Garand accuracy/rebarrel question

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  • Cameramonkey

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    My new M1 shoots pretty well. I havent had a chance to get it checked out on paper, but at 150yds its questionable. (could be me, but Im putting feelers out until I have time to get to proteq one afternoon and check it on paper... Ive only rung Don's steel with it)

    The hang tag says the muzzle/throat erosion are 3/2+ respectively.

    The wife has almost given me the green light to have it refinished and maybe re-barreled if necessary but I wanted to get INGO's opinion. It was one of those "If you get x, then I get my Garand refinished/rebarrelled" "Hmmmmmm. I'll think about it."

    So what says INGO? would a new Criterion barrel make an appreciable difference in accuracy under 200yds vs the factory barrel? Or is the erosion insignificant enough that I shouldnt worry?

    Also, anyone use Shuff's Parkerizing up in MI before? He offers refinishing, new barrels with install, etc.

    Anyone have somebody that services Garands in Central IN that can parkerize and/or rebarrel? (I already asked AllenM and he doesnt want to experiment) I prefer someone with experience vs being a general gunsmith that assumes its just another rifle.
     

    Dead Duck

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    But you're married. How many necklaces is this going to cost you?


    A Garand is defiantly on my list, just after paint and roof the house. :(
     

    bwframe

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    What's wrong with cats?

    Nicole-Scherzinger-CelebMarriages_com.jpg


    rhino likes cats a lot. Look at all the cool stuff he has. :):
     
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    halfmileharry

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    Standard questions... How many different types of ammo have you tried? Does it have a favorite?
    How familiar are you with the rifle?
    How many rounds have you put through it?
    Is the barrel very clean? Bore cleaner, ammonia based lead/copper cleaners?
    Before I'd be changing out barrels I'd make damned sure you've got a worn out barrel. Lots of factors can affect your accuracy.
     

    Cameramonkey

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    Standard questions... How many different types of ammo have you tried? Does it have a favorite?
    How familiar are you with the rifle?
    How many rounds have you put through it?
    Is the barrel very clean? Bore cleaner, ammonia based lead/copper cleaners?
    Before I'd be changing out barrels I'd make damned sure you've got a worn out barrel. Lots of factors can affect your accuracy.

    1 Only one type so far. S&B M2 150gr (new mfr) (looking around I dont see many other options without breaking the bank)
    2 Only a handful; enough to know I'm not ringing steel as consistently as other guns at that distance. (none precision)
    3 need to clean it well, including a chore boy scrub.

    Im just exploring my options. After showing off the gun to a friend and mentioning to him in front of her that I wanted to have it refinished and possibly a new barrel if it needs one, we were driving home.

    "I want another cat"
    "you can have another cat if I get to refinish and rebarrel my Garand."
    "How much?"
    "$350-400?"
    "hmmmm... Maybe." (if it was no, she would say no outright... and then demand the cat anyway LOL)
     
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    DoggyDaddy

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    1 Only one type so far. S&B M2 150gr (new mfr) (looking around I dont see many other options without breaking the bank)
    2 Only a handful; enough to know I'm not ringing steel as consistently as other guns at that distance. (none precision)
    3 need to clean it well, including a chore boy scrub.

    Im just exploring my options. After showing off the gun to a friend and mentioning to him in front of her that I wanted to have it refinished and possibly a new barrel if it needs one, we were driving home.

    "I want another cat"
    "you can have another cat if I get to refinish and rebarrel my Garand."
    "How much?"
    "$350-400?"
    "hmmmm... Maybe." (if it was no, she would say no outright... and then demand the cat anyway LOL)
    Have you looked into the Greek surplus ammo that CMP sells? It's good ammo - non-corrosive, boxer primed, reloadable, and fairly reasonable. I haven't looked in awhile, but they had a couple of options - 200 rounds loose in a 30 cal. can, and sealed spam cans (192 rounds IIRC) with the ammo loaded into en bloc clips. The spam cans were a little more, but you do get the clips, so there's that. Prvi Partizan also makes a 150 grain round, optimized for M1's that is pretty reasonable. https://www.sgammo.com/product/30-0...-grain-fmj-ammo-optimized-m1-garand-rifle-pp3
     

    Hkindiana

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    If the hang tag lists the CORRECT chamber and muzzle erosions, then a rebarrel would be a waste of money AND hurt the rifles authenticity (unless you are planning on 1000+ yard shots).
     

    Cameramonkey

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    If the hang tag lists the CORRECT chamber and muzzle erosions, then a rebarrel would be a waste of money AND hurt the rifles authenticity (unless you are planning on 1000+ yard shots).


    Its info like this that Im looking for. Wasnt sure if that erosion would have that much impact at 150 yds or not.

