Heroin deaths surpass gun homicides

[gregr]

You'd probably have fewer deaths if you legalized it.

Uhhh....NO! We`ve been touched personally, and closely by this plague, and no, legalization wouldn`t help this epidemic to be less of a scourge upon humanity and society. The ONLY way to effectively stop this sad, sad loss of life is to turn people back to both Biblical principles, but more importantly to our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. If we followed His commandments, and lived our lives according to the precepts of the Bible, there would be, virtually no crime or needless death.

 

[Dean C.]

This is about what an OD looks like apparently, I recently had the opportunity to talk with someone is involved in trying to clean up the drug epidemic currently plaguing Southern Indiana right now. We need needle exchange programs at the very least to help curb this explosive growth in the number of confirmed HIV cases in the State. The Surgeon General in one of his latest reports even said that addictions need to be treated as a mental disorder it is time we do that. If it becomes more acceptable for people to admit they have a problem hopefully more people will get help. Now this is just my two cents but if we legalized drugs like this then at least the commercially available products would be chemically pure thus making it less likely that people would OD because it would not be cut with Fentanyl

 

[gregr]

This is about what an OD looks like apparently, I recently had the opportunity to talk with someone is involved in trying to clean up the drug epidemic currently plaguing Southern Indiana right now. We need needle exchange programs at the very least to help curb this explosive growth in the number of confirmed HIV cases in the State. The Surgeon General in one of his latest reports even said that addictions need to be treated as a mental disorder it is time we do that. If it becomes more acceptable for people to admit they have a problem hopefully more people will get help. Now this is just my two cents but if we legalized drugs like this then at least the commercially available products would be chemically pure thus making it less likely that people would OD because it would not be cut with Fentanyl

I couldn`t disagree more with the needle exchange programs. Why in the world would government, i.e., society, provide criminals with the tools of the trade?

 

[Dean C.]

I couldn`t disagree more with the needle exchange programs. Why in the world would government, i.e., society, provide criminals with the tools of the trade?

Because needles are cheap and HIV medication (paid for by Medicare or whatever) is expensive. Simple cost benefit analysis

 

[phylodog]

Free needles, free treatment for a "mental disorder", free clothing, free food, free housing, free cell phones. Why do I bother to work? Why does anyone? I could sit home, get stoned all day and play video games and there are apparently millions of people out there tripping over each other to provide everything I could ever need. I must be a ****in idiot.

 

[Brad69]

I hate to say it but if we legalize, tax and regulate would that be the answer?
It would eliminate a underground criminal industry overnight. I say let Bernie Sanders come up with a plan he is good at this kinda stuff. It can't be worse than what we have now.

 

[Dean C.]

Free needles, free treatment for a "mental disorder", free clothing, free food, free housing, free cell phones. Why do I bother to work? Why does anyone? I could sit home, get stoned all day and play video games and there are apparently millions of people out there tripping over each other to provide everything I could ever need. I must be a ****in idiot.

I mean we coukd keep putting druggies in prison for around $30,000 a year, then they really will get free food, clothing and health care.

 

[phylodog]

I mean we coukd keep putting druggies in prison for around $30,000 a year, then they really will get free food, clothing and health care.

I didn't speak against legalization. I'm not in favor of all of the "free" **** provided to those who decide to live a life full of bad decisions. Why do I continuously have to pay the consequences for the **** decisions of others?

Legalize all of it for all I care. Bring back debtor's prison while you're at it. If someone wants to flush their life down the ****ter with heroin then ask for treatment? Fine. Once you're all better you can work off the cost of your treatment in a labor camp. Plenty of road work and other infrastructure needs to be rebuilt.

 

[Route 45]

Uhhh....NO! We`ve been touched personally, and closely by this plague, and no, legalization wouldn`t help this epidemic to be less of a scourge upon humanity and society. The ONLY way to effectively stop this sad, sad loss of life is to turn people back to both Biblical principles, but more importantly to our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. If we followed His commandments, and lived our lives according to the precepts of the Bible, there would be, virtually no crime or needless death.

You may be on to something. In Iran, the religious police routinely execute drug users and drug dealers, in addition to enforcing strict compliance with all religious beliefs. They have a much lower rate of drug related crime and suffering compared to us. I'm not sure the we can do a Jesus-based police force here in the US, though. He always has seemed kind of wishy-washy to me, with all of his "turn the other cheek" and "judge not, lest ye be judged" talk. We might have to adopt that Mohammed guy's way of thinking. He seems to be much more of a "get 'er done" type of leader.

