To Mask or Not to Mask?

[jamil]

Does this mean that after Monday were everyone will be wearing masks, the Covid-19 rate will go do zero within one week?

It should mean that everything that's still closed should reopen Monday morning given that there's now a magical shield mandated protecting society.

 

[jamil]

Didn't they release a bunch of prisoners, instead of giving them masks?

I know a lot of states did. I'm not sure they did that in Indiana. Maybe some counties did that.

 

[CindyE]

guess i will be even more of an introvert. this is insane. i will go to work and go home. order as much stuff as i can online, and only go to stores when i absolutely have to. this sucks. it's been a horrible year in so many ways, and now this. F'n POS Holcomb

 

[BadWolf5150]

I agree 100% CindyE

 

[mike8170]

guess i will be even more of an introvert. this is insane. i will go to work and go home. order as much stuff as i can online, and only go to stores when i absolutely have to. this sucks. it's been a horrible year in so many ways, and now this. F'n POS Holcomb

That is why Bezos net worth grew another 13 Billion. I am doing the same thing.

 

[Hookeye]

I have never bought anything off Amazon.
And wont

 

[STAGE 2]

I left california precisely so that I wouldn’t have to deal with this stuff. Executive fiat is exactly what this country was founded to oppose. Sad day for liberty.

 

[jamil]

Who is the liberaltarian candidate for governor? It's really really sad that we don't have his name on the tip of our tongues. Part of the reason we are screwed.

I used to think I was libertarian. Then it became apparent that they are just a bunch of stoner hypocrites whose only job is to ***** about everyone else without accountability of ever thinking they might actually win an election.

...........................................

This IS a huge oportunity for that crazy-assed party though. Let's start hearing about the libertarian is who could actually be our next governor?

As much as I despise them, I despise Holcomb more. Maybe...

Not all of them are stoner hypocrites. But enough of them are that it's something to consider. Also, if I were to despise anyone, it would be individually, and even then, not just because of what they believe, but what they do. Not every libertarian deserves your hatred. But some do. Gary (feel my) Johnson, for example. That guy is a first class progressive douchebag worthy of anyone's disgust. It's fair to call him a stoner too.

 

[Hookeye]

Fwiw i see just as many people on cell phones driving around as I did before the law took effect.

Those geniuses wearing a mask out in public......
Yeah whatever

 

[PaulF]

6 months in jail for not wearing a ****ing mask?

Okay. You guys who are pro-mask. You feel it's justified? How confident are you that the science is solid enough to justify ****ing jail time?

Is a mandate justified? Yes, I think it is - especially in the major population centers that cross county lines. The cities and the suburbs have a petri-dish quality, and these are the only tools we have.

Is six months in jail appropriate for violating the mandate? I think not. I think a citation or summons is the appropriate enforcement mechanism, and a small fine (payable through community service) is an appropriate consequence.

 

[jamil]

guess i will be even more of an introvert. this is insane. i will go to work and go home. order as much stuff as i can online, and only go to stores when i absolutely have to. this sucks. it's been a horrible year in so many ways, and now this. F'n POS Holcomb

If it's gonna be that, the shutdown might as well have continued. I'm pissed about it too, but I'm still gonna go about my business.

Class B misdemeanor. I still can't get over that. Assholcomb hinted that it would not be rigorously enforced. But he still made it a class B misdemeanor for a reason. I think it's that if someone just flat out refuses to wear one, intermediate jail time is on the table. Why put it at that level otherwise?

 

[BadWolf5150]

If it's gonna be that, the shutdown might as well have continued. I'm pissed about it too, but I'm still gonna go about my business.

Class B misdemeanor. I still can't get over that. Assholcomb hinted that it would not be rigorously enforced. But he still made it a class B misdemeanor for a reason. I think it's that if someone just flat out refuses to wear one, intermediate jail time is on the table. Why put it at that level otherwise?

How can it be a misdemeanor Since when did the governor get the right to make laws?

 

[Expat]

Stupid laws like this is the reason Eric Garner was killed. There they passed an ordinance against selling loose cigarettes and told the police to make enforcement a priority and they did. Mr. Garner did not want to comply and ended up dead.

 

[Studio 417]

.

 

[jamil]

Is a mandate justified? Yes, I think it is - especially in the major population centers that cross county lines. The cities and the suburbs have a petri-dish quality, and these are the only tools we have.

Is six months in jail appropriate for violating the mandate? I think not. I think a citation or summons is the appropriate enforcement mechanism, and a small fine (payable through community service) is an appropriate consequence.

