Las Vegas Officer bodycam

The #1 community for Gun Owners in Indiana

Member Benefits:

  • Fewer Ads!
  • Discuss all aspects of firearm ownership
  • Discuss anti-gun legislation
  • Buy, sell, and trade in the classified section
  • Chat with Local gun shops, ranges, trainers & other businesses
  • Discover free outdoor shooting areas
  • View up to date on firearm-related events
  • Share photos & video with other members
  • ...and so much more!
  • turnandshoot4

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Jan 29, 2008
    8,625
    48
    Kouts
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9699n4Hd2g&feature=youtu.be

    A couple of notes about this.
    1. Bad tactics, skills, and decisions can still win the day.
    2. If you haven't mastered the grip in pistol 1 you don't need to be in vehicle class.
    3. The first time you shoot though a windsheild shouldn't be while you are speeding through the streets.
    4. Accuracy by volume is a real thing.
    5. The car is a weapon, use it.
    6. If you haven't mastered mag changes you don't need to be in a vehicle class.
    7. Head up during mag changes works because you need to breathe, see what's going on, and the bad guy is probably moving.
    8. This guy now has "real world experience" in an armed vehicle encounter.
    9. I'm glad he is ok and the bad guys got shot.
     

    cedartop

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Apr 25, 2010
    6,687
    113
    North of Notre Dame.
    Watching that video you would think he had never been through handgun training before. That grip was all kinds of messed up. Not sure what was going on with that reload.

    Glad things still turned out in his favor.
     

    Frank_N_Stein

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    79   0   0
    Nov 24, 2008
    10,206
    77
    Beech Grove, IN
    Watching that video you would think he had never been through handgun training before. That grip was all kinds of messed up. Not sure what was going on with that reload.

    Glad things still turned out in his favor.

    How much training do you do where bullets are coming back at you? Do you perform everything 100% when under stress?
     

    T.Lex

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    15   0   0
    Mar 30, 2011
    25,859
    113
    Yeah, I'm a non-professional, but the technical stuff he did seems like "doing the best he can under the circumstances." A little improvisation goes a long way.

    The mag change thing, he was transitioning from moving to stopped, not sure what the other vehicle/occupants were going to do, and trying to reload. He was also probably thinking in terms of communicating - which I think the did an effective job of doing the whole time.

    Not really sure what street-level lessons are to be learned from that episode, especially in terms of standardized training. Should all patrol officer get trained up (and the re-qualify?) on shooting a moving vehicle from a moving vehicle? That'd be expensive for a... 1% (at most?) incident?

    Sure, it is something they should all be mentally prepared for, but it seems like that kind of battlefield expediency thought process would be more applicable than standardized training.

    Of course, that's my non-professional, humble opinion.
     

    cedartop

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    1   0   0
    Apr 25, 2010
    6,687
    113
    North of Notre Dame.
    How much training do you do where bullets are coming back at you? Do you perform everything 100% when under stress?

    Frank, I get that I am not ripping on the guy, just making observations. We are always told that only those things that are over learned will be done properly under stress, that would appear to be the case here
     

    NIFT

    Master
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 3, 2009
    1,616
    38
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9699n4Hd2g&feature=youtu.be

    A couple of notes about this.
    1. Bad tactics, skills, and decisions can still win the day.
    2. If you haven't mastered the grip in pistol 1 you don't need to be in vehicle class.
    3. The first time you shoot though a windsheild shouldn't be while you are speeding through the streets.
    4. Accuracy by volume is a real thing.
    5. The car is a weapon, use it.
    6. If you haven't mastered mag changes you don't need to be in a vehicle class.
    7. Head up during mag changes works because you need to breathe, see what's going on, and the bad guy is probably moving.
    8. This guy now has "real world experience" in an armed vehicle encounter.
    9. I'm glad he is ok and the bad guys got shot.

    He took care of business in spite of himself. Kudos for staying in the fight and finishing it. He will be good to address mindset in a fight but not how to use a handgun.

    No kudos for handgun skills. Training takes over, but, no training, and nothing takes over, as is the instant case.

    Very few cops are good shots, because, for the most part they never practice on their own time and dime. "Hey, I qualified Expert [with the 50 rounds I shoot on the range once a year] and that makes me a handgun expert."

    I am member of three SWAT officers associations, and I assure you, not many know how to hold the semi-auto properly or how to present from holster, or how to re-holster properly. Even worse for reloads...and these are SWAT officers!

    Granted: reloads are rarely needed in gun fights...until they are needed, and five-to-seven seconds to fumble a reload is just not acceptable--especially when trying, at first, to insert the new mag backwards.

    A Sergeant I know on a large, metropolitan agency in Indiana, is a shooting partner of mine, and he has tried repeatedly and repeatedly to get any of his guys to practice with us. So far, over a long period of time, the sum total is zero. When we first started shooting together, his reloads were in the four-to-six second range. Now, he can, with some consistency, do slide-lock reloads in under two seconds, and I am sure, soon, his reloads will all be under two seconds.
     
