Need help from an AK47 guru

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  • Viper1973

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    Just purchased my first AK and am needing some guidance. My rifle, and RD702 from Rifle Dynamics, is currently being built. While I'm patiently waiting on that to happen I figured it would make sense to go ahead and get some additional mags, ammo, etc. so I could have some fun when it arrives. I didn't realize how dramatically different the AK world is.

    I was able to snag some East German mags online and am waiting for them to arrive but I'm stuck on ammo.

    Both of the ranges I am members of only allow brass cased, copper jacketed ammo (no bi-metal jackets, steel core, magnetic, blah blah blah). After doing some research, I'm having a devil of a time trying to track something down that will 100% work in an AK because virtually everything is steel cased.

    I finally found a few options (slim pickings) and need some feedback on which would be my best choice (ie. accurate, consistant, works well in an AK, etc.):

    1) Fiocchi Shooting Dynamics 7.62x39mm Ammo 124 Grain Full Metal Jacket
    2) Prvi Partizan 7.62x39mm Ammo 123 Grain Full Metal Jacket (PP7.32 version)

    The Fiocchi appears to be a good-to-go, safe option. However, I've read reports that it's severely underpowered and isn't the most accurate. The PPU appears to be extremely accurate but nowhere can I find out if it's a) corrosive or b) is NOT bi-metal or magnetic.

    Anyone have any thoughts or have used these two rounds?
     

    Dentoro

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    What ever is cheapest, unless you want good groups. But I'd think I would be using my $$ to find a range that allows steel case. I've never worked a range and I don't don't know what the reason is, but I do know I'd never join the steel case bias crap. MHO.
     

    Viper1973

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    What ever is cheapest, unless you want good groups. But I'd think I would be using my $$ to find a range that allows steel case. I've never worked a range and I don't don't know what the reason is, but I do know I'd never join the steel case bias crap. MHO.

    In my opinion if you cant shoot something that gives decent groups there's no point shooting it.

    Their reason both of the ranges I have access to ban ammo is the steel or bi-metal projectiles can spark and ignite spent powder on the backstop and start a fire. They told me they used to allow steel case, copper jacket bullets until some asshat brought in some that passed the magnet test but were bi-metal and started a fire. Since then it's copper and brass only.

    I fully understand their concerns and want to play by the rules... I'm just having a hard time finding something to play by the rules with.
     

    kscessnadriver

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    Not sure I'd have went AK without being able to shoot steel case. That's one of the great things about the AK, it was designed for cheap steel case ammo. For what you're likely to pay for x39 brass, you can find 308 and similar stuff for similar money.

    Either way, I'm sure it will run fine in a quality rifle like RD makes. Honestly for mags, spend the money and pick up some Russian "bakelite" mags, they're really some of the highest quality mags you can get.
     

    Viper1973

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    Not sure I'd have went AK without being able to shoot steel case. That's one of the great things about the AK, it was designed for cheap steel case ammo. For what you're likely to pay for x39 brass, you can find 308 and similar stuff for similar money.

    Shot AR's for years and have several .308 guns. Went with the AK mainly because it's such a historical firearm used all over the world and I've never owned or even shot one. Going into it I didn't really expect ammo of all things to be an issue.
     

    Thor

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    Found this info on the Prvi: 7.62x39 FMJ 123gr. Made in Serbia this lead core ammunition is new production. It is brass cased boxer primed non corrosive and reloadable.

    I've shot a lot of PPU ammo, should be good to go.
     

    Viper1973

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    Found this info on the Prvi: 7.62x39 FMJ 123gr. Made in Serbia this lead core ammunition is new production. It is brass cased boxer primed non corrosive and reloadable.

    I've shot a lot of PPU ammo, should be good to go.

    Thank you... Does the brass work and feel reliably in an AK? Like I said, this is my first time dealing with one of these beasts so any input is most appreciated.
     

    Thor

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    I have not found anything that doesn't work and feed reliably in my AK...:D. That being said I have never had an issue with Prvi ammo in any weapon I have. It is better quality than the Wolf/etc. I shoot their Garand brand in my Garand and 7.62NATO in my PTR91 among others.

    Have fun with the new toy! :ar15:
     

    Viper1973

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    I have not found anything that doesn't work and feed reliably in my AK...:D. That being said I have never had an issue with Prvi ammo in any weapon I have. It is better quality than the Wolf/etc. I shoot their Garand brand in my Garand and 7.62NATO in my PTR91 among others.

    Have fun with the new toy! :ar15:

    Awesome! I've got ton of waiting to do before I get it... They told me it'll be about 3-4 months given their current workload. That's why I figured mags and ammo would be a good place to start.

    Is there anything else I should probably get beforehand? I know a buddy of mine (rather he was joking or not I don't know) suggested a stuck case extractor.
     

    Dentoro

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    In my opinion if you cant shoot something that gives decent groups there's no point shooting it.

    Their reason both of the ranges I have access to ban ammo is the steel or bi-metal projectiles can spark and ignite spent powder on the backstop and start a fire. They told me they used to allow steel case, copper jacket bullets until some asshat brought in some that passed the magnet test but were bi-metal and started a fire. Since then it's copper and brass only.

    I fully understand their concerns and want to play by the rules... I'm just having a hard time finding something to play by the rules with.
    1. An Ak is not a sniper gun. 8" plate at 150-200 yards is pretty decent.
    2. I've never had that much powder not go off and collect behind me. Sounds like some house keeping is in order.
    3. Brass AK ammo ain't cheap, you might squeeze some accuracy out but for the price, naw. Never shot a single brass round yet.
    4. For what you pay for brass AK you could probably get .308 or match .556 and be much more satisfied with your groups. I get 1-1-1/2" groups from Wolf at approx 90 yards from a Barska red dot on my AK. I'd bet that is pretty average for accuracy.
     

