok, they look pretty cool.
Nice find Wolfhound. That's in good shape.
I know'd DD would check it out.

That's Messieurs Froggers to you!

 

[TheBoss930]

Good find!