    Last edited:

    turnandshoot4

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Jan 29, 2008
    8,625
    48
    Kouts
    All good points!

    The most difficult thing here is all of the issues can be corrected for a total sum of $0.

    Reacquiring grip = Free
    Mag changes = Free

    The issue here isn't the money it takes to train, it's the time, as that's all he needed to fix his grip/mag change issues.

    His accuracy eventually won the day, but that costs $$$, at least to get a SIRT pistol.
    His mindset was fantastic and essentially can't be purchased, kudos for sure.
     

    blacknwhite

    Marksman
    Rating - 100%
    4   0   0
    Jan 6, 2016
    201
    18
    southwest
    I know of at least one department which allows their officers to watch videos on policeone for their firearms training, wrap your mind around that one.
     
    Rating - 100%
    17   0   0
    Jan 29, 2013
    1,123
    48
    Mars Hill
    Come on man. Bad choices are bad choices. Mastered skill is mastered skill.

    Are you saying the cop made bad choices or the murders shooting at him?

    Question to anyone, what's a proper grip look like while steering a moving vehicle?

    I think overall that officer did a hell of a job and a jacked up tac reload on an empty gun does nothing to change a professional, ballsy and effect pursuit and gun fight.
     

    jlw

    Plinker
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Mar 30, 2018
    127
    28
    Georgia
    I gave him an A for effort with a D- on execution due to the grip and reload, and yes, I deal with actual bad guys.
     

    Ziggidy

    Grandmaster
    Rating - 100%
    2   0   0
    May 7, 2018
    7,270
    113
    Ziggidyville
    Each situation is a learning experience with a learning opportunity. Anyone who has ever been in a critical life/death situation knows that textbook is a guideline that is manipulated to accommodate the current situation.

    Again, every situation is a learning experience with a learning opportunity.

    Critique is good, criticism is bad....
     

    Coach

    Grandmaster
    Emeritus
    Trainer Supporter
    Local Business Supporter
    Rating - 100%
    3   0   0
    Apr 15, 2008
    13,411
    48
    Coatesville
    I like the officers driving, coolness under fire, efforts and the balls the size of grapefruits that he displayed. He was following the policy that was read to the letter and he got the job done. There is no arguing with results. He got the results. My hat is off to him and those assisting him.

    I like his SHO grip on the pistol. The two hand grip is bad, and I would speculate that he is defaulting to his level of training there. He drives, operates the radio and handles stress well. I would guess he has done all of those things much more than he shoots. Many cops go a career without having to fire a shot, but some have to fire a shot. Shooting well is part of the job. More time and effort needs to be there. If there was more time and effort on that the grip and the reload would have been better.

    How many of you have fired from a vehicle? Moving vehicle? How many practice WHO and SHO from the vehicle?

    Sometimes I park the truck in the bay and shoot from the vehicle because I don't want the first time I do it to be under fire. Going to the range tomorrow and I am doing it tomorrow.

    I have not shot from a moving vehicle that I was driving since my folks sold the farm, but I have done it and done it safely. Why would every cop not have practice shooting from a moving vehicle. It can happen for them.
     

    Randy Harris

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 22, 2012
    248
    28
    I gave him an A for effort with a D- on execution due to the grip and reload, and yes, I deal with actual bad guys.

    Yeah the weak hand thumb is lucky to not have been "railroad tracked" by the slide reciprocating and the switching the gun to his weak hand to reload it is well...less than optimal... But "all's well that ends well " ....on the other hand "fortuitous outcomes reinforce bad habits".....
     

    Randy Harris

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Oct 22, 2012
    248
    28
    Question to anyone, what's a proper grip look like while steering a moving vehicle?

    The 2 handed grip with left thumb over the back of right hand grip is what people are referring to... it is normally a self solving problem the first time the shooter has a chunk taken out of that thumb by the slide coming back they normally stop doing that ever again.... The vehicle moving has nothing to do with the interface between hands and gun when he is standing outside the vehicle shooting that way.
     

    devildog70

    Marksman
    Rating - 0%
    0   0   0
    Jul 9, 2011
    168
    28
    Look at his grip. Now look at a revolver grip. Look at his hand placement during the reload. Now look at hand placement during a revolver reload. Look at the stripes on his arm. Not saying the guy was absolutely not a soup sandwich, but it is entirely possible this was a guy trained on revolvers reverting back to said training.

    Learning to shoot in a vehicle is best not done the first time with a badguy throwing real bullets at you.
     

    churchmouse

    I still care....Really
    Emeritus
    Rating - 100%
    187   0   0
    Dec 7, 2011
    191,809
    152
    Speedway area
    Just watched. I can only imagine the level of stress he was under.He waited....closed on a less traveled street and fired on the bad guys. They had shown no respect for anyone in that chase. He ended it as it should have been regardless of his grip. The mag change was sketchy but still......I would like to know what his heart rate was. He then advanced on the SUV. Balls people. Large male balls.
     
    Top Bottom