 

[Denny347]

Heroin is on the way out. A kg of it costs about $60k. A kg of Fentanyl costs about $6k. Coming from China and Mexico, we see it taking over...also responsible for the OD's. The "war" is unwinnable as long as the WANT exists. If there is demand, supply will always be there. It is naive to think we can arrest our way out of this. Many, if not most, addicts have underlying reasons that lead to addictions. Why can 2 people take the same drug and one has no lasting addiction but the other does? Much like alcohol, alcoholics. One would be surprised in how many social users of heroin and cocaine there are in the world with no lasting effects. Not saying it's right, not at all. But what I am saying is that we are focusing on the wrong end of this disaster. How is arresting an addict for a BS possession or paraphernalia charge help them? They spend 12hrs in jail at taxpayers expense then a dozen court appearances before trial date...again, we are paying for it. Told to not use anymore, small amount of drug counseling, and off they go. Most doomed to same cycle. What many do not understand is the powerful pull opiates have on the person's brain. It alters it heavily. I've met few addicts that wanted to be addicts. But the addiction is stronger than the will... that is the true myth with opioids, that willpower will get you through (for most). That is why becoming an opioid addict is a death sentence for most. But does it have to be? There was a study in Canada where the city allowed Dr to prescribe a maintenance dose of heroin to the addict, just enough to satisfy the brain but still allowed them to function. They were able to keep their jobs, remain productive, while seeking intensive therapy to find the root cause of their addiction. During this long process, the dose of heroin was slowly decreased. Over time, the brain became accustomed to the lower dose and eventually the addict was able to free themselves of the addiction. It worked very well. Until the program was cancelled. The addicts in the program found themselves back in the destructive addict cycle. However, this is too "outside the box" for most in the US. This approach is seen by many as "too soft" on crime. This archaic mindset is how we ended up where we are now. By the way, we shall also thank the drug companies who developed/sold Oxy and the like for our current level of addicts. They sold their drugs with the caveat that they were non addictive, lied to doctors and the public. Causing an over prescription, leading to many addictions.
Maybe I'm just an old softy. I'm in my 19th year of wearing a badge and anymore I have a hard time seeing addicts as worthless. I arrive to an OD and I see a brother/sister, mother/father, son/daughter, aunt/uncle, wife/husband. All of which have stories to tell. They all had lives before they were addicts. They all had something to say, something to add to this world. All before their lives veered off course. They lie there, ODing, and the world would rather they die, be tossed away like garbage. I talk to the families and see through the addiction. It makes me sad. Addiction has hit VERY close to me, my family, and many of my friends. Many responses here make me feel as bad for the posters as I do for the addicts.

 

[Fargo]

This is about what an OD looks like apparently, I recently had the opportunity to talk with someone is involved in trying to clean up the drug epidemic currently plaguing Southern Indiana right now. We need needle exchange programs at the very least to help curb this explosive growth in the number of confirmed HIV cases in the State. The Surgeon General in one of his latest reports even said that addictions need to be treated as a mental disorder it is time we do that. If it becomes more acceptable for people to admit they have a problem hopefully more people will get help. Now this is just my two cents but if we legalized drugs like this then at least the commercially available products would be chemically pure thus making it less likely that people would OD because it would not be cut with Fentanyl

I deal with opiate addicts and people with mental disorders on a weekly basis. They are NOT the same. The person with a mental disorder has a difficulty perceiving reality or regulating emotions. The opiate addict is incapable of feeling pleasure, and in fact experiences excruciating pain, unless those receptors are being fed.

When a person with a mental disorder kills themself, it is usually related to distorted perception and despair. OD's generally have decided that escaping withdrawal pains is priority #1 and will actually be angry if you narcan them into withdrawal. Life is a distant #2.

Needle exchanges are a copout which encourages bad behavior IMO and are marginally effective in curbing HIV. You can't fix an epidemic of people who no longer care about living by encouraging their habit.

Needle exchanges make exactly as much sense as providing medically pure heroin to avoid hot batching.

 

[Denny347]

You may be on to something. In Iran, the religious police routinely execute drug users and drug dealers, in addition to enforcing strict compliance with all religious beliefs. They have a much lower rate of drug related crime and suffering compared to us. I'm not sure the we can do a Jesus-based police force here in the US, though. He always has seemed kind of wishy-washy to me, with all of his "turn the other cheek" and "judge not, lest ye be judged" talk. We might have to adopt that Mohammed guy's way of thinking. He seems to be much more of a "get 'er done" type of leader.