    Not looking for super authenticity since its a "pieces and parts" CMP rebuild. If it were a matching rifle I wouldnt even consider it.

    But I did have a nice conversation this AM with Robert from www.ammogarand.com . He runs a cool parts operation and is very responsive with lots of Garand stuff. I just ordered a new (repro) rear sight knob assembly, and he is where I got my clips from. Mine is so worn I can see there are lines and numbers, but cant read the numbers, except with a flashlight and magnifying glass. No, it wont be authentic, but I'll keep the authentic one in case I ever want to put it back together again.
     

    ol' poke

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    "its a "pieces and parts" CMP rebuild. If it were a matching rifle I wouldnt even consider it.

    You may not want to give CMP all of the credit here. LOTS (most?) of their rifles received their differing parts in the field or during an arsenal rebuild. I would second or third trying the Greek Pyrkal ammo from the CMP and see how that shoots before considering any re-barrel. But most of my guns still shoot better than me, but I'm catching up!

    Best of luck with your Garand. They are one awesome firearm!
     

    jinks

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    I have re-barreled a few Garands and it is not too difficult most of the time. I was not able to to remove a barrel from a Winchester because it was just too tight. I have the tools to change barrels but with CMP's parts pricing and labor charges I do not think it is worth the effort to do the barrel replacement and ream the chamber or find the correct bolt for head-spacing. The basic installation is $75 plus $190 (30-06) to $200 (308) for the Criterion barrel.

    Many things on the M1 other than the barrel can affect the size of the grouping. I have a few Garands and all of them are able to hold a 5" group at 100 yards from a bench. My best M1 is a Danish return with an as new VAR barrel, in a tight commercial stock, with a Bushnell Elite 3200 2x6 pistol scope on an Amega mount. It is able to hold groups under 2" at 100 yards from the bench. I also have a Garand with a Fulton Armory .308 barrel that is almost as good with iron sights as the Danish VAR rifle. I would shoot a few hundred rounds before considering re-barreling if your rifle is shooting 5" or less at 100 yards.

    Services for the M1 Garand - Civilian Marksmanship ProgramCivilian Marksmanship Program

    Custom Gunsmithing - Civilian Marksmanship ProgramCivilian Marksmanship Program

     
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    sloughfoot

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    Jerry Johnson turned one of my CMP Garands from. 4 MOA rifle to a 2MOA rifle by relieving the stock in various places. Jerry is a highly experienced M1 guy. He is in the gunsmith list.

    Also make sure your stacking swivel is staked. Also that your front sight is tight on the barrel. A rubber band connecting the rear sight to the elevation knob is an old trick to eleminate play. Also shimming the receiver lugs might be needed. I use toothpicks.

    Don't think about a new barrel until you have done the above mods and tested with match ammo. A box or two is enough. Then you can shoot military ball ammo to your heart's content knowing that the flyers are ammo related. Or you.
     
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    TheJoker

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    Have you looked into the Greek surplus ammo that CMP sells? It's good ammo - non-corrosive, boxer primed, reloadable, and fairly reasonable. I haven't looked in awhile, but they had a couple of options - 200 rounds loose in a 30 cal. can, and sealed spam cans (192 rounds IIRC) with the ammo loaded into en bloc clips. The spam cans were a little more, but you do get the clips, so there's that. Prvi Partizan also makes a 150 grain round, optimized for M1's that is pretty reasonable. https://www.sgammo.com/product/30-0...-grain-fmj-ammo-optimized-m1-garand-rifle-pp3

    The CMP's supply of HXP ran out around the first of the year. :(
     

    OutdoorDad

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    Iirc 5 is considered “shot out” on throat and 3 on muzzle. So if memory serves, you should be within specs for another 1000+ rounds or so?

    I’d be unlikely to do that in one sitting.

    So you have a little time to explore other accuracy improvements. Or just enjoy it for what it is.

    I suspect a savage or TC bolt action will outshoot it all day long. And if you’d like to make that trade, I’ll go buy whichever one you’d like. :):

    Or, just enjoy the heck out of what it is, what it did, and those who carried it.

    I plan on fondling my 1903’s later this evening. And Garand is still on my wish list.
     

    DoggyDaddy

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    The CMP's supply of HXP ran out around the first of the year. :(

    Well crap. For good, or just temporarily? :( I'm pretty stocked up fortunately. I think I have 3 of the 30 cal cans plus a couple of the spam cans. Also bought a case (don't remember the quantity) from Cheaper than Dirt (I know, I know - but it really was cheap :):) packed in the clips.
     

    Hop

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    Mine doesn't like the Greek HXP but at the INGO open house @ Don's it shot PPU 150 grain very well imo. Well enough to hit four little ~2" tannerite bottles @ 50 yards in standing position. 3 of those took just 3 shots.
     
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