How do I adjust my scope??

[Dustycoyote]

With the help of many members on this forum, I recently purchased my first two AR-15s. I've mounted Vortex scopes on both of them. 1 rifle has a 2.5 - 10 adjustable scope , the other has a 1 - 4. Both Scopes are mounted on Vortex branded single piece scope mounts. I also purchased a little laser pointer device that you stick in the end of the barrel to help with sighting in the Scopes.

The little laser dot is quite a bit lower than center of the reticle on both scopes. I thought that the laser device might be off so I spun the little laser device in a circle while it was in each barrel and it stayed dead center on its original point. It seems to be very stable and accurate, at least to where it's pointing, whether or not that point isaccurate with the barrel.

I thought that maybe since the guns have a flash suppressor on them it wasn't seating right at the end of the barrel. But the fact that the laser device sits low at the exact same spot against both reticles on both of rifles makes me think that the Scopes are just pointing High.

I've never adjusted a scope before, or even mounted one, so I'm wondering how do I physically adjust the position of the scope before making the fine adjustments using the scope turrets? Is there a way, or do I just need to use the turrets to make the adjustments?

 

[Mgderf]

First, a question.
At what distance were you attempting this sight-in?

The reason I ask s this.
Look at the side of your AR's. Notice how much higher the scope sits compared to the barrel?

Ar's are different than other sporting rifles.
Most sporting rifles have scope mounts that sit fairly close to the bore axis.
With an AR platform, you really need some distance to establish a zeero.

If you were attempting this "sight-in" inside, you likely don't have enough room to do it right.
Try it at somewhere around 25 yards or more if you can.
I'll bet your dot is a LOT closer to the reticle at these distances and should be easy to dial in from the turrets.

 

[bwframe]

Be careful...

 

[churchmouse]

With the help of many members on this forum, I recently purchased my first two AR-15s. I've mounted Vortex scopes on both of them. 1 rifle has a 2.5 - 10 adjustable scope , the other has a 1 - 4. Both Scopes are mounted on Vortex branded single piece scope mounts. I also purchased a little laser pointer device that you stick in the end of the barrel to help with sighting in the Scopes.

The little laser dot is quite a bit lower than center of the reticle on both scopes. I thought that the laser device might be off so I spun the little laser device in a circle while it was in each barrel and it stayed dead center on its original point. It seems to be very stable and accurate, at least to where it's pointing, whether or not that point isaccurate with the barrel.

I thought that maybe since the guns have a flash suppressor on them it wasn't seating right at the end of the barrel. But the fact that the laser device sits low at the exact same spot against both reticles on both of rifles makes me think that the Scopes are just pointing High.

I've never adjusted a scope before, or even mounted one, so I'm wondering how do I physically adjust the position of the scope before making the fine adjustments using the scope turrets? Is there a way, or do I just need to use the turrets to make the adjustments?

I have a $50 bore laser and a daylight laser target set out at 25 yds. I put the cross hairs (vertical) on the dot and the horizontal just above it.
This process has put me on paper at 100yds reliably. Yes, there is some fiddling to do but I am in the rings.

 

[Dustycoyote]

Mgderf, you're 100% correct. I was doing inside the house. I hadn't thought about the height of the scope relative to the barrel... I'll try it outside tonight.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Dustycoyote]

Churchmouse,

Good to know it can get that accurate that easily. I'll try exactly what you said. I assume you are just placing the horizontal crosshairs a very small distance above the laser? (Like maybe the height of the dot?)

Thanks.

 

[churchmouse]

Churchmouse,

Good to know it can get that accurate that easily. I'll try exactly what you said. I assume you are just placing the horizontal crosshairs a very small distance above the laser? (Like maybe the height of the dot?)

Thanks.

Yes. The horizontal touching the top of the dot. Vertical dead on. I have done this many many times when mounting new or switching optics

 

[Dustycoyote]

Thx

 

[tradertator]

Since you are new to mounting a scope, a few pictures of how you've mounted it might be beneficial for us viewers. There are a few simple things you can do, that will make a big difference in the performance of the optic. Is your scope MOA or MIL? And also, what distance do you plan to zero it at?

Somewhere on your scope, it should give you an indication of the "click" values for adjusting it. Most are either 1/4 MOA per turn, or 1/10 milliradian. A good rule of thumb is 1 MOA at 100 yards is close to an inch, and the same for .3 milliradian. Keep in mind that 1) MOA and MILS are ways to measure an angle and 2) have nothing to do with the metric or US standard units of distance measurement. That said, many people like to think in IPHY (inches per hundred yards), and think MOA =US, & MILL's = metric.

If you are looking for additional resources to learn long range, YouTube has some great stuff if you know where to look. Ryan Cleckner does a great job of breaking it down in this short playlist:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLACF2AEF0EC711484
'
And if you want to dig deeper, the Sniper 101 playlist is fantastic:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJUaiRIEduNXoal2_PkBZi0vDCIcEPxUn

 

[Dustycoyote]

tradertator,

thanks for the info.

Here are a couple pics of my rifles. Don't konw if this angle gives enough perspective to make it useful but it's what I've got on my PC right now. If additional pics would be useful, let me know.


