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Thread: Run or Cower?

  1. #11
    I agree with those above in avoidance of the scenario, but sometimes, life gives little choice. Others, you do CBA and choose to fly.

    It depends. Am I alone, or do I have one or more members of my family with me?
    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin Franklin
    Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tench Coxe
    Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.
    Quote Originally Posted by William Blakstone
    It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.

  2. #12
    Keeper of the Hammer
    MontereyC6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhino View Post
    So, if some day we're both trying to cower behind the same piece of furniture, I predict that we'll "realize" that we didn't put ourselves in that situation after all and then commence to producing cover via a bunch of bullets moving rapidly in the direction of bad people?
    You know it! Like you, I rarely put myself in a situation I can't have a firearm on me. What I don't see though, is either of us providing cover fire for the other to advance on the BG!
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  3. #13
    Grandmaster Cameramonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Concord View Post
    I agree with those above in avoidance of the scenario, but sometimes, life gives little choice. Others, you do CBA and choose to fly.

    It depends. Am I alone, or do I have one or more members of my family with me?
    Alone. Post updated for ease of discussion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk Freeman View Post
    A confused cop is an arresty cop.
    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierdoc View Post
    also, where do we sign up to touch Frank's equipment?

  4. #14
    Grandmaster Cameramonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MontereyC6 View Post
    You know it! Like you, I rarely put myself in a situation I can't have a firearm on me. What I don't see though, is either of us providing cover fire for the other to advance on the BG!
    Different thread. Go make that one yourself. Shoo! LOL
    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk Freeman View Post
    A confused cop is an arresty cop.
    Quote Originally Posted by hoosierdoc View Post
    also, where do we sign up to touch Frank's equipment?

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Cameramonkey View Post
    Alone. Post updated for ease of discussion.
    Based on the leaked video, the first word that came to mind was "linebacker" (for those behind)... that guy was totally focused on what was in front of him... looked like a good opportunity for a strip-sack for an aware person behind him. However, my first commitment is do what is necessary to protect my family, which includes surviving to continue to provide for them, since they don't need direct protection from this immediate threat.

    So, realistically, probably run like hell... Second choice is to dive for cover. Whatever seems like it will give the best opportunity of survival at the time. Hard to say without being in the moment...

    Let those who volunteer and get paid to deal with such situations (they are there to protect me, since the governments for whom they work decided I should be defenseless, right?) take care of the bad guy.

    Along those lines, here's a perspective most likely haven't seen expressed very widely, if at all: https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog...goes-business/
    Last edited by Lex Concord; 01-09-2017 at 21:44.
    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin Franklin
    Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tench Coxe
    Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American ... the unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.
    Quote Originally Posted by William Blakstone
    It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.

  6. #16
    A moving target is hard to hit. A few year back when my school district was beginning the use of the ALICE training we did a few exercises with airsoft guns. Multiple people who were full time LEO in the county failed to hit me as I fled the scene. We started at slightly farther than bad breath distance. But the two or three of them failed to hit me one single time.

    There are are couple of factors to consider. 1). I move well for a big man. 2). I don't think anyone shooting at me would be a solid C class shooter in USPSA. 3). I am a generous target.

    All that said I am running if I am alone. Hoping like hell the truck is nearby because I have never been a marathon runner and I have not been in shape since 1992.
    No one is stronger or more dangerous than the man who can harness his emotions.

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  7. #17
    Depends.

    Things to ponder:

    1) How close am I to the bad guy?
    2) Where is the bad guy's attention?
    3) Do I have available cover and/or concealment?
    4) Would I be running diagonally or directly away from the bad guy?
    5) How many other people are there?
    6) Is he approaching me, moving parallel, or moving away from me?
    7) Am I reasonably sure he's alone?

    The answers dictate the response. If he's moving away from me, is focused on someone else, and no one else is running, and the distance is too great to Terry Tate him, then staying put may be the best answer so my movement doesn't draw his eye. If he's approaching me, a bunch of people closer to him are running, and I've got a diagonal way to escape, then running it is.

    Things to remember:
    1) movement draws attention
    2) It's easier, mentally, to shoot someone in the back than the face
    3) Moving laterally is harder to hit than moving forward or back, in respect to the shooter's sight picture.
    My nuts are the great uniter.

  8. #18
    I would hide until Cameramonkey took off drawing his attention from me then I would run the opposite direction.
    Orthodox Christian | NRA | GOA | MGNOC | ARRL Member | Purdue Alumnus

  9. #19
    But seriously.....

    I equate an active shooter to a crocodile attack and I have for a long time.

    They say a gator will outrun you in a straight line BUT if you zigzag they can't turn very well.

    I will run a zig zag pattern away from the shooter. That has been in my mental preps forever. Long enough that I consider it the scenario I will follow whether its right or not.
    Orthodox Christian | NRA | GOA | MGNOC | ARRL Member | Purdue Alumnus

  10. #20
    It's a good question. I agree, distance is your friend. I run almost a thousand miles a year, and am not wasting all that effort and getting shot if I can avoid it. I'm guilty of drifting the topic a bit here, but I'm really surprised how little the advantage of distance is understood, by people who haven't tried to hit moving targets with a gun. You can find many martial arts videos where the instructor will advise to engage hand-to-hand with a gunman, even in situations where no other "friendlies" are assumed to be present to possibly help out. While they all fear knives tremendously, and want no part of being near them, it's like a total reversal when a gun is involved. It is posited that the person has little training or understanding of weapon retention, you will gain physical superiority over the person's gun hand, and anyway, running from a gunman is useless because he can just shoot you from a distance. I once had a wing-chun guy demonstrate some anti-weapon stuff to me, but started off positing the "one arm sticking out with the gun" pose that is usually assumed in these scenarios. When I wanted to modify the engagement positions to have two hands on the gun and keeping it close to the body, he acted like I was cheating or something! ("that's not how we're taught").

    (Ok, OP, I opened the doggie-door and let the rollers in...)


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