I'll have to disagree. We don't know to what extent masks help. I don't think they're as effective as social distancing. You might say, well, we can't really enforce social distancing, and I agree, that's hard. But we don't know how effective an alternative to social distancing a mask is. And to many people's point in the mask threads, there's no standards for these cloth masks. Even the few studies that have looked at cloth masks, it doesn't say anything about all cloth masks. Just the samples they had. Without standards, mandatory masks is just checking a box. Tell me how much it's going to help to justify even a citation, or summons. That mother****er could have even made it a class C. But no. ****ing class B. That's insane.

 

[jamil]

Stupid laws like this is the reason Eric Garner was killed. There they passed an ordinance against selling loose cigarettes and told the police to make enforcement a priority and they did. Mr. Garner did not want to comply and ended up dead.

I wonder what will happen when an unarmed black man resists arrest for not wearing a mask and is killed while resisting. I think there's a two-button meme in there somewhere for Karen to chew on.

 

[jamil]

How can it be a misdemeanor Since when did the governor get the right to make laws?

It looks to me like the state constitution gives the governor pretty broad powers for things like this. I think this situation warrants changing it to neuter those powers. Ain't gonna happen though.

 

[PaulF]

If it's gonna be that, the shutdown might as well have continued. I'm pissed about it too, but I'm still gonna go about my business.

Class B misdemeanor. I still can't get over that. Assholcomb hinted that it would not be rigorously enforced. But he still made it a class B misdemeanor for a reason. I think it's that if someone just flat out refuses to wear one, intermediate jail time is on the table. Why put it at that level otherwise?

There's plague on the loose. The easiest way to avoid it is to stay away from people that have it. We cannot tell who has it at a glance, so staying away from all others in public makes sense. Where close contact is unavoidable masking up and washing up are really the only tools available to us, doing so makes sense.

The shutdown was a terrible idea, it introduced too great a level of economic instability without a reasonable mitigating strategy to keep money, goods, and services flowing in the following disruption. However, ignoring the threat posed by an uncontrolled pathogen entirely isn't a workable strategy either.

Covid shows...or should show us...how vulnerable we are to a bad bug getting loose. There are worse ones than this. Working shoulder to shoulder and gathering in large groups creates a breeding ground for these things, so it makes good sense to develop alternative ways to socialize. Our old normal is inherently risky from a public health standpoint, and we should consider that carefully when considering what out new normal should look like.

 

[dusty88]

6 months in jail for not wearing a ****ing mask?

Okay. You guys who are pro-mask. You feel it's justified? How confident are you that the science is solid enough to justify ****ing jail time?

I don't like it as a mandate. I also really don't think it does much to add to the effect, when you already had most retailers adding a mask policy and when you already required restaurant workers to wear masks.

I thought the original idea a couple of weeks ago to encourage it was the way to go.

I do have a bit of sympathy for the situation if I were the governor and the scientist came to me and said that we either need to increase masking, close more businesses, close schools, or we are going to see more deaths. He's given emergency powers to deal with things like this and I would not want to be in his shoes. Or at least I'd want to see where the cases went after a mask mandate before I went backwards with closures, like other states have

I'm sure I'll vote libertarian again though. For those who ask the governor candidate is Donald Rainwater

As far as my overall feeling about masks, no one sums it up better than Michael Osterholm does. We don't have hard science yet and we especially don't have hard science on which cloth masks to recommend. We should wear them voluntarily in my opinion. But the CDC claiming that masks alone will drive this epidemic into the ground seems like a statement without enough evidence. Anyway Osterholm says it better and he's certainly more qualified than I am to say it

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-per...oth-face-coverings-public-preventing-covid-19

 

[PaulF]

I'll have to disagree. We don't know to what extent masks help. I don't think they're as effective as social distancing. You might say, well, we can't really enforce social distancing, and I agree, that's hard. But we don't know how effective an alternative to social distancing a mask is. And to many people's point in the mask threads, there's no standards for these cloth masks. Even the few studies that have looked at cloth masks, it doesn't say anything about all cloth masks. Just the samples they had. Without standards, mandatory masks is just checking a box. Tell me how much it's going to help to justify even a citation, or summons. That mother****er could have even made it a class C. But no. ****ing class B. That's insane.

Those cloth masks are like carrying a hi-point with a .22LR conversion...yeah, it *might* help when the time comes, but deep down you know it's really only for theatric effect.

I'm pro self-protection. A medical-quality disposable paper mask, or an industrial n95-type mask - used once and disposed of - is the best protection I have short of distance from the infected. You won't see me with a tee-shirt wrapped loosely around my face, or putting the same mask on over and over again. I have always been a compulsive hand-washer. My job allows for reasonable personal distance without much of an adjustment, so I have had to make only minor adjustments at work. I think it is only reasonable to take these precautions.

More importantly, you aren't likely to see me at all in public at all. The *best* defense I have is to stay away from people who might be sick, so I stay home as much as possible.

To get back to my earlier analogy...the Hi-Point is the only option we have...so, knowing that, I'm trying to do my best to avoid the fight altogether.