Both scopes are milradian. until Mgderf and churchmouse gave me the guidance above, I was attempting to sight in the rifle at about a 10 foot range. Per their guidance I went outside last night and sighted it in at about 45 yards. (the bore-site laser dot was MUCH closer to the reticle center at that distance... ) I used the turrets and with a few clicks was able to get tehe laser dot right below the reticle bulls-eye.

I think I'm in pretty good shape except that I need to use a level to ensure that the scopes are level with the gun. I've just eyeballed it so far.

Also, I'd be really interested in understanding teh best way to set up the scope position for eye relief. Are there any good rules or guidelines for establishing the best eye relief distance?

 

[Mgderf]

tradertator,

thanks for the info.

Here are a couple pics of my rifles. Don't konw if this angle gives enough perspective to make it useful but it's what I've got on my PC right now. If additional pics would be useful, let me know.
View attachment 56880 View attachment 56881

Both scopes are milradian. until Mgderf and churchmouse gave me the guidance above, I was attempting to sight in the rifle at about a 10 foot range. Per their guidance I went outside last night and sighted it in at about 45 yards. (the bore-site laser dot was MUCH closer to the reticle center at that distance... ) I used the turrets and with a few clicks was able to get tehe laser dot right below the reticle bulls-eye.

I think I'm in pretty good shape except that I need to use a level to ensure that the scopes are level with the gun. I've just eyeballed it so far...

 

[Rookie]

tradertator,

thanks for the info.

Here are a couple pics of my rifles. Don't konw if this angle gives enough perspective to make it useful but it's what I've got on my PC right now. If additional pics would be useful, let me know.
View attachment 56880 View attachment 56881

Both scopes are milradian. until Mgderf and churchmouse gave me the guidance above, I was attempting to sight in the rifle at about a 10 foot range. Per their guidance I went outside last night and sighted it in at about 45 yards. (the bore-site laser dot was MUCH closer to the reticle center at that distance... ) I used the turrets and with a few clicks was able to get tehe laser dot right below the reticle bulls-eye.

I think I'm in pretty good shape except that I need to use a level to ensure that the scopes are level with the gun. I've just eyeballed it so far.

Also, I'd be really interested in understanding teh best way to set up the scope position for eye relief. Are there any good rules or guidelines for establishing the best eye relief distance?

Forget the level. Use feeler gauges.

 

[Dustycoyote]

What's a feeler gauge? Sounds like you're saying to use my eyes and fingers...

 

[churchmouse]

Forget the level. Use feeler gauges.

Exactly. Alan showed me that trick and it puts the Horizontal on point with the rifle.

The flat on top of the rail. The flat on the bottom of the optic. Get the optic tight enough there is some resistance to turning it. Fill the gap between the flats with a set of flat steel feeler gauges. Do this until the optic is held in place by the gauges. Tighten it down. Pull out the feelers. If they will not pull out you had the optic to loose in the mounts.

 

[chezuki]

How do I adjust my scope??

Twist the thingys.

 

[DanVoils]

What's a feeler gauge? Sounds like you're saying to use my eyes and fingers...

I'll answer your question.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feeler_gauge

Since it's not copyrighted material I can legally quote it here and not violate the INGO rules and TOS:

A feeler gauge is a tool used to measure gap widths. Feeler gauges are mostly used in engineering to measure the clearance between two parts.[1]

They consist of a number of small lengths of steel of different thicknesses with measurements marked on each piece. They are flexible enough that, even if they are all on the same hinge, several can be stacked together to gauge intermediate values. It is common to have two sets for imperial units (typically measured in thousandths of an inch) and metric (typically measured in hundredths of a millimetre) measurements.

 

[Mgderf]

What's a feeler gauge? ...

Ever seen a spark plug gapping tool?
That's a feeler gauge.

 

[churchmouse]

Ever seen a spark plug gapping tool?
That's a feeler gauge.

Dan Voils has a good description of what we are referring to.

If I knew where "Somewhere" is I would offer up some time to show the OP.

 

[Trigger Time]

After years of using a different method in the military and after I switched to the 50 yard/ 10 yard zero, because it's great for point and shoot.

at 10 yards set up your target with 2 dots spaced exactly 2" apart vertically. Point of aim is the top dot and the the bottom is point of impact. Once you get this set go shoot it at 50 yards to verify and do any final adjustments. The 50 yard zero is great for close up shooting and out to even 400 yards and further with certain hold overs. Plus by only sighting in initially at 10 yards it's easy to see without magnification even and hold steady enough. Because you need to zero your backup sights too not just your scopes. Zero the scopes at 50 yards because you will be able to easily see, and the irons at 10 for the 50 and verify at 50.

Good luck and congrats again on the new rifles

oh and mounting your scope properly is very important but if you feel overwhealmed by it no worries, most shops can do it for you cheaply.
I never blamed people for using that service but some people can't even clean their own guns and pay to have it done seriously. If you do that I will laugh at you

 

[yeti rider]

Exactly. Alan showed me that trick and it puts the Horizontal on point with the rifle.

The flat on top of the rail. The flat on the bottom of the optic. Get the optic tight enough there is some resistance to turning it. Fill the gap between the flats with a set of flat steel feeler gauges. Do this until the optic is held in place by the gauges. Tighten it down. Pull out the feelers. If they will not pull out you had the optic to loose in the mounts.

I'm having a hard time visualizing this method. What flat part on the bottom of the scope are you referring to?