    Viper1973

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    1. An Ak is not a sniper gun. 8" plate at 150-200 yards is pretty decent.
    2. I've never had that much powder not go off and collect behind me. Sounds like some house keeping is in order.
    3. Brass AK ammo ain't cheap, you might squeeze some accuracy out but for the price, naw. Never shot a single brass round yet.
    4. For what you pay for brass AK you could probably get .308 or match .556 and be much more satisfied with your groups. I get 1-1-1/2" groups from Wolf at approx 90 yards from a Barska red dot on my AK. I'd bet that is pretty average for accuracy.

    I realize that an AK is not going to be as precise as other guns. From the story I was told is that it was actually the backstop that got ignited. I have guns already in .308 and 5.56. Only reason I even considered an AK was just because it's an iconic gun, they look freakin' awesome, and I've never gotten to shoot one before and figured one would be worth adding to my collection.
     

    Floivanus

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    I realize that an AK is not going to be as precise as other guns. From the story I was told is that it was actually the backstop that got ignited. I have guns already in .308 and 5.56. Only reason I even considered an AK was just because it's an iconic gun, they look freakin' awesome, and I've never gotten to shoot one before and figured one would be worth adding to my collection.
    Should’ve had someone build you a Galil or an AK74 with a 5.56 barrel and find mags to work with it IF brass case ammo is needed.

    there’s sources for brass cased 7.62x39 but you’re looking a .70 - $1 per round, and that 70 cents is buying in bulk. I’ve shot thousands of rounds of tula and wolf without a hiccup, shot 20 rounds of Winchester brass cased 7.62 and had a squib load, so stay away from that one IMHO
     

    Viper1973

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    Should’ve had someone build you a Galil or an AK74 with a 5.56 barrel and find mags to work with it IF brass case ammo is needed.

    there’s sources for brass cased 7.62x39 but you’re looking a .70 - $1 per round, and that 70 cents is buying in bulk. I’ve shot thousands of rounds of tula and wolf without a hiccup, shot 20 rounds of Winchester brass cased 7.62 and had a squib load, so stay away from that one IMHO

    Totally understand the costs i've gotten myself into.... I guess going into this not really knowing a whole lot about AKs I figured that just like every other caliber there was tons of steel and brass ammo and it'd be no big deal.

    I have a 5.56 Tavor that I absolutely love. The AK was mainly to get into another platform entirely and just because they look freakin' cool. Poor excuse, but 100% true.
     

    Thor

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    It looks like the rifle he's ordered is pretty top notch. https://www.rifledynamics.com/rifles-1

    The Galil is a great option but I don't know if it would be an improvement...besides he wants an AK and there's nothing wrong with that.

    The inaccuracy claims for the AK are overblown (and a myth). Even a cheap Yugo will give up 3MOA which is definite minute of bad guy at 300 yds. The bullets obviously not going to give you much beyond that but it was never designed to.
     

    snapping turtle

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    Rifle dynamics are sure proud of their AK’s. Glad I was talked into one long ago before Chinese AK’s were popular. Until soldier of fortune mag article praised them nobody wanted to buy them.

    My old pre import ban poly tech shoots golden tiger ammo about the best accuracy wise. I prefer to shoot outside and cheaply.
    Ak’s get a bad rap for accuracy mine does real well open sighted. I have taken it deer hunting a couple of times now because I can. I am a still hunter for the most part so I normally see the deer pretty close and need to shoot pretty quickly. The AK comes to the shoulder well and carries well enough. The ammo I got for hunting shot well but the golden tiger shot better. The hunting rounds were JSP bullets.

    get some golden tiger. If you see a couple of 5 or 10 round mags pick up a couple. I use a 10 rounder for deer hunting and can shoot the AK off a bench with the fives real well. I did show up to deer camp with my 75 round drum first season Friday night that rifles were legal on private land. The looks were priceless. The ten rounder went into the field.

    I don’t think I have ever recovered brass/steel from my AK.

    So :
    golden tiger ammo (not at your range)
    75 round drum mag (every AK needs one)
    5 round mag (bench testing rifle)
    10 round mag (deer hunting private land)

    long ago ago there was surplus in brass cases. Long ago and far away.
     

    243rem700

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    I have used the PPU ammo at a range with similar rules. I only put a couple of mags through my AK due to the price of the ammo, but I didn't have any malfunctions. I couldn't tell any difference between the PPU and steel case except for the cost.
     

    SnoopLoggyDog

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    Only other possible issue with using brass cased ammo in a AK style rifle, is soft primers. Steel case ammo intentionally has very hard primers that resist the impact of the floating firing pin, as the bolt is slamming a round into the chamber. With soft primers, an AK can experience a slam-fire as a round is being chambered. The Prvi Partizan has hard primers to prevent slam-fires. American ammo like Winchester White Box sometimes has soft primers. I would stay away from that.

    It would also be a good idea to pick up some steel case ammo for your rifle. The price on steel case is cheap enough, to lay in a good supply. It will come in handy, if you take a rifle class or shoot at another range.

    My SAR-1 is one of my favorite rifles. Basic AK platform with lots of spare mags, sling and cleaning kit. Only mods are an aperture rear sight and AK-74 style muzzle brake.
     
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