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  1. #11
    Grandmaster Coach's Avatar

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    I liked the article a lot. I think the author was spot on regarding many things. You could hear the voice of experience talking in that article and experience sounds just like wisdom. I do not own a laser at all, but I am not against them. I think the ability to put a visible dot on someone's chest to communicate very clearly is a valuable thing. Anyone we can avoid shooting is a victory. Dot on someone's chest cuts through a lot of communication barriers. If the laser speaks clearly the hollow points may have the option of remaining silent.
    No one is stronger or more dangerous than the man who can harness his emotions.

    www.BrightFirearmsTraining.com

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  2. #12
    Hop
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    A better idea imo would be a 12 o'clock RDS and a 6 o'clock laser of a contrasting color that is NOT a dot but a line.

    Using Tapatalk to annoy my INGO buddies cameramonkey & churchmouse. Hi!

    Revere's Riders Instructor - Scored both Master Rifle KD, Master Pistol

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  3. #13
    Ark
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    Sharpshooter Ark's Avatar

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    Hardware solution to a software problem.

  4. #14
    Hop
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    Stage 6 @ Hearbreak run-n-gun last February...
    After making an off hand 100 yard hit at position 1, run to position 2. Put 10 rounds into a small bullseye at close range. The stage went on from there but as I started pumping rounds into that little bullseye as fast as I could, I started seeing the hits & they were landing low because I held LOW! Stupid me got it backwards. Stress, high heart rate, fatigue all lead to doing things wrong sometimes. At least I could see some hits and pulled the last several up into the black. Sure didn't help my score at all.

    One of these days, scopes will be smart enough to auto-range the target and adjust the reticle for you.

    Revere's Riders Instructor - Scored both Master Rifle KD, Master Pistol

    NRA Pistol instructor | NRA Rifle instructor | NRA RSO
    Classes and info here: https://www.reveresriders.org/

  5. #15
    Grandmaster patience0830's Avatar

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    Neat idea. My only beef is that it needs 2, count 'em, 2 sets of batteries that can crap out on you at any time.

    Bet my life gun has a tritium front sight cowitnessed with an aimpoint 9000L. If the dot dies, I can still see the post through the tube.
    Just call me lollipop.

  6. #16
    Marksman Trapper Jim's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by cosermann View Post
    I debated where to put this, but since it's about how setup will affect carbine use, "pre-tactics" if you will, I decided to put it here. Came across this article today which, near the end (Using Lasers and Optics section), seems to have a genius solution to the issue of hold-over with the AR platform.

    https://www.policemag.com/517091/the...laser-sighting

    In short, red dot mounted at 12 o'clock and laser mounted at 6 o'clock are both zeroed at 50 yds.

    Both dots can be seen through the optic to converge at 50 yards.

    At distances less than 50 yards, the point of impact is half-way between the dots as viewed through the optic.

    Seems like a nifty idea. Has anyone tried a setup like this?
    Seems like a solution to a non existant use. So I understand we want a zero of offensive distances on our carbine but want it to be a defensive CQB firearm for inside the house or parking lot? Just askin
    "See you on the Range"

  7. #17
    I still care....Really
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trapper Jim View Post
    Seems like a solution to a non existant use. So I understand we want a zero of offensive distances on our carbine but want it to be a defensive CQB firearm for inside the house or parking lot? Just askin
    Thats my confusion. My HD AR's are sited at 25 yards. Across the back yard. Any farther and it would be me in a jamb if I used them and even at 25 it would be rough.
    Laser are green and red dot optics. At that distance in a defensive situation a man size target is not difficult to site.

    I see the issue out at 50 and even mine at 25 I see the POA change closer in.
    AKA..Thor. Odin son. God of thunder.
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  8. #18
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    I am not sure where the crowd that say this problem does not exist are coming from?

    People shooting low because of not holding over properly is almost cliche. I am not even a long gun guy but see it all the time. I just set up a stage last weekend with this trap in in for a Grand Master PCC shooter. I got him. Close range AR users are a dime a dozen and this is a thing.
    No one is stronger or more dangerous than the man who can harness his emotions.

    www.BrightFirearmsTraining.com

    abright@ccrtc.com


  9. #19
    Somewhat Purple-ish rhino's Avatar

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    Quite a few years ago I proposed an aid for confirming alignment of ARs at close distances. My idea was to mount a laser on each side of the barrel (back then, from the front sight tower) at the same height as the bore line. When shooting at less then 20 yards or so, the shooter would see the two lasers and know that the bullet would impact at the same elevation and more or less in between the two dots. It was simple and would work well, but no one seemed interested. With cheap lasers and rails on the sides of fore ends, it would be easy to try.

    A simpler solution is to use an EOTech for your primary sighting device. The lower tick on the 65 MOA circle works well as an aiming point for close distances. I have EOTechs, so there was no need to pursue my dual laser idea.

    Those who think this isn't an issue haven't seen enough people shooting targets with ARs at close ranges under any kind of stress. It doesn't matter at what distance you zero your optic or iron sights. The need for holdover at close distances is due to the physical offset between the bore line and the line of sight on an AR. If you use a rifle that has sights sitting on the barrel, then it's obviously not an issue for you. People who shoot M1s, M1 Carbines, FALs, 10-22s with iron sights don't have to worry about it. People who shoot AKs probably don't have to worry as much as AR shooters (sights closer to the bore). This is another reason why red dots mounted on top of carry handles was a less than stellar idea. It greatly exacerbated the need to holdover at close distances both in magnitude and the distances at which it was necessary.
    Last edited by rhino; 07-20-2019 at 00:30.



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  10. #20
    Grandmaster Coach's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by rhino View Post
    Quite a few years ago I proposed an aid for confirming alignment of ARs at close distances. My idea was to mount a laser on each side of the barrel (back then, from the front sight tower) at the same height as the bore line. When shooting at less then 20 yards or so, the shooter would see the two lasers and know that the bullet would impact at the same elevation and more or less in between the two dots. It was simple and would work well, but no one seemed interested. With cheap lasers and rails on the sides of fore ends, it would be easy to try.

    A simpler solution is to use an EOTech for your primary sighting device. The lower tick on the 65 MOA circle works well as an aiming point for close distances. I have EOTechs, so there was no need to pursue my dual laser idea.
    This does not seem like a solution from an engineer.
    No one is stronger or more dangerous than the man who can harness his emotions.

    www.BrightFirearmsTraining.com

    abright@ccrtc.com


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