Man with chainsaw threatening people

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    will argue for sammiches.
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    Jul 29, 2008
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    Crawfordsville
    Does he have a bowling ball and an egg nearby?

    [video=youtube;S-YFxgcFRvU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-YFxgcFRvU[/video]
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    Deadly weapon? Check.
    Threatening someone? Check.

    The remaining part of the equation is distance. Is he close enough to you or someone else to present to REASONABLY present an imminent threat? Distance, barriers (5' away with nothing in between you =/= 5' away but on the other side of a bullet proof window and counter), and time will be the deciding factors. You can also use anything you know as part of your decision making. If he's walking toward a crowd and you've got a brick wall as a background now, but if he keeps moving your backstop is a window with people behind it, that can be part of your decision making toward "reasonable".
     

    Joniki

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    Nov 5, 2013
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    5'??? Screw that. 22 feet and coming towards me is a bang, bang, bang, bang....

    Deadly weapon? Check.
    Threatening someone? Check.

    The remaining part of the equation is distance. Is he close enough to you or someone else to present to REASONABLY present an imminent threat? Distance, barriers (5' away with nothing in between you =/= 5' away but on the other side of a bullet proof window and counter), and time will be the deciding factors. You can also use anything you know as part of your decision making. If he's walking toward a crowd and you've got a brick wall as a background now, but if he keeps moving your backstop is a window with people behind it, that can be part of your decision making toward "reasonable".
     

    BehindBlueI's

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    5'??? Screw that. 22 feet and coming towards me is a bang, bang, bang, bang....

    There is no set distance. I said 5' because that's about what separates the customer from the clerk in the bullet proof booth gas stations. It comes down to "reasonable" and that is based on many factors. It might be reasonable at 40 feet, it might be unreasonable at 5 feet. It depends.

    There is no 21' rule. This is a misunderstanding of the Tueller drill, which is a drill and not a rule of law. It is not based on any study of human physiology or the like, it was simply a drill with an arbitrary time limit set up to make a point, not based on how fast a human can react or how fast a human can move. Look up the originator's own statements of how it's been misapplied if you're curious.
     

    jbombelli

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    May 17, 2008
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    Brownsburg, IN
    Was he looking for deadites?

    ash-vs-evil-dead-header-735x525_zpswkrwignd.jpg
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Mar 9, 2008
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    Lafayette, Indiana
    Same rules as anyone else: would the reasonable person be in fear of imminent harm of serious bodily injury or death?

    That's the legal test. The reality test is don't take it out of the holster unless you have no other option.

    Don't step in other people's dog poop. Call the boys dripping in qualified immunity. Lawyers cost money.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Lafayette, Indiana
    There is no 21' rule. This is a misunderstanding of the Tueller drill, which is a drill and not a rule of law. It is not based on any study of human physiology or the like, it was simply a drill with an arbitrary time limit set up to make a point, not based on how fast a human can react or how fast a human can move. Look up the originator's own statements of how it's been misapplied if you're curious.

    Much wisdom here.

    Dennis Tueller was the FTU at Salt Lake City. After a series of incidents involving SLCPD, Tueller came up with a drill to enlighten his officers on how drawing to a threat in motion was less than optimal and thus using cover and partners should have higher interest for the cops on the street.

    It is not a "law", "rule", "statute" or anything the judge will be familiar with until you spend bolshoi denek on the expert witness. Oh, and if you that it means you are in front of a jury or getting ready to be in front of the jury.

    The best outcome: the sword of no sword.

    "The best indicia of trianing is never having to use it." Clinton A. Smith.
     

    oldpink

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    Apr 7, 2009
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    Farmland
    449651070l7mm9li.gif


    FWIW, about five years ago, I was went into a gas station and came out, there was a group of about a half dozen redneck n'er do-wells standing around outside.
    I walked right past them going in and coming out without saying anything or even glancing at them, but when I was almost to my truck, one of them fired up a chainsaw and revved it once, getting the rest of the hicks to laugh loudly.
    I called the main office of the gas station and told them about the hoods, and they took immediate action.
     

    Kirk Freeman

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    Mar 9, 2008
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    Lafayette, Indiana
    Could a defense attorney bring a chainsaw to the court room and start it to help the jury contextualize "reasonable"? :laugh:

    I saw a defense attorney bring in a bag full of booze once, to demonstrate to the jury how much the "eye witness" had to drink.

    Never a chainsaw. Have seen prosecutors bring in highly immaterial and irrelevant things such as guns, knives, bricks, chunks of concrete, baseball bats, that they call "evidence". Pfffft.
     
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