The Original "Downrange Photographer" Speaks

[esrice]

Seen below is Jay Gibson, a long-time Tactical Response instructor and "downrange photographer" that stirred up quite the controversy a few years ago for this pic/video:

You can read more about the original controversy on ENDO: Tactical Response Training ? Try Not To Shoot The Photographer

And of course we've talked about such practices here on INGO:

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...discussion/69421-down-range-photographer.html
https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/tactics-training/305260-more-down-range-photographer.html


[video=youtube;4Fd2iumdKgY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Fd2iumdKgY[/video]

It's interesting to get an opinion from the guy himself.


And now you know . . . . the rest of the story.

 

[warriorbob]

hey if you have the balls to do it and accept the risk... I might do this if I was working with SEALS or Delta operators but that's about it lol.

 

[bingley]

Come on, Bob, I clean miss the target only once in a while. Be my downrange photographer, Bob!

 

[printcraft]

Well Jay, this jackass mr. nobody says that what you are doing is inherently unsafe and stupid.
You have every right to do it. I sincerely hope you don't screw it up just once.

 

[Jackson]

This topic is kinda used up, isn't it? The people who don't like Tactical Response, Yeager, and/or down-range photography still dont like it. The people who think it has value and/or train with TR aren't going to respond because they will be drowned out by the voices of the former group. The rest of us just don't care all that much.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Yaknow, if it was the only possible way to get footage like that, I *might* say, well, the risk is ok. And yep, it's the decision of the students and the photographer to determine if the risk is acceptable to them. It's also our right to think it's a really stupid thing to do and say so publicly since the whole thing has been brought to the public eye by the people hoping to capitalize on the practice.

I maintain it's pretty stupid and I'd not care to train with people who promote being stupid when there is no real benefit and there are alternatives to accomplish the same goal, as is my right. They also have the right to dismiss my opinion, which I am quite sure they do.

 

[printcraft]

 

[Birds Away]

Yaknow, if it was the only possible way to get footage like that, I *might* say, well, the risk is ok. And yep, it's the decision of the students and the photographer to determine if the risk is acceptable to them. It's also our right to think it's a really stupid thing to do and say so publicly since the whole thing has been brought to the public eye by the people hoping to capitalize on the practice.

I maintain it's pretty stupid and I'd not care to train with people who promote being stupid when there is no real benefit and there are alternatives to accomplish the same goal, as is my right. They also have the right to dismiss my opinion, which I am quite sure they do.

Well said. +1.

 

[cedartop]

I am probably in that group. Not sure about the rest of your comment though. We must see different forums. I have always felt like this was Get off the X, Indiana Chapter.

 

[Jackson]

I am probably in that group. Not sure about the rest of your comment though. We must see different forums. I have always felt like this was Get off the X, Indiana Chapter.

Mayne we need a poll. I think INGO is 3:2 against Yeager/Tactical Response. We just have a few prominent posters putting up all of James Yeager's material. I could be wrong.

 

[HICKMAN]

I found value in the Fighting Pistol course at Tactical Response. I also found value in Combat Focus shooting, ACT's Low Light Class, Fortress Defense Force on Force class and various other classes with Coach, ObiJon and Rhino.

I look forward to Close Range Gunfighting in the future and Guy Relford's Comprehensive Indiana Gun Law class that I've had to reschedule 3 times. Down the road I also hope to attend a class with Dave Spaulding, Sheriff Ken Campbell and others as I move down the road of learning.

I understand Jay does what he does, not for the shot, but for the student. I also know he doesn't do that in front of just anyone. It didn't bother me and neither did the moving shooting line or some of the other things they do.

I've said the same all along, if it's not for you... train elsewhere. I'm hoping to train with all kinds of folks so I can learn more... only wished I would have started sooner.

 

[rhino]

Yeah, I wish I hadn't wasted the 4+ minutes listening to that. I do find amusing the assertion that those who are critical of this individual's actions "don't train anywhere" and that they really just don't know what they're talking about. Heh. That's good!


​rhino out!

 

[HICKMAN]

Rhino, I am pretty sure we both know the crowd he's talking about. Something about CHEETOS comes to mind.

 

[lovemachine]

That video was pointless.

 

[cedartop]

That video was pointless.

Thanks, that further reduces any temptation to watch it.

 

[lovemachine]

Thanks, that further reduces any temptation to watch it.

Oh come on. You know you want to watch it...

 

[HoughMade]

Lord knows there is no way to have downrange video or pics without a person down there.

 

[OneBadV8]

Lord knows there is no way to have downrange video or pics without a person down there.

I really don't think it's about the picture.

 

[HoughMade]

I really don't think it's about the picture.

So is the point that sometimes good training means being less than absolutely safe? I would agree with that, but we have to assess whether the risk has any return of value. In my opinion, with so many other options, downrange photography...with a person down there, does not. Certain other training, I would assess on a case by case basis. I readily acknowledge that some training that is very practical may not allow a muzzle to always be pointed downrange and may include "sweeping" others (well, what some would consider a "sweep"). That is real world. Setting up next to the target? No thanks.

 

[lovemachine]

They say it's training you to be prepared for when you have to fire your gun in a more public area.

I'm sure that's part of the reason.

The other reason, I believe, is to create a controversy. To get people talking. More controversy = more business.

James Yeager has said himself that he has created more business because of his videos.