 

[Fargo]

Heroin is on the way out. A kg of it costs about $60k. A kg of Fentanyl costs about $6k. Coming from China and Mexico, we see it taking over...also responsible for the OD's. The "war" is unwinnable as long as the WANT exists. If there is demand, supply will always be there. It is naive to think we can arrest our way out of this. Many, if not most, addicts have underlying reasons that lead to addictions. Why can 2 people take the same drug and one has no lasting addiction but the other does? Much like alcohol, alcoholics. One would be surprised in how many social users of heroin and cocaine there are in the world with no lasting effects. Not saying it's right, not at all. But what I am saying is that we are focusing on the wrong end of this disaster. How is arresting an addict for a BS possession or paraphernalia charge help them? They spend 12hrs in jail at taxpayers expense then a dozen court appearances before trial date...again, we are paying for it. Told to not use anymore, small amount of drug counseling, and off they go. Most doomed to same cycle. What many do not understand is the powerful pull opiates have on the person's brain. It alters it heavily. I've met few addicts that wanted to be addicts. But the addiction is stronger than the will... that is the true myth with opioids, that willpower will get you through (for most). That is why becoming an opioid addict is a death sentence for most. But does it have to be? There was a study in Canada where the city allowed Dr to prescribe a maintenance dose of heroin to the addict, just enough to satisfy the brain but still allowed them to function. They were able to keep their jobs, remain productive, while seeking intensive therapy to find the root cause of their addiction. During this long process, the dose of heroin was slowly decreased. Over time, the brain became accustomed to the lower dose and eventually the addict was able to free themselves of the addiction. It worked very well. Until the program was cancelled. The addicts in the program found themselves back in the destructive addict cycle. However, this is too "outside the box" for most in the US. This approach is seen by many as "too soft" on crime. This archaic mindset is how we ended up where we are now. By the way, we shall also thank the drug companies who developed/sold Oxy and the like for our current level of addicts. They sold their drugs with the caveat that they were non addictive, lied to doctors and the public. Causing an over prescription, leading to many addictions.
Maybe I'm just an old softy. I'm in my 19th year of wearing a badge and anymore I have a hard time seeing addicts as worthless. I arrive to an OD and I see a brother/sister, mother/father, son/daughter, aunt/uncle, wife/husband. All of which have stories to tell. They all had lives before they were addicts. They all had something to say, something to add to this world. All before their lives veered off course. They lie there, ODing, and the world would rather they die, be tossed away like garbage. I talk to the families and see through the addiction. It makes me sad. Addiction has hit VERY close to me, my family, and many of my friends. Many responses here make me feel as bad for the posters as I do for the addicts.

The US "war on drugs" has in my opinion never really been about fixing or controlling addiction, but is much more about societal control particularly in regards to the blacks and hippies. It is weird that there wasn't calls for lifesaving measures like Narcan when crack was ripping its way through the inner cities....

Opiate addiction only became a disease when it hit the suburbs via the doctors office.

 

[Leadeye]

There are times when I figure it would be better to crucify a drug dealer every 50 yards on I-69 between Indy and Chicago to put an end to this problem.

 

[2A_Tom]

Originally posted by Leadeye, I am a drug dealer. (Spaticus)

 

[bwframe]

Maybe we'll just build a wall?

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I think that was supposed to be in purple...I hope it was, anyway.

 

[hoosierdoc]

"Treatment" is laughable. My guy today was in treatment three times a week and a court run drug testing program. They use while inpatient. They use when they get out. Without rock bottom and finally getting tired of it they will use until they die. They want heroin, not treatment for heroin

 

[Denny347]

The US "war on drugs" has in my opinion never really been about fixing or controlling addiction, but is much more about societal control particularly in regards to the blacks and hippies. It is weird that there wasn't calls for lifesaving measures like Narcan when crack was ripping its way through the inner cities....

Opiate addiction only became a disease when it hit the suburbs via the doctors office.

Maybe, all the more reason to end it now. While a back history of opioid addiction is good to know, we are here now and what are we prepared to do about it?

 

[Denny347]

I think that was supposed to be in purple...I hope it was, anyway.

I